http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/28/politics/trump-jfk-files-full-release/index.html

 

Being a Texan that remembers LBJ I wouldn't put anything past him but if there was to be a hit on JFK, IMO it damn sure would not have been in the state of Texas.

On the contrary, having a vast network of connections in Texas only made it that much more convenient to organize and implement their plot - on "home turf", as it were. For example, consider the interesting little fact that fellow 8F member D.H. Byrd just so happened to own the Texas School Book Depository. Coincidence? Maybe Oswald chose that job (almost two months before the motorcade route was published) simply because he had a "hunch" it would pass by there. Sure, it's plausible...just not very likely.

More on Oswald, from Wikipedia:

New Orleans District Attorney (and later judge) Jim Garrison, who in 1967 brought Clay Shaw to trial for the assassination of President Kennedy also held the opinion that Oswald was most likely a CIA agent who had been drawn into the plot to be used as a scapegoat, even going as far as to say that Oswald "genuinely was probably a hero". Senator Richard Schweiker, a member of the U.S. Senate Select Committee on Intelligence remarked that "everywhere you look with [Oswald], there're fingerprints of intelligence". Richard Sprague, interim staff director and chief counsel to the U.S. House Select Committee on Assassinations, stated that if he "had to do it over again" would have investigated the Kennedy assassination by probing Oswald's ties to the Central Intelligence Agency. In 1978, former CIA paymaster and accountant James Wilcott testified before the HSCA, stating that Lee Harvey Oswald was a "known agent" of the Central Intelligence Agency. Wilcott and his wife, Elsie (also a former employee of the CIA) later repeated those claims in a story by the San Francisco Chronicle.

Edit: paired down (link to full text included).
​

 

On the contrary, having a vast network of connections in Texas only made it that much more convenient to organize and implement their plot - on "home turf", as it were.

Dude, you have no idea of the Texas mentality and the bucket loads of crap dumped on Texas, Dallas (The City of Hate) because of this shooting.

 

Dude, you have no idea of the Texas mentality and the bucket loads of crap dumped on Texas, Dallas (The City of Hate) because of this shooting.

Do you have any clue how much was on the line here? Huge gains and losses. I seriously doubt that the impact on Dallas' image would have made any difference to these men.

 

Do you have any clue how much was on the line here? Huge gains and losses. I seriously doubt that the impact on Dallas' image would have made any difference to these men.

Moot point because there is exactly zero actual evidence of LBJ being involved.

 

Moot point because there is exactly zero actual evidence of LBJ being involved.

Even without his involvement, would knowing the Vice President be more or less valuable than knowing the president? It could be done behind the scenes without any input of LBJ.

 

Even without his involvement, would knowing the Vice President be more or less valuable than knowing the president? It could be done behind the scenes without any input of LBJ.

What could be done? There is zero evidence of a conspiracy within the US government to kill JFK but there is that uneasy feeling that the President was killed by a nut with a gun too easily after the fact. The need for some deep meaning of his death drives some people but some are just crackpots and others are just out to make a buck on the event.

 

What could be done? There is zero evidence of a conspiracy within the US government to kill JFK but there is that uneasy feeling that the President was killed by a nut with a gun too easily after the fact. The need for some deep meaning of his death drives some people but some are just crackpots and others are just out to make a buck on the event.

Again, the people from TEXAS that knew LBJ were not part of the US government. Interesting how you keep changing the question. What are YOU hiding?

 

Oswald's wife testified that the target was the Governor, not JFK.

Oswald had a beef with the governor.

Then again, it's rumored that Oswald had a hit list in his green memo book. The page is rumored to be missing from the book and JEH is rumored to have removed it.

So, if I were to believe that ... I would have to believe Oswald was such a poor shot he missed the Governor and shot the wrong man. Did Oswald test his weapon to ensure it was sited in properly. Who knows. Gun owners I know, have tested their weapons.

