How to make a fan run with compressor?

cmartinez

Joined Jan 17, 2007
8,783
Well, now you've changed your request. Think, "energy budget". You have enough energy to make more ice or have a normal refrigerator. Do you see? Refrigerators aren't built with hidden capabilities that you merely have to tune up with special knowledge and slick tricks. If you want it all, leave it alone. It was already optimized to, "do it all", just not as much, "all" as you wish it could do.
Or, in simple words: "there's a limit to everything"...
 

Thread Starter

sdowney717

Joined Jul 18, 2012
805
If I can find a close on fall thermostat at setpoint of 20*F, I will try it.

The one labeled 1/2″ Sealed Thermal Switch (431-301A090) (F) is of interest.
http://www.senasys.com/shop/
http://www.senasys.com/shop/product...reset/12-sealed-thermal-switch-431-301a090-f/

These are 1/2 inch wide which would fit.
However what do you think about close on rise?
In an ice maker, these close on falling temp. Ice freezes colder and colder till it hits the setpoint of the thermostat, and it closes the circuit and begins the ejection process. So maybe the sensitivity would be screwy?

ideally an adjustable klixon thermostat would be nice.
 

#12

Joined Nov 30, 2010
18,224
In the Klixon language, F means it closes on a temperature rise. L means it opens on a temperature rise.
You're probably looking for an L-40-2
because it will open on a temperature rise past 40F and have a 20F hysteresis. Therefore, it must reset to closed at 20F.
 

Thread Starter

sdowney717

Joined Jul 18, 2012
805
Here is my improved bracket, it now has 3 big holes in the top to help let cold air onto the icemaker.
And I lowered the 2 fans so they blow directly onto the icemaker.
 

Thread Starter

sdowney717

Joined Jul 18, 2012
805

#12

Joined Nov 30, 2010
18,224
The ears are wrong. Even if you searched in an appliance parts site, you wouldn't find the right temperature.
Are you prepared to modify the bracket?
 

cmartinez

Joined Jan 17, 2007
8,783
You might as well blow air from a nozzle connected to an air compressor after all this bother...
Edit: I meant no offense, I'm just stating that maybe that would be more practical...
 

Thread Starter

sdowney717

Joined Jul 18, 2012
805
The ears are wrong. Even if you searched in an appliance parts site, you wouldn't find the right temperature.
Are you prepared to modify the bracket?
Yes, I called them, that bracket is removable.
My idea is measure mine, and see if it will fit in the hole. The hole is formed in the black plastic of the icemaker. That plastic bolts against the flat surface of the ice maker tray. Mine has ears, but simple to attach, make your own 'ears' with a small piece of copper wire runs across outside of thermostat to the screws to hold it against the ice maker tray. Also make sure some heat sink paste sits on the thermostat face where it matches to the ice maker tray.

The tech rep did say for an extra $35, they will make any temperature in any size you want. It is either going to be a 1/2 or a 3/4 thermostat. Looking at lots of web pics, the OEM thermostat looks bigger than 1/2 inch. I suppose if their 20*F thermostat is a tiny bit too big, I may be able to increase the original hole size and make it fit in there.

Adding some tutorials on icemakers
http://www.appliancerepair.net/refrigerator-repair-8.html

http://replacementicemaker.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Whirlpool-Ice-Maker-Install-PDF.pdf

http://www.applianceaid.com/icemaker-module.php
For modular icemaker says thermostat close at 17, open at 32
I have also seen 14 and 15 *F numbers for closing. First time I have seen an open number.

I think changing to a slightly warmer thermostat will shave minutes off a cycle, maybe 10 minutes for the fridge. This is an interesting project to me. I also have put 1/2 inch polyisocyanate foam boards covered both sides with aluminum foil under the fridge, and it seems to have helped. At the coldest setting, the compressor will now turn off for 2 minutes instead of run all the time, it is mostly empty for me to work on it. The compressor gets very hot, so hot you can not leave your hand on it and it sits right under the back of the fridge. I have not measured the temp but it feels like 130 *F hot water
 
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Thread Starter

sdowney717

Joined Jul 18, 2012
805
Updating the ice production, I have improved it. It makes an acceptable amount.
One way I did this was to make it run colder by adjusting the coarse temperature adjustment screw in the thermostat, turned it out 2 turns. That dropped the freezer temp about 5*F. That comes with consequences, the refrigerator section gets too cold and stuff freezes. So I think I may look more into that earlier referenced warmer icemaker thermostat. The way these fridges are made they share the same space between freezer and fridge. It might also mean I have to isolate the fridge from the freezer a little better, maybe by a close fit sheet of insulation under the tray. It will still drop cold air in front because it shares the same door. I still think optimally the best choice is a warmer thermostat. It must be