Ohms Law and Hominid Evolution

WBahn

Joined Mar 31, 2012
26,156
Funny you should mention that... I was wondering if it was still sqwaking after all these years. I thought I heard years ago that was almost out of range then.
An interesting article I just ran across:

https://phys.org/news/2018-12-australia-voyager-nasa-probe-interstellar.html

It agrees with what I recalled from a number of years ago -- that, barring the very likely failure of the transmitter before then -- we should be able to continue receiving diagnostic signals from the craft for more than 50 years after it's launch. Whether it will be worth the opportunity cost to do so once the last scientific instrument is silenced is a different question. I imagine at that point they will only listen occasionally just to put a close estimate on when she finally falls silent.
 

BobaMosfet

Joined Jul 1, 2009
1,208
@WBahn
But this also doesn't take in the account that we don't really know how far radio waves actually travel. meaning what if the universe has a built in barrier that we don't know about that stops the waves from going as far as we think they should. There is no one at the other end to verify that they went anywhere out there. Just because we are still getting signals from voyager 1 and 2 doesn't mean others are receiving them. distance may be the problem. some kind of effect that just stops them cold.

Brzrkr
Yes, that effect is call Watts. No civilization has the power to generate the kind of wattage required to make a signal stiff enough to travel the distances involved before they simply are so faint they are lost in the cosmic noise.
 

BobaMosfet

Joined Jul 1, 2009
1,208
I mentioned them a few posts back and Yes last I heard they were still receiving data from it.

Brzrkr
If you mean from Voyager, yes, they are- but that soon will end in a few years. I believe we're already on the picoWatt end of the reception, and once we enter femtoWatts... I'm pretty sure that's outside our abiltiy to receive and discern from cosmic noise.
 

Tonyr1084

Joined Sep 24, 2015
5,080
God (the Bible) never said we were the only ones He made. It said He made the Heavens and the Earth. So if he made us he could have made others. It also speaks of the Others "Nephilim". And yes Radio waves are piss poor way of communication. To Wbahn's statement just because there is life on a planet doesn't mean it's intelligent.

Brzrkr
Assuming God made earth with humans on it. Assume he made other beings on other planets as well. Why would God allow them to visit us? It would confuse us as to our origins and could lead to people not believing in God. It has been said that if life were discovered on other planets, intelligent or not, it would shake the foundations of faith in God.

Anyway, this thread should't become a religious argument. You have your views and I respect them.
 

Berzerker

Joined Jul 29, 2018
621
@Tonyr1084
Wasn't trying to get into a religious aspect of it. You stated "You can't use God and Aliens in the same sentence"! Did you not?
I did and done a pretty good job of it to prove you wrong. In the Bible it talks of beings from other places. I used it as a reference to show that even then they knew these people were different from us and came from somewhere else. I'm not trying to convert people Tonyr or say one religion is better than another! But if you can quote google or the internet why can't I use the Bible as a source. In the story of Elijah, He was taken up and to a people called the "Watchers". And I did say "TAKEN UP" in a Chariot of Fire.
These are sources nothing more

Brzrkr
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
7,594
A lot of creative photo-editing. MiG 21's taking off. At the end, "damage to the left wing." No details on the damage. Preexisting? A lot of other airplanes in between to fill the space.
The good info from that video was a confirmation that Russia knows the UFOs are unlikely to be US technology. The know the 'special' non-aerodynamic UFO radar signature just like we do.
 

redrooster01

Joined Jul 15, 2014
92
Maybe but it proves nothing about this laughable case of totally imaginary BS.

But the fact that some geniuses were laughed at does not imply that all who are laughed at are geniuses. They laughed at Columbus, they laughed at Fulton, they laughed at the Wright Brothers. But they also laughed at Bozo the Clown.

