Suggested clarification to TOS

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Aleph(0), Jan 5, 2018.

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  1. GopherT

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    For anyone to claim nuclear energy is "free", there is a clear misunderstanding of Capital Investment and cost of capital, safety and maintenance and refueling. Even with those costs covered, some nuclear power plants are announcing they will be closed long before their designed lifetime. Nuclear power is simply not as economical as current competition.

    That being said, there is no lack of clarity in the phrase, free energy.

    Now, I think it is overreach of the 8ntent of the rule when someone creates a thread about a YouTube video and asks, "could someone help me understand this overunity video, I know it cannot be true but I need help understanding". Then a Mod closes it three minutes later because it is about overunity. How do we teach science if we cannot talk about quackery.
     
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  2. GopherT

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    Yup,
    ΔG = ΔH - TΔS
     
  3. Aleph(0)

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    Gophert if there wasn't some profit (which I mean free of charge energy) ppl wouldn't have done it in first place! But being practical I agree and say it's totally sad that regulators and politicians enabled by manufactured hysteria can make anything a losing proposition:(! Everything useful is dangerous cuz useful means ability to cause change and change is usually bad for ordered systems (like organisms and societies) unless totally under control! So I think phobia of ionizing radiation is as lame as phobia of just fire but I admit I wouldn't like nuclear power station in my back yard either:eek:;)!

    Gophert I say you must be reincarnation of Plutarch:D So just in case humor goes astray I'm saying I agree:cool:!
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2018
  4. shortbus

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    There's never been a call from me to "dummy down". It's been my contention that there is no call for the So called "superiority of intellect" being bandied about with words not in common use, even in any form of teaching or text book, even at the college level.
     
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  5. spinnaker

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    I liked but I would like to add 99 more likes. ;)
     
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  6. nsaspook

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    This site's TOS on quackery is just about right. Call it quackery, and be done with it. The misguided will see the error, the fools and crackpots are a waste of valuable time and resources.
     
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  7. GopherT

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    If we only talk about crops and not about weeds, eventually the field will be overrun with weeds.
     
  8. nsaspook

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    OK, farmer John. We got rid of weeds the old fashioned way when I was a kid on a farm. We chopped them up and left the crop to prosper. So sure we should learn how to detect quackery (weeds) but talking about it in detail detracts from good science instead of improving it unless you're making weed-killers.
    Talking to the weeds won't make them go away either.:D
     
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  9. nsaspook

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  10. tcmtech

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    I'm semi for it myself but I have seen too many discussions of these subjects turn into idiot fests by the believers when they start losing their arguments to real science or when someone takes over with just really poorly explained and or understood scientific concepts and won't let their less than correct and complete conspiracy theory views go.

    It's much like political debates. They work great and a lot of good info and viewpoints get shared until butthurtness and easily disassembled blind faith/trollish stances take over one sides operating system and all formal dignity, respect, decency and decorum suddenly somehow becomes too alien for them to understand and use any longer. :(

    Now that said I do have to admit there are a number of OU/PM device design concepts that are worth discussing simply because when done right they are pretty convincing that something less than normal is going on and they are a rather enjoyable exercises in logic and reasoning to figure out what exactly is going on to make things appear and act as they do.

    It's rather like HHO boosting on certain EFI emission compliant engines and seeing a legitimate fuel economy gains despite the fact the HHO generator power inputs don't add up for the as calculated engine power to fuel usage gains seen. I know why it works for some situations but getting others to see it and believe it is rather hard without a rather in depth level of explanation to the overall workings of everything in play. ;)

    That and it's also way too easy for someone to go eco-troll on the overall socioeconomic/poltical implications of the how and why of the reality of what's going on and derail the whole discussion over it. :(
     
  11. tcmtech

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    Unfortunately,in some views, 'weeds' have protected rights to do as they wish where they wish' now so we can't just chop them to bits when they show up and start detracting from the legitimate harvesting practices and final crop yields. :(

    Personally however, I do love running down high stubborn weeds and turning them into mulch with my 10' commercial flail mower and 175+ PTO HP tractor so that good grass can take over its place later! :D

    That or going out with the 'Black death' spray and killing everything that stands then plowing it all under and replanting. :eek:
     
  12. OBW0549

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    Not me.

    If most of the people posting that kind of crap were simply misinformed, and were open to being educated and having their wayward ideas debunked, that might point to leaving such discussions open.

