This planet is awash with energy, we just need to tap into some other resources.

Hear Hear.

There is more energy in an average Atlantic storm than Man has used in his whole existance on the planet.

All that is lacking is the political will to harness it.

 

The Energy and the Man In The Atlantic Ocean Is Loosewire check out

all his energy in his album, Super Energy. Hear..Hear.. its about time you

found all that Energy,and the will is there,just look...white caps and all

that current in the waves.

 

Again, this is not hypothetical, Airline fuel oil has already been synthesized and tested from algae.

Ok, I read the article on Wiki. Interesting stuff. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algae_fuel

It all depends on how FAST we run out of fossil fuel I guess. We will have to adapt before this happens.
Also, what is the disadvantage of algaculture? There must be some inconvenience.

The more I read the more I see how opinions on this subject diverge.

Overpopulation, overconsumption and pollutions still seem to be things one should be concerned about.

 

Every day they admit that we have so much oil that its exported. They

talk about it,but until you get long gas lines and higher prices nothing

will happen. Look on your pump,they have 20% ethanol,all food products have

corn in them,the corn is going for fuel..food prices are going up. Pond scum

is a divergion,talking points. Thats all we get are talking points,6 & 8 member

committee's to run the congress,no real debate,that the history we will have.

 

Look me in the eye's guy's,do you want to be a father for real.

The womens bodies they want so bad,no apirin for there knee's.

So are we taking care of our over population the wrong way.

You young do you want to grow old and not have a place to

hang your hat and nobody that looks like you,stranger all alone.

That where we are going,so let me hear from the daddies to be.

We have a worldly sample here.

 

I'm still gathering information.

One phrase in particular caught my attention: "we have become nearly completely dependent on long, and highly oil-dependent, supply chains".

I found an article ( not the most up to date ) that describes how much oil / energy is needed for industrialized food production.

While it's easy to bury one's head in the sand when hearing Climate change (if we don't believe in it), Oil peak or similar... the idea of an interrupted food supply and a possibly starving population is frightening.

Strengthening local economies and organic agriculture makes sense to me now.

 

Strengthening local economies and organic agriculture makes sense to me now.

As a rule of thumb, it is best to not depend on anybody for the essentials.

Prime example right now is the latest news about drug shortages again. The good news is that people are inventive and do find solutions, but I believe that we are pushing up against our own limits and it is no time to play "chicken" Also look at how this shortage came about - FDA notified the company about certain problems a year ago but hospitals and doctors were unaware of this thus nobody was given a chance to prepare for a potential disaster. A prime example of gov't giving an upper hand to a private company.

Meanwhile someone is making money on all of this....

 

As a rule of thumb, it is best to not depend on anybody for the essentials.

100% agreed.

Since it's so difficult for us to see reason, we will be forced to see what will happen.

It's not only that food needs to be transported, it's also that fertilizer production is energy intensive, that overuse and runoff of fertilizers is polluting our water supply etc.
We are not the first that will be hit but one day this will come back to us.

I just read this:
"

The world's worst recorded food disaster occurred in 1943 in British-ruled India. Known as the Bengal Famine, an estimated 4 million people died of hunger that year in eastern India (which included today's Bangladesh).

When the British left India in 1947, India continued to be haunted by memories of the Bengal Famine. It was therefore natural that food security was one of the main items on free India's agenda. This awareness led, on one hand, to the Green Revolution in India and, on the other, legislative measures to ensure that businessmen would never again be able to hoard food for reasons of profit.​

The Green Revolution, spreading over the period from1967/68 to 1977/78, changed India’s status from a food-deficient country to one of the world's leading agricultural nations. Until 1967 the government largely concentrated on expanding the farming areas. But the population was growing at a much faster rate than food production. This called for an immediate and drastic action to increase yield. "

Wait. Why does this call for a drastic action to increase yield and not a drastic action to control birth rate?
What are the reasons for high birth rates? Another subject to explore.

 

Indian society and economics make an interesting case study. The Indian system of Swadeshi built resilience at the local community level. The economy is based on small independent businesses working at the local level.

Relying on highly decentralized economies was Gandhi's vision of independence and local self-reliance and self-sufficiency. For Gandhi, the spirit and the soul of India rested in village communities. He said, "The true India is to be found not in its few cities, but in its seven hundred thousand villages. If the villages perish, India will perish too."

Recently, the Indian govt attempted to allow large multinational companies greater access to the local economy. Doing so would be detrimental to local communities, business and resilience.

