I'll tell you a secret, you can't argue with objective measurements. If they are claiming to know by "hearing a difference", which is entirely subjective, what good would measurement of millivolts do?

I sold high end audio gear for several years. Not the nonsense stuff but things that actually improved the sound. The way i "proved" things worked or didn't was A/B testing, and if you really think you can get to them at all (which I doubt) it will be with a blind A/B listening test. When they can't reliably pick the "better" one, they might relent, but don't count on it.

Eventually, it will be because there is a non-believer in the room, like with psychics. You are trying to argue science against religion, it's fruitless.

I know! I did try many times to have someone do A/B blind test for me, to prove that i am wrong, but no luck! No one seriously wanna do this such test! And they keep telling same things on and on.
Maybe if i’m keep trying to convince someone do the A/B testing, i’ll let you guys know the results.
Best thanks to all your responses!

 

Remember, @Ian0, this is a thing too: https://www.moon-audio.com/silver-dragon-network-cable-b-stock.html so impeccable as your logic is, it's useless against the refractory "expertise" of the audiophile.

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I also have the same argument with the Cat 8 ethernet cables! Why people keep falling into this kind of trap!

 

I also have the same argument with the Cat 8 ethernet cables! Why people keep falling into this kind of trap!

There are also many of these, some even more expensive: https://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=AQNRGZ3

And I have in my possession a $100 "audiophile receptacle" to plug one of those into. I have test to see audiophile Romex or audiophile circuit breakers, but I better keep quiet before I spawn a new scam.

 

And they keep telling same things on and on.

Nothing you can say will change their minds. If you or they were able to discern any differences using A/B testing, they'd claim that it was due to the switches or wire splices or oxygen in the wires.

Bob Pease, a renowned and revered analog designer, once challenged an audiophile to do some blind testing. They declined.

 

I know! I did try many times to have someone do A/B blind test for me, to prove that i am wrong, but no luck! No one seriously wanna do this such test! And they keep telling same things on and on.
Maybe if i’m keep trying to convince someone do the A/B testing, i’ll let you guys know the results.
Best thanks to all your responses!

What do they connect to this power supply? Is it something that needs about 10Watts maximum? What is the output voltage?

 

Nothing you can say will change their minds. If you or they were able to discern any differences using A/B testing, they'd claim that it was due to the switches or wire splices or oxygen in the wires.

Bob Pease, a renowned and revered analog designer, once challenged an audiophile to do some blind testing. They declined.

I’ll try to ask him do blind testing next time then!

 

What do they connect to this power supply? Is it something that needs about 10Watts maximum? What is the output voltage?

The power cord is to power a R-2R DAC. I used the same power cord of the same guage as the so-call high-end one!

 

Really, you are wasting your time and aggravating yourself by trying to prove these people wrong. The importance of their beliefs is akin to a religion, and you will not win their respect, only their enmity, if you do prove them wrong.

I cannot advise you more strongly to walk away and satisfy yourself just with knowing you are correct.

 

Really, you are wasting your time and aggravating yourself by trying to prove these people wrong. The importance of their beliefs is akin to a religion, and you will not win their respect, only their enmity, if you do prove them wrong.

I cannot advise you more strongly to walk away and satisfy yourself just with knowing you are correct.

It’s better to know if anyone has ever tried to build LPS using audio-grade caps and did comparision to normal high-quality caps. It would be great objective evidences to show them that they are wrong!

 

I knew a guy who made very fancy looking audio amplifiers that had slightly quirky circuits, like the bias circuit for his output stage was powered by several AA cells -odd things like that. It seemed to me that he was not working very hard but making a very good living. Just imagine the joy his customers felt as they unpacked their new amplifiers and snapped in the new batteries.

 

I knew a guy who made very fancy looking audio amplifiers that had slightly quirky circuits, like the bias circuit for his output stage was powered by several AA cells -odd things like that. It seemed to me that he was not working very hard but making a very good living. Just imagine the joy his customers felt as they unpacked their new amplifiers and snapped in the new batteries.

The amplifier runs from battery? Sounds like a kid toy to me!