Release all the information to put this bull$hit to rest.

 

Again, the people from TEXAS that knew LBJ were not part of the US government. Interesting how you keep changing the question. What are YOU hiding?

There is no evidence that anyone besides Oswald did it or was involved in it.

 

Oswald's wife testified that the target was the Governor, not JFK.

Oswald had a beef with the governor.

Then again, it's rumored that Oswald had a hit list in his green memo book. The page is rumored to be missing from the book and JEH is rumored to have removed it.

So, if I were to believe that ... I would have to believe Oswald was such a poor shot he missed the Governor and shot the wrong man. Did Oswald test his weapon to ensure it was sited in properly. Who knows. Gun owners I know, have tested their weapons.

Release all the information to put this bull$hit to rest.

It was a $19.95 rifle he ordered from a catalog. Actually, the rifle was $12.95 Italian war surplus. The scope was $7 (including mounting to rifle).

 

It was a $19.95 rifle he ordered from a catalog. Actually, the rifle was $12.95 Italian war surplus. The scope was $7 (including mounting to rifle).

That does not answer whether or not he sited it. I did see where someone else testified where the bullets went at 100yards when someone else shot the weapon.

What does the price have to do with whether or not it was sited in?

 

That does not answer whether or not he sited it. I did see where someone else testified where the bullets went at 100yards when someone else shot the weapon.

What does the price have to do with whether or not it was sited in?

Why do you think I think it did? I think the key words were Italian war surplus. I found the price interesting and enviable.

 

Why do you think I think it did? I think the key words were Italian war surplus. I found the price interesting and enviable.

Lots of soldiers died from those Italian weapons. The price was normal for someone reselling a pruchased lot of weapons. Government surplus always costs low.

 

Lots of soldiers died from those Italian weapons. The price was normal for someone reselling a pruchased lot of weapons. Government surplus always costs low.

Indeed, Captain obvious.

 

It is a very interesting design and caliber. It's been years but I believe it has gain twist rifling.

 

It is a very interesting design and caliber. It's been years but I believe it has gain twist rifling.

Which has always drew my interest, it should tumble. But, if the twist is within a shorter distance over time down might produce a more than true path acting more like a twisting rocket.

The back end weight of the bullet might at lower velocity might create wobble then may tumble over a distance. But, if twisting and it looks more like a nato round by it's cartridge which is high velocity vs round weight could push it past it's weight and might produce a very volatile round, once it reaches the target could create a strange path if finding little resistance thus the screw type munition and curving into the passenger front seat with velocity. I've seen some of the recreated 3D which is viable evidence that he seemingly used a lower tech weapon, but with all the advantage it could offer. Was he that skilled, in weapon design?

All I know is the evidence I seen of an Accidental shot into the floor of a house my friend chose to show me (embarrassed his Grandfather did it) here in Utah 30.06 is a popular round for hunting, it entered the floor and went through the floor support 2x12 which it then snakes it's way through the floor till it found a resting point in a rock foundation. It was the better part of 20 t0 30 feet. He was laying carpet when he found it, he demonstrated by running hanger through the entry in the floor, it snaked 2, 2x12 boards this bouncing back and forth until it finally exited. That day I realized how much energy these loads can create.

I haven't done the weight of the round 30.06 vs the Italian round Oswald used. But the casing looks much larger in pictures I've seen.



kv

 

