Thoughts about uC shortage

ccdi

Joined Jun 3, 2020
3
Maybe since the micros with more memory take up more silicon real estate. If the fabs are running at capacity then it would make sense to produce more chips with less real estate to satisfy more customers. This is of course assuming manufacturers can work with micros that have less memory without too much or any code modifications.
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
13,272
Maybe since the micros with more memory take up more silicon real estate. If the fabs are running at capacity then it would make sense to produce more chips with less real estate to satisfy more customers. This is of course assuming manufacturers can work with micros that have less memory without too much or any code modifications.
That's not how it works when there is little or no slack in inventory. Orders are made according to contracts, orders are filled, money is paid, next order please.
 

MrSalts

Joined Apr 2, 2020
2,767
Maybe since the micros with more memory take up more silicon real estate. If the fabs are running at capacity then it would make sense to produce more chips with less real estate to satisfy more customers. This is of course assuming manufacturers can work with micros that have less memory without too much or any code modifications.
There is a whole qualification process, commitments are made, orders are placed. Any change requires extensive testing and certifications.
In the case of Ford, they are not short on microcontrollers. They are short on glue logic, op amps and Mosfets.
 

ccdi

Joined Jun 3, 2020
3
Even 'common' parts are getting hard to find.
I just tried to order some ULN2803A Darlington arrays from any of the big suppliers.
ZERO stock and not even a "we expect more on (date)..." status!
Had to go on Ebay to get some - hope they're legit.

ETA: They seem to be the real McCoy - whew!
Even 'common' parts are getting hard to find.
I just tried to order some ULN2803A Darlington arrays from any of the big suppliers.
ZERO stock and not even a "we expect more on (date)..." status!
Had to go on Ebay to get some - hope they're legit.

ETA: They seem to be the real McCoy - whew!
My current project had the flexibility to use larger boards. So for the first time in 20 years I did an all through hole design and I was able to find all my design parts! Throwback retro job!
 

ccdi

Joined Jun 3, 2020
3
I've been buying parts and then designing boards. Paying for "digi-reels" in small volumes and double shipping starts to add up but customers don't blink when I quote projects.
Exactly! Before I design a part in I check for inventory, buy the parts while I’m designing them in.
 

shell.albert

Joined Jul 23, 2014
21
I think it's MicroChip's commercial strategy.
If they reduce the larger memory size of low level of ICs production, we have to boost our selected ICs from a lower level to a high level.
 

MrSalts

Joined Apr 2, 2020
2,767
I think it's MicroChip's commercial strategy.
If they reduce the larger memory size of low level of ICs production, we have to boost our selected ICs from a lower level to a high level.
Or, designers will stop putting microcontrollers in each and every device snd use more wires to take full advantage of all the capabilities of each microcontroller. For example, Ford is removing the individual microcontroler used on each lower window to monitor switch, power motor, monitor current draw, and cut out power if an obstruction causes excess current draw. The single microcontroller now monitors all windows, all door lock status and feeds back status to the Main computer for display in the instrument panel. I'm sure microchip isn't loving that four 8-bit micros are replaced by one. The shortage will pay dividends way into the future for them.
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
13,272
Or, designers will stop putting microcontrollers in each and every device snd use more wires to take full advantage of all the capabilities of each microcontroller. For example, Ford is removing the individual microcontroler used on each lower window to monitor switch, power motor, monitor current draw, and cut out power if an obstruction causes excess current draw. The single microcontroller now monitors all windows, all door lock status and feeds back status to the Main computer for display in the instrument panel. I'm sure microchip isn't loving that four 8-bit micros are replaced by one. The shortage will pay dividends way into the future for them.
and it helps locking down systems.
https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a41926249/automakers-locking-aftermarket-tuners-out-of-ecus/
 

MrSalts

Joined Apr 2, 2020
2,767
That has been on the agenda of auto manufacturers since the VW emissions fiasco. The manufacturers have been afraid that a large group of people would retune vehicles with a software change. Their vehicles have no track/trace system of upgrades/updates of software so the OEMs would not be able to clearly prove what was done by the vehicle owner vs the OEM themselves. In essence, the OEMs were afraid the EPA would accuse them of manufacturing non-compliant vehicles.
 