 

I am always interested in the birth rate question. There are so many factors - natural (biological), societal, religious, philosophical.... China implemented one child policy - the result is, to me, strange. Population grew and there is a disproportionate rate of men:women as boys are preferred. Covered by dark veil are things unspoken... before, when we lived as small tribes, as a community grew too big, it would split - simple logic tells you that big groups of people are difficult to manage. We also know what came of all great civilizations that came before us. I wonder if we are coming close to a tipping point.

Even in agriculture we are ruled by a handful of corporations that control it on large scale - they have managed to convince the big people that it is more beneficial to have monocultures. My fingertips will burn as I type Monsanto... If only people cared about how their food tastes and not how long it can last in their fridge. I stopped eating cucumbers and tomatoes because the are completely tasteless... waste of money. Genetic engineering in food another thing - eggs with fish genes, good for you, maybe, would I drink it, no... but may have no choice.

 

A tragic part of the Green Revolution resulted in companies such as Monsanto convincing farmers to abandon their seeds handed down over generations and replaced with single strains of GM seeds, which they cannot collect and replant.

Not only are farmers forced to purchase their seeds from Monsanto, they are also locked into having to purchase herbicides such as Roundup from Monsanto.

 

I still haven't gotten over all the things going on with Monsanto and what they do. How is it legal, I do not know. There are criminal cases against the company and yet it still exists...

 

In another very recent case, the US is accusing India at the WTO for trade protectionism for banning US poultry.

The US is the world’s largest broiler meat producer and second largest exporter, behind Brazil.

Shouldn't India have the right to protect its own food production and build its self reliance?

We will all soon find out the outcome when the price of oil hits the sky and the cost to transport food skyrockets.

 

Monsanto?

Come on, from their website:

"Sustainable agriculture is at the core of Monsanto."

And if you complain too much about tasteless tomatoes - there is certainly a way to program some artificial aroma in there..

IMO, the first priority would be to decrease world population, preferably by birth control (contraception). But that's something that doesn't combine with "growth economy" as I learned.

 

Shouldn't India have the right to protect its own food production and build its self reliance?

I don't know much about India (only that they have overpopulation problem), but the answer to your question is Yes.

 

I don't see any problem, remember mad cow disease? U.S. is unhappy because China can get buy without american chicken, but US cannot survive without chinese i-pods

Ha, I am sure someone is working on a tomato with peach flavor. Did flat peaches ever take off - I believe they were supposed to be easier to eat? Eating peaches is a difficult task indeed.

The overpopulation is a tricky one. There was another thread where someone was mentioning Africa. I find it to be a difficult topic. Too many factors. Most will point to education. While it seems to be so, I do not think it is the determining factor. The simple issue is when chance of your offsping (or yourself) surviving is low, you are bound to have more children. This is from biological perspective. Children are expensive (to women anyway) and having more than one is a way to maximize success. If you live in a stable environment, then this is no longer necessary. Other animals cope differently - they do not have offspring during difficult times, but that is because most species do not take 2 years to reach some level of independence and 13-16 to become fully independent. This is why when people say "why don't they just stop having kids", I have to ask, if the chances of a kid surviving past age of 3 are low, what would you do? wait until another one dies? It is a cruel game... Once the situation changes, and it looks like, in Africa it never will, the birth rate will drop.

 

From this site: http://www.dieoff.com/

“Minerals are inexhaustible and will never be depleted. A stream of investment creates additions to proved reserves, a very large in-ground inventory, constantly renewed as it is extracted… How much was in the ground at the start and how much will be left at the end are unknown and irrelevant… There are plenty of fossil fuels and no limit to potential electrical capacity. It is all a matter of money.”
— M. A. Adelman, 1993

HaHa.

Everything seems to point to two major things that need to be accomplished:

- decrease number of people on the planet
- decrease use of energy per capita, renewable sources or not

 

I can definitely agree with this:

"It’s virtually impossible to teach physical science to economists because it threatens their social status, but the inverse is not true. It’s easy to teach economic theory to physical scientists, see: Economic Theory For Scientists and Engineers (above). Therefore, the first step should be to teach economic theory to scientists and engineers so they can explain to the rich people who run this country why capitalism must be abandoned in favor of democracy."

only there is still the problem of preaching to deaf ears...

 

Since I started working as an electronics technician I wondered how I could actually escape the growth/capitalism trap with the skills I had/have.

In the past I

x repaired TV sets - used for advertising, diverting our attention from what's x important, killing social interaction
x built VFDs for automotive industry assembly lines - cars = big polluter
x built UPS for oil rigs - no explanation needed
x now I'm helping to build electronic devices for vehicles.

Looks like my whole life I directly helped supporting a system I don't like.

Maybe there is not even a way out if you have a certain skill set.

 

Solder KILLS ,you lose your skills early,about 49-52 years of age.