With a focus on the alleged shooter being Lee Harvey Oswald and the shots having come from the sixth floor of the book depository I will offer the following. While shooting uphill or downhill does create a slight problem it is not all that difficult to do. Assuming all of the shots were not a greater angle than thirty degrees the effect of uphill or downhill likely would not even figure into the shots and even then the effects would really only come into play at distances greater than 300 yards and if we assume Lee Harvey Oswald pulled the trigger all of the shots were within 100 yards (300 feet).. There was a popular belief that shooting uphill a bullet POI (Point of Impact) would be high on the target and when shooting downhill the POI on the target would be low, both with respect to the POA (Point of Aim). When a bullet leaves a muzzle it immediately is acted upon by gravity and bullets do not rise unless it is because a muzzle is angled upwards. Gravity has the greatest effect on a bullet when its path is level, perpendicular to the earth's surface. When a bullet trajectory is angled up or down gravity has a greater effect on a bullets velocity which has less effect on a bullets path. The end result is a bullet will have a high POI with respect to POA when shooting uphill or downhill and in the case of the Kennedy assassination and the distances involved I doubt the shots were all that difficult. I do question if Oswald ever did actually sight in the rifle or was just plain lucky that thePOI and POA were the same at the distances involved assuming he was the shooter.

Something to keep in mind is Kennedy was a "people person" who enjoyed being out in public. The 6.5 x 52mm Italian (Mannlicher-Carcano) is a formidable round for military use or hunting most North American game. Fitted with even only a 4x scope the rifle and cartridge are devastating and accurate inside 100 yards and well beyond that. While the Kennedy Motorcade was a moving target it certainly can't be compared to taking a shot at a running ten point monster buck at full gallop. A running buck will be around 40 to 45 MPH (70 km/h) and the Kennedy motorcade was traveling much slower than a running deer. So while a moving target, it was not a very fast moving target. Comparing a hunting shot at running game to a slow crawling motorcade is sort of stretching marksmanship skills required to hit a target.

Oswald qualified as a Marine Corps Sharpshooter which while better than a Marksman is still below expert in the three classifications of Marine Corps marksmanship qualification. However, if he applied what the Marine Corps taught him in marksmanship skills I can see him easily making the shots. Anyway, these are just my thoughts on the rifle and the shooter with the probability of making the shots. Gee, all of this and I just got my 2018 range membership notification in the mail.

I see some new post since I began my post. As to what is called "gain twist". "The original 6.5×52mm barrel design, developed by the Brescia Arsenal at the same time as the cartridge before development of the M91 Carcano Rifle itself, used a gain twist barrel with deep rifling to reduce wear, extend barrel life and give consistent accuracy. Gain twist has a slow initial twist in the barrel progressively getting faster until the final twist rate is attained near the muzzle, resulting in less torque being imparted to the bullet during the highest stress phase of the interior ballistic cycle, and thus less barrel wear in the throat of the barrel. Gain twist was phased out in the last production of the Carcano rifle in favor of conventional rifling". That quote from our friends at the WIKI. Something to consider with the 6.5mm bullets is as they get heavier they get longer. The heavier bullets need a faster twist rate for stabilization so eventually they settled on a 1:9 twist rate after the years of gain twist rifling. The M91 Carcano rifle also had deep cut rifling. While I was never a fan of the 6.5 x 52 Carcano cartridge I did have a love affair with the 6.5 x 55mm Swede. The US Rifle of 1903 commonly called the '03 Springfield shooting a .30 caliber bullet weighing about 147 to 150 grains uses a 1:10 twist typically, slightly slower rate of twist than the last M91 Carcano but a higher diameter bullet at 0.308".

Anyway, for the rifle taking the shots required was not all that difficult.

Ron

 

Saw this tonight on AHC, the title was JFK Inside the target car.

Interesting view confirming the Warren Commission's report of the Single gunman.

 

The government's version that Oswald was simply "Just a nut with a gun" does not hold up under critical analysis.

If Oswald was purportedly mentally ill (and he wasn't connected/involved with others in a much larger plot), why does the government have nearly 50,000 pages of documents on the case? And why were those documents concealed from public disclosure for over 50 years?

A police investigation of a murder case involving only one perpetrator and one victim will not have a 50,000 page report so why does the Kennedy assassination have so many intricate (and secrete) details?

That whole incident stinks to high heaven and if the truth were really known, a lot more people should be in a federal penitentiary