 

The amplifier runs from battery? Sounds like a kid toy to me!

No - the just the bias.
But it sounds like a recipe for trouble - the bias needs to be temperature compensated.
But one thing will happen. As the battery ages, its voltage will fall, the output stage will start to produce crossover distortion and sound bad.
They amplifier will the have to be sent off for a “service” where the batteries will be replaced (at considerable expense) - the new batteries will have a higher voltage, the crossover distortion will be gone, and the sound restored to its original quality.

 

The amplifier runs from battery? Sounds like a kid toy to me!

The bias circuit. Batteries would be the lowest noise power source with no concern about filtering. It sounds nice.

 

No - the just the bias.
But it sounds like a recipe for trouble - the bias needs to be temperature compensated.
But one thing will happen. As the battery ages, its voltage will fall, the output stage will start to produce crossover distortion and sound bad.
They amplifier will the have to be sent off for a “service” where the batteries will be replaced (at considerable expense) - the new batteries will have a higher voltage, the crossover distortion will be gone, and the sound restored to its original quality.

But Ian, it is PURE DC. Listen to that sound stage!

What? Oh, that's the other amp... Well this one is even better!

 

The bias circuit. Batteries would be the lowest noise power source with no concern about filtering. It sounds nice.

Batteries are actually quite noisy, as the current takes different paths as the chemical reactions proceed.

 

Batteries are actually quite noisy, as the current takes different paths as the chemical reactions proceed.

It is people like you who sample the magic. Real audiophile gear is very delicate, so delicate that it will even stop operating properly when someone like you, a non-believer without magic ears simply walks into the room. Heaven forfend you should take an measurements!

[EDIT: “…sample the magic”!? Sound poetic but it should be “trample”, as in step on mercilessly with the jackboots of science and logic. Not even a long, complicated explanation with exotic numerology… err math… and many, many secret words… err… technical terms is enough to satisfy you types. Some day, your demands for consistency and repeatability will come back to haunt me… err… you!]

 

The amplifier runs from battery? Sounds like a kid toy to me!

Not at the prices he was charging! I suspect the reason he used batteries in the bias circuit was the same reason Betty Crocker required the housewife (that job title did exist when I was a child) to add an egg to the cake mix when they could have included powdered egg in the mix packet is that it gave the housewife something important to do and that gave her personal pride in the cake itself. Egg, battery, same idea.

My point is that he made very exotic looking equipment and sold it for exotic prices. The buyer gets joy buying, setting up, and using it , the maker/seller makes money. It's a win for everybody even if it doesn't make sense from a technical point of view.

 

Not at the prices he was charging! I suspect the reason he used batteries in the bias circuit was the same reason Betty Crocker required the housewife (that job title did exist when I was a child) to add an egg to the cake mix when they could have included powdered egg in the mix packet is that it gave the housewife something important to do and that gave her personal pride in the cake itself. Egg, battery, same idea.

My point is that he made very exotic looking equipment and sold it for exotic prices. The buyer gets joy buying, setting up, and using it , the maker/seller makes money. It's a win for everybody even if it doesn't make sense from a technical point of view.

It is the business of the wealthy man
to give employment to the artisan.
H. Belloc.

 

By the way, I gave up entirely on this when I was researching "audiophile power cords" and came across a website by a prolific spewer of audiophilia who had a review of "the best 27(!)" such cords. In the review was a pull quote:

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Audio Bacon being him. This made it clear there is no way in, it is a closed system. I don't waste my time any more. This thread is "among friends" so to speak. By the way, he went on to say stuff like:

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There is just too much hard to believe goop, it's like a mind clot of audiophile nuttiness. But, it is just this sort of thing that should convince you debating is useless. To an audiophile of this sort, the truth can be measured, it can't be tested, and even their subjective experience in unreliable if any attempt is made to work out whether their assertions have any basis.

We are meant to simply be in new of the golden ears that can hear what science cannot measure, and what somehow they themselves cannot repeat if they don't know what they are listening to.

 

Are these people oblivious to the cable on the other side of the wall socket?