Carl Sagan
And now we laugh at Carl Sagan! There is enough credible evidence both historical and in this modern era to prove that we are being visited by intelligence probes. You only have to do a few days of serious research to realise this. Shag Harbor. Rendlesham Forest. Astronaut Gordon Coopers story on a UFO that landed at an American airbase he was in charge of. There is so much credible evidence out there that its ridiculous to say that its all just a load of cr@#.
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
7,594
And now we laugh at Carl Sagan! There is enough credible evidence both historical and in this modern era to prove that we are being visited by intelligence probes. You only have to do a few days of serious research to realise this. Shag Harbor. Rendlesham Forest. Astronaut Gordon Coopers story on a UFO that landed at an American airbase he was in charge of. There is so much credible evidence out there that its ridiculous to say that its all just a load of cr@#.
I try to avoid intelligence probes.
giphyb.gif

http://www.rfreitas.com/Astro/ResolvingFermi1983.htm
but it's a open question.
 
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Berzerker

Joined Jul 29, 2018
621
nsaspook said:
I try to avoid intelligence probes.
The Alien probes are the ones you really have to watch for :eek:

I wouldn't doubt somewhere out there Aliens are on some other planet just like we are. Just like if you see baby snakes you better look around for Mama. If these ships we see are (Alien) and only 30, 50, 100 ft. you better look around for the mother ship. Not enough resources to cross the distances needed to get here. Oh you all forgot about the bases on the Moon, let's don't leave anything out..... Statues on Mars.

Oh yeah the mother ship is on the far side of the Moon.

If they are getting close to disclosure I for one await it ! Tonyr seems to think it would shake my/others faith.... I on the other hand do not.
If God did make us he also made them.
My thoughts would be "Well it's about time" When do I get to meet or see one in person. Can they speak, do they have a cure for cancer, alzheimer's and all the bad diseases. Will they give us interstellar travel and the one I'm most curious about "will their arrival stop us bickering and fighting amongst one another.

Brzrkr
 
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nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
7,594
The Alien probes are the ones you really have to watch for :eek:

I wouldn't doubt somewhere out there Aliens are on some other planet just like we are. Just like if you see baby snakes you better look around for Mama. If these ships we see are (Alien) and only 30, 50, 100 ft. you better look around for the mother ship. Not enough resources to cross the distances needed to get here. Oh you all forgot about the bases on the Moon, let's don't leave anything out..... Statues on Mars.

Oh yeah the mother ship is on the far side of the Moon.

If they are getting close to disclosure I for one await it ! Tonyr seems to think it would shake my/others faith.... I on the other hand do not.
If God did make us he also made them.
My thoughts would be "Well it's about time" When do I get to meet or see one in person. Can they speak, do they have a cure for cancer, alzheimer's and all the bad diseases. Will they give us interstellar travel and the one I'm most curious about "will their arrival stop us bickering and fighting amongst one another.

Brzrkr
To Aliens we are just another form of meat.
The Ladyfingers are delicious! Here, try one.
 

Berzerker

Joined Jul 29, 2018
621
nsaspook said:
To Aliens we are just another form of meat.
The Ladyfingers are delicious! Here, try one.
Yeah I seen that one but it might also be true. They may not come here in peace!
Like the movie "Battleship" we may find ourselves in a war we can't win and unlike the movies where we always pull a rabbits foot out our A**, We'll lose big time. And either become slaves or food.

Brzrkr
 

402DF855

Joined Feb 9, 2013
223
I am going to be admittedly arrogant and state my opinions which I cannot prove. We are alone in the galaxy. There are likely some Goldilocks planets with replicating molecules floating around but single cell organisms are probably rare, and multicell beings obviously even rarer. Consider that we don't really understand how our single cell ancestors first appeared. Also consider the reportedly unlikely single botched "ingestion" that resulted in mitochondria and subsequent higher life forms. (I am not an atheist but I'll resist trying to speculate about the motivations and values of the Creator that may have been behind these events.)