    But with very few exceptions, they are not. Most of the ones I've encountered appear to have a deep, unshakable belief in this nonsense; for them this "free energy" stuff is akin to a religion, and they will not give it up no matter what. Stupidity and gross ignorance are also factors.

    No, I'm in favor of leaving the rules as they are.
     
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  13. spinnaker

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    What I can't figure is that all of these devices are very complicated. Of course they don't work but are still usually complicated. How can anyone be smart enough to be able to understand their "theoretical" operation but be so uneducated to know they can't possibly work?
     
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  14. OBW0549

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    They're not smart; they're just adept at spouting horsepucky and the kind of loony logic which says "A, therefore B" but in which there is no actual, causal connection between A and B. The fact that they can string together lots and lots of impressive-sounding words doesn't keep them from being dumb as a box of wet hair.
     
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  15. BR-549

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    We are, and we live in, perpetual motion. Every entity of matter is in perpetual motion. Every emission from matter is in perpetual motion. ALL ENERGY is in perpetual motion. EVEN STORED POTENTIAL is in perpetual motion.(the electric field in a cap....is in constant motion) You can not stop it. It's reality. Our modern science knows nothing of reality. Really nothing.

    Perpetual motion and perpetual energy is a fact of reality. Perpetual energy does not mean a constant production of energy. Perpetual energy comes from the balance of a constant amount of energy.(whether it be a particle or a planet) Harvesting that energy balance for another purpose will cost you. It takes a nuclear reactor(plus a great amount of refining) and a bunch of auxiliary equipment to extract controlled atomic energy.

    In the future(when real science returns).......an electric reactor, that controls frequency and phase will be able to do this on your desktop. The perpetual energy and motion of an atom is held together and balanced with frequency and phase. A confined resonance.

    Nothing in the universe is still, or set, or motionless. Perpetual motion is a reality fact.

    Denying PM and PE is denying reality. Just like our modern science teaches us.

    You may offer any math equation you like.....and it will be welcomed and a pat on the back for the effort(whether it is right or wrong)......But you suggest perpetual motion or perpetual energy......you will be asked to leave and be labelled a crackpot.

    Educated Ignorance. Our government funded academics are the crackpots.
     
  16. GopherT

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    Aaaaaaand now we've gone off the deep end.
     
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  17. nsaspook

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    Well, the bait was the water so be considerate and non-judgmental when you hook a fish.
     
  18. tcmtech

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    That's on the same lines as I have argued them.

    If someone is smart enough to build a actual working device they are also smart enough to be able to make a functional explanation of it and give a well defined by reality bill of materials to build the device as well.

    Same with thusly also being smart enough to find a way to make a endless fortune off the the design without having to sell non functional design blueprints for it to gullible fools either. ;)

    If they can't explain in detail to where anyone of reasonable technical skill can build one and the want you to buy their blueprints it's a scam.

    If you can make more energy than you put in in any form for less cost than it takes to operate there is an endless number of ways you can make all the money you could ever want to the point you could literally own the world and change it any way you want.
     
  19. tcmtech

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    Sort of yes, but so far that leap from the apparently infinitely small closed loop systems of quantum level energy activity of undefined matter to the production of working open loop excess energy of any kind at the macro scale physics level reality we define as workable reality has yet to be cracked.

    That's the cold hard reality of the problem people like you seem to have a very hard time admitting is a huge limitation in your claimed proof.

    We know how to split atoms and manipulate sub-atomic particles at will but that isn't free and limitless energy by any means. There's a huge matter/energy consumption cost in the conversion equation.

    Feel free to post your proof that I and everyone else is wrong! Everyone would love to know the secret if you have it! In fact I got $10K cash to hand to anyone who can give me working blueprints and a reality based BOM to build and confirm such a devices design and function! ;)
     
  20. BR-549

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    I wish I could. But we don't have the engineering yet. 10-4 on the amount of energy needed for such. But that's only because we interact with atoms with heat and kinetic particle flux.

    We should be able to assemble and disassemble any atom(or object) with frequency. We ought to be able to assemble neutrons too.

    We would have to have precise control of frequency, phase and amplitude at super duper high frequencies.

    This is how nature does it.........we should follow. Heat and particle flux gives you a vast reservoir of rates and frequencies...........but only the right ones do the work.......most are wasted as heat. We want to directly influence the atom and nothing else........frequency does that.

    Edit: the whole universe sings.....we just haven't learned the notes.
     
    Last edited: Jan 7, 2018
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