Ian0

Joined Aug 7, 2020
9,814
Or, designers will stop putting microcontrollers in each and every device snd use more wires to take full advantage of all the capabilities of each microcontroller. For example, Ford is removing the individual microcontroler used on each lower window to monitor switch, power motor, monitor current draw, and cut out power if an obstruction causes excess current draw. The single microcontroller now monitors all windows, all door lock status and feeds back status to the Main computer for display in the instrument panel. I'm sure microchip isn't loving that four 8-bit micros are replaced by one. The shortage will pay dividends way into the future for them.
And now the price of copper has gone up, they are having to use more wire!
. . . but at least you can get copper!
 

MrSalts

Joined Apr 2, 2020
2,767
And now the price of copper has gone up, they are having to use more wire!
. . . but at least you can get copper!
the Full price is an incomplete vehicle sitting in a storage lot that requires a team to finish assembly in the lot, drive over to final inspection, wait for a gap in the line, inspect, drive over to shipping/loading lot, wait for a van to shuttle people back to the storage lot to move the next vehicle (ford has 40000 incomplete vehicles as of October). Compared to the cost of the problem, wire or chips are cheap but, as you said, wire is available.
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
13,272
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/oth...5b-factory-won-t-expand-in-oregon/ar-AA15eE8i
Microchip Technology has decided not to build a $5 billion factory in Gresham or anywhere else, eliminating one of Oregon’s best prospects for adding new semiconductor manufacturing jobs.

“They have decided not to expand at all in the U.S. because of … extenuating circumstances with a current partner,” said Monique Claiborne, CEO of Greater Portland Inc., the regional business recruitment organization that had been courting Arizona-based Microchip.
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
13,272
The downturn in semi continues.
https://www.tomshardware.com/news/amd-intel-nvidia-slash-orders-to-tsmc
According to the report, virtually all TSMC clients will experience a downturn and have to cut orders, so TSMC's utilization will decline significantly in Q1 2023. For example, the utilization rate of TSMC's N7-capable lines (7nm, 6nm-class technologies) will decline to around 50% in early 2023. Furthermore, even TSMC's N5/N4-capable lines will be underutilized, though this may not come as a surprise since these are used to make leading-edge products, like Apple's smartphone SoCs, and demand for advanced handsets is usually down in the first half of the year. More alarming is that even N28-capable fabs — which have been fully loaded since the beginning of the chip deficit in early 2021 — will be underutilized.
https://www.webpronews.com/the-chip-shortage-is-now-a-chip-glut/
The Chip Shortage Is Now a Chip Glut
 

MrSalts

Joined Apr 2, 2020
2,767
According to the automotive world, there is still a chip shortage but the most basic of silicon - power MOSFETs, Glue logic, comparitor sand op amps. Ford and their major suppliers tend to use a lot of these chips compared to other OEMs so they are currently suffering more than others. GM and Toyota bought up huge stocks of MOSFETs of all types in 2020. GM and one of their door components vendors and one HVAC vendor figured out which parts could be substituted on each module. Who would have figured the little mosfet was so important to lock/unlock doors and roll down windows or control the AC, mirrors and more. Smart move by GM.
At the last earnings call, Ford told shareholders they will have some trouble getting the non-microcontroller chips until Mid-2023.
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
13,272
https://www.globenewswire.com/news-...ductor-Production-at-its-Oregon-Facility.html
Microchip Reaches Milestone in $800 Million, Multi-Year Initiative Aiming to Triple Semiconductor Production at its Oregon Facility
Microchip has added 300 new employees to its Gresham facility so far, with plans to hire as many as 300 more over the next few years. The company has also made substantial progress expanding and upgrading its 140-acre, 830,000-square-foot Gresham campus so it can manufacture higher volumes of its microcontroller, analog and security products. As part of the investment, Microchip is adding two cleanrooms and more than 160 new tools to its facility, which produces semiconductors from 8-inch wafers.
 
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