Then, considering the limitation of the light speed combined with the vast distances between galactic bodies, the only realistic scenario where an alien craft would intersect our tiny solar neighborhood would likely be a lost drone with no biological occupants. An exception might be some creatures that have achieved immortality and the ability subsist on some energy prevalent in interstellar space, but why would they take the unfathomable amount of time needed to cross empty and probably very boring spaces between stars?

I suspect in the far future, perhaps a million years, life on earth will have begun to saturate habitable locations throughout our galaxy. But due to the vastness and time scales involved, many of our descendent alien populations will not know where they came from. Some may retain knowledge of their Earthly pedigree, but others will have lost it.

These ideas are based on the level of scientific knowledge we now possess, which I'd argue only advances glacially. If we eventually learn how to easily form worm holes for communication or travel, or find a way to play with time and space ala warp drive etc, my conclusions will be invalidated. So far I see no reason to suspect this will happen any time soon. I must conclude that the UFO's getting so much media attention are mistakes, hoaxes, classified human technology, and not alien visitors. I would like to be proven wrong mostly due to the advancement of science that would follow an alien encounter, but I'm convinced this is virtually impossible.
 

Berzerker

Joined Jul 29, 2018
621
@402DF855
I too agree that they are not alien. I go back to the release of the Stealth fighter/Bomber. It had been seen and called a UFO before anyone knew it existed. I was told by nsaspook that when I said our military was 50 to 75 years ahead of us it was B.S. The Germans were working with mercury and it's anti-gravity properties in WWII (Die Glocke) "The Bell". By now I'm sure they have worked with it and have advanced the technology. And with the new element (I believe it was 115) being added which is a synthetic chemical atomic element. Just think a Atomic element with less radiation but the same effect.

Brzrkr
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
7,594
@402DF855
I too agree that they are not alien. I go back to the release of the Stealth fighter/Bomber. It had been seen and called a UFO before anyone knew it existed. I was told by nsaspook that when I said our military was 50 to 75 years ahead of us it was B.S. The Germans were working with mercury and it's anti-gravity properties in WWII (Die Glocke) "The Bell". By now I'm sure they have worked with it and have advanced the technology. And with the new element (I believe it was 115) being added which is a synthetic chemical atomic element. Just think a Atomic element with less radiation but the same effect.

Brzrkr
Most sane scientists (and any sane person in the accelerator field) believe "The Bell" was a heavy particle accelerator (with a mercury vapor ion source) used in the German nuclear program. The Soviets called it a Tokamak, commonly called a: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vortex_tube

used to generate Gamma radiation for Thorium transmutation into a fission material for building a crude atomic bomb.. The fact this is seen as a Nazi cult UFO device is strange but funny.
A example in Poland.
e1dcb47f6ce98da7a022795919648e50.jpg
bell.jpg
 
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Berzerker

Joined Jul 29, 2018
621
Tokamak was invented in the 1960's not in WWII. And it's in a magnetic field.
CCFE said:
Culham Centre Fushion Energy
The tokamak is the most developed magnetic confinement system and is the basis for the design of future fusion reactors using this method. It was invented in the Soviet Union during the 1960s and soon adopted by researchers around the world. The Joint European Torus (JET – pictured), located at Culham Centre for Fusion Energy, is the largest and most powerful tokamak currently operating.
Brzrkr
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
7,594
Tokamak was invented in the 1960's not in WWII. And it's in a magnetic field.


Brzrkr
The Fusion type Tokamak was invented then (after much previous research into plasma confinement) but the Russian term 'Tokamak' predates the current device in it's usage for ion plasma devices using magnetic fields.

More 'real' history of the 'Bell'.
https://www.feldgrau.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=33339
Whilst the fabled Nazi Bell or Die Glocke attracts a huge lunatic fringe with ridiculous theories, there does seem a solid base of truth behind existence of the Nazi Bell or Die Glocke as it is also termed.

