The problem with public filming is the timing. Rarely do we get the whole story.

The point where I disagree with you is the instant the suspect is unable to defend himself, like the rules of boxing. My personal rule is, "Never follow a man to the ground." If you do, you become likely to be arrested. You seem to be arguing that LEOs can get their blood lust revved up while on the hunt, and when they close in on their prey, beat him bloody, regardless of whether he has recognized he has no chance of escape or defense. Right now, the courts agree with you most of the time, but I do remember one, "high speed chase" that crossed a State Line somewhere around New Hampshire. After the suspect gave up, got out of his pick-up truck, and laid on the ground spread eagled, several cops arrived and beat him bloody while a TV helicopter filmed it. Those cops are now convicted.

I have some doubt about the courts agreeing with you most of the time. If they did, the LEOs wouldn't be caught so often making up fake charges and provocations. "He bladed at me". I think that means he turned sideways to present less of a target. "He squared off at me." I think that means he did not turn to present less of a target. "He was agitated, flailing his arms, disgruntled, angry, resisting without violence...half of that is mind reading, half is contempt of cop, and all of it has been shown on video to be lies at one time or another. If the courts always agreed with you, the cops wouldn't bother to lie on the witness stand (commit perjury).

How do they see if it's working? What is their metric?

Cash flow. If you doubt, count how many red light cameras have been removed for lack of profitability.

 

Cash flow ... that could be one, but I doubt they garner enough to pay the overtime. I suspect the number of tickets is the metric. It shows the feds whether or not the seat belt law is working. Click it or ticket is highly publicized. I'm surprised people still get caught. DWI (no refusals on tests) crackdowns are also highly publicized.

Red light camera's removed for lack of profitability? I haven't heard that excuse. I'll have to look at Arlington since they removed their camera's a few months after sending me a bill.

Cops are no more exempt from getting the blood boiled than you. I don't think they chase people for the fun of it. High speed chases are normally called off quickly around here, depending on the offense. No use putting more of the citizenry in danger. You can go from calm to boiling in a microsecond ... if the situation warranted it. Now look at all the laws that the cops are suppose to enforce. If you have one that exercises their due diligence with respect for each one, and the offender attempts to escape, what do you think a human will do? What if their escape includes endangering the public?

Cops are just as human as you.

I think DOJ doesn't prosecute because they don't want to lose the case. We the people empowered the prosecutors with the discretion on which cases they try. They make their best judgement based on the evidence. Maybe their best isn't sufficient. If they are elected officials, the people have a chance to effect change. The federal prosecutors are appointees. The locals are more likely elected. So, BHO's appointees did not prosecute the Michael Brown case in Ferguson, MO. They also didn't prosecute the other case who's name escapes me, but it certainly as discussed in these threads as well.

So, it doesn't matter what my opine is, and it doesn't matter what yours is. If the prosecutor doesn't exercise their duty, or they do when it disagrees with us, that is the only one that matters to the accused. I've yet to hear a prosecutor state he didn't prosecute a cop because all the other cops wouldn't talk to them anymore. Is that a possibility? Sure. When humans are involved, the realm of possibility is infinite.

on edit:

The people of Arlington Texas voted to remove their traffic cameras.

 

Red light camera's removed for lack of profitability?

The North Carolina Court of Appeals agreed in May 2006, upholding that 90% of red-light camera fines collected must go to North Carolina schools.

• High Point, NC dropped its camera program in early 2005
• Greensboro dropped its camera program in early 2005
• Charlotte dropped its camera program in early 2007
• Fayetteville dropped its camera program in mid 2007
• Greenville dropped its camera program in mid 2007
• Raleigh dropped its camera program in late 2007
• Rocky Mount dropped its camera program in early 2009
  https://www.motorists.org/blog/reboot-settled-red-light-camera-debate/
  
  CHICAGO – A request by the city of Chicago to toss a lawsuit challenging the fairness and constitutionality of its controversial red light camera program was denied by a Cook County judge.
  The city has argued that it’s not legally bound to the 3-second minimum listed in federal guidelines.
  http://www.ticketassassin.com/the-unholy-intersection-of-chicago-politics-and-automated-enforcement/
  
  New Georgia law forces longer yellow times that made red light cameras unprofitable in Norcross.
  The Norcross, Georgia City Council voted Monday to end its relationship with LaserCraft Inc., a red light camera company
  https://www.thenewspaper.com/news/27/2705.asp
  
  One report, from MSNBC, highlights Dallas, Texas, the latest city where police and city officials are openly encouraging crime to boost the bottom line:
  Manager Mary Suhm estimated last week that the city would fall short by more than $4 million. So last week, the city turned off about a quarter of the least profitable cameras, saying it couldn’t justify the cost of running them."
  https://www.wired.com/2008/03/cities-removing/

 

Cops are just as human as you.

Good. That means they can stop beating people who are on the ground and helpless, or unconscious from a diabetic coma, or a broken back.

We the people empowered the prosecutors with the discretion on which cases they try. They make their best judgement based on the evidence.

I've yet to hear a prosecutor state he didn't prosecute a cop because all the other cops wouldn't talk to them anymore.

Did you miss post #1896 where I showed that the D.A. in Albuquerque didn't charge a cop in 16 years, and when she finally did, she quit her job and called the Albuquerque Police a version of a Blue Mafia?

it doesn't matter what my opine is, and it doesn't matter what yours is.

I disagree. In post #1899 I listed several ways to work from the bottom up to break the habits of bad police officers.
1) Film them. When they claim that being observed endangers them, point to their dash cameras and repeat the line from Groucho Marx, "I can't make a fool of you, you have to do that for your self. The best I can do is draw attention to it."
2) Keep working on the rulings that encourage refusing to hire smart people as LEOs. When 20% of the applicants are too stupid to know their job, give their pay to the smart ones.
3) Break up the natural tendency of prosecutors to, "go along to get along" with their local police.
4) Send back $6 billion worth of military grade weapons while repeating, "The Geneva Convention forbids using military weapons on a civilian population."

Here are a couple of more ambitious goals:
5) Stop Universal Surveillance. It is so bad at capturing terrorists that the FBI has to create terrorists out of mental defectives to look like they are accomplishing something.
6) Put a muzzle on President Trump. His mouth is writing checks our blood can't cash.
7) Try to eliminate secret government departments who create secret courts to make secret subpoenas, all under the cloak of, "National Security".
8) Get Congress to ratify The Constitution of the United States of America, complete with the Bill of Rights. They don't seem to be in effect right now and I think they would be an improvement over, "Make it up as we go."

 

I revealed a lot about myself in posts #1896, 1899, and 1904.
I already know that people who support The Constitution are considered to be terrorists by our government.
I hope the men in terrorist suits don't throw a flash-bang through my front window while jerking the front door off my house with their MRAP.

 

NYPD has over 40,000 officers. I don't know how many the other cities have. We are talking about a handful of rogue cops, not even 1 percent of the NYPD officer population. If we added all the departments, the percentage would drop to probably the same statistic as the general population population doing the same type of crime. It wouldn't make a pimple on a knats ass.

The rogue DAs are preventing justice from being served. In the world of any activities, you win some, lose some. The DAs can not hope to maintain a perfect record.

My disappointment isn't with the PD ... it's with those that have the ability to charge and investigate. Yes, there will be screams during concurrent investigations. Of course we will be treated with the same excuses the IA investigators face ... uncooperative witnesses.

I used the NYPD numbers because those are the one I heard previously.

 

My disappointment isn't with the PD ... it's with those that have the ability to charge and investigate.

Agreed. This relates to my point that the police are us. If we elect mayors and DAs that don't maintain quality standards, we cannot blame the police. As my dad used to say, the bottleneck is generally found at the top of the bottle.

 

Correction of post #1899: Not 89,000 but 660,000 police and sheriffs officers in the U.S.
https://www.theguardian.com/inequal...y-why-world-is-obsessed-with-private-security

for a cost of $40.6 billion per year in wages
https://www.bls.gov/ooh/protective-service/police-and-detectives.htm

Supplement to post #1904, "Put a muzzle on Trump".
Donald Trump Has Destroyed the Credibility of the Presidency
https://reason.com/blog/2017/05/16/donald-trump-has-destroyed-the-credibili

 

This is beyond ridiculous. It's simply mind-boggling:

A Dallas school district is being accused of using extreme force to restrain a 7-year-old special needs student last week.

Yosio Lopez was handcuffed, Tased and bruised by Dallas Independent School District (DISD) Police after the boy started banging his head against a wall in class

http://www.cnn.com/2017/05/16/us/boy-handcuffs-dallas-school-trnd/index.html

 

Who calls the police for a known medial problem in an elementary school? The police used tried and true methods of criminal restraint because they are not medical experts. That part, while over the top excessive is less shocking (the kid needed to be restrained to prevent damage to himself) than the DISD calling on the police to restrain him in the first place.. He is 7.

 

Who calls the police for a known medial problem in an elementary school? The police used tried and true methods of criminal restraint because they are not medical experts. That part, while over the top excessive is less shocking (the kid needed to be restrained to prevent damage to himself) than the DISD calling on the police to restrain him in the first place.. He is 7.

But why tase him? ... at all?

 

But why tase him? ... at all?

Because that's the protocol today when using increasing levels of physical restrains. If the cops had broken restrain protocol and used a choke-hold would it have been better? I have a grown kid with autism, when he was small the dude had the strength of the fear of death when he lost control. I had to use gentle pain restrains to get him to stop thrashing and calm down.

 

Because that's the protocol today when using increasing levels of physical restrains. If the cops had broken restrain protocol and used a choke-hold would it have been better?

I'm sorry, Nsa... but there's a limit to everything, this atrocity should never have happened, not even in the name of objectivity. Those cops behaved like animalized brutes and the school acted like a freaking disciplinary machine... this was simply inhumane and inexcusable.

 

I'm sorry, Nsa... but there's a limit to everything, this atrocity should never have happened, not even in the name of objectivity. Those cops behaved like animalized brutes and the school acted like a freaking disciplinary machine... this was simply inhumane and inexcusable.

I completely agree it should not have happened but it's a pretty good bet the cops will not be charged if they followed the rules to the letter because that's the environment cops operate under today. Going off on them diverts from the root cause of why this happened.

 

... it's a pretty good bet the cops will not be charged if they followed the rules to the letter ...

... it tells you something about the rules, doesn't it?

 

... it tells you something about the rules, doesn't it?

Yes, the rules are designed to stop criminals, not 7 year old out of control kids with a known medical condition. It's unrealistic to expect them to freelance medically proper restraints in today's' anti-cop environment and cameras. If that kid had a broken neck or arm from them just leaving him to thrash they still would be in the hot seat for doing nothing. Most of the blame is on the school district for this atrocity.

 

Most of the blame is on the school district for this atrocity.

You may have point there... it's the attack dogs owners that should be held responsible... but the dogs themselves should be thrown into the den, at least...

 

@#12, your are hitting this smack dab on the head! The guy's that are supporters of the supreme leaders can't match what you are saying, but be careful, your entering the "defection zone".

 

... this was simply inhumane and inexcusable.

On the surface, maybe. It's very hard to judge from afar. If the 'stand back and do nothing" approach might lead to the kid killing himself with head banging, and the "make an intervention" approach resembles wrestling a rabid raccoon, where both you and the raccoon might become injured, which do you choose?

 

@#12, your are hitting this smack dab on the head! The guy's that are supporters of the supreme leaders can't match what you are saying, but be careful, your entering the "defection zone".

I know. (See post #1905)
Discussing peaceful methods to improve how our country functions is considered treason in a police state.
Supporting the Constitution has been listed in writing as one type of terrorist. I just can't remember which alphabet agency wrote it.
My neck is out and I don't even hope my government can't figure out my real name.
My best hope is what it has always been, I'm not important enough to eliminate.