The path to creating Uranium from Thorium is via transmutation of Thorium 232 into Protactinium 233, which then naturally Beta decays after 27 days into pure bomb grade Uranium 233. This co-incidentally was one of three paths to the Atomic Bomb proposed by Heisenberg at the Harnack Haus conferences in 1942 to an audience of fellow scientists, millitary leaders and the armaments ministry. Heisenberg agaiun alluded to harvesting protactinium for an Atomic weapon in a secretly recorded conversation at Farm Hall with Karl Wirtz in August 1945.
What's a lot more likely? Nazi secret atomic weapon program or Nazi anti-gravity flying UFO?
 
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Berzerker

Joined Jul 29, 2018
621
In the 1940's they were just trying to get the damn thing to blow up... That's the difference. Talking about something and making it work are two different things. Notice your own post says "Atomic Weapon". Mankinds first thoughts are always "How can I use this as a weapon or against someone"! Later the mercury was found to have other properties such as for propulsion.
Where Die Glocke was being tested they used a old giant water tank support with chains tied to the "Bell". Why would you need to tie down a Bomb? It's not like it's going somewhere.

Why don't we just get all the crazy ideas out now!
Ancient Alien Dumba**'s
1. God was an alien
2. They taught us everything we know..;..Man is soooo stupid we could have never figured this stuff out on our own.
3. Man needed flying saucers/aliens to build the pyramids
4. Alien abductions
5. Animal mutilation
Do I need to keep going

If there are aliens we would know by now
The government can hide technology
Why would you travel across the universe and not let everyone know. They would park their spaceship in our orbit and everyone would see it.
telescopes would pick it up long before they got here and someone is gonna say something... you can't hide a spaceship.

Brzrkr
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
7,594
In the 1940's they were just trying to get the damn thing to blow up... That's the difference. Talking about something and making it work are two different things. Notice your own post says "Atomic Weapon". Mankinds first thoughts are always "How can I use this as a weapon or against someone"! Later the mercury was found to have other properties such as for propulsion.
Where Die Glocke was being tested they used a old giant water tank support with chains tied to the "Bell". Why would you need to tie down a Bomb? It's not like it's going somewhere.

Why don't we just get all the crazy ideas out now!
Ancient Alien Dumba**'s
1. God was an alien
2. They taught us everything we know..;..Man is soooo stupid we could have never figured this stuff out on our own.
3. Man needed flying saucers/aliens to build the pyramids
4. Alien abductions
5. Animal mutilation
Do I need to keep going

If there are aliens we would know by now
The government can hide technology

Brzrkr
o_O What? The 'Bell' was not a bomb and neither I or anyone else says it was. It was part of a materials science processing plan to produce fissionable material for a separate thing called a Atomic bomb.

It's obvious more factual information won't make any difference here. That's the definition of something we call people that don't use factual information to improve their understanding of a subject.
 

Berzerker

Joined Jul 29, 2018
621
@nsaspook
Your own words:
Quote:
Most sane scientists (and any sane person in the accelerator field) believe "The Bell" was a heavy particle accelerator (with a mercury vapor ion source) used in the German nuclear program. The Soviets called it a Tokamak, commonly called a: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vortex_tube

used to generate Gamma radiation for Thorium transmutation into a fission material for building a crude atomic bomb..

Edit: and your talking about a centrifuge, I do understand the concept

Brzrkr
 
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nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
7,594
@nsaspook
Your own words:
Quote:
Most sane scientists (and any sane person in the accelerator field) believe "The Bell" was a heavy particle accelerator (with a mercury vapor ion source) used in the German nuclear program. The Soviets called it a Tokamak, commonly called a: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vortex_tube

used to generate Gamma radiation for Thorium transmutation into a fission material for building a crude atomic bomb..

Edit: and your talking about a centrifuge, I do understand the concept

Brzrkr
Yes, my own words make it plenty clear I wasn't talking about the 'Bell' being the 'Bomb'. No, I'm not talking about a centrifuge so obviously you don't understand the operation of the accelerator in this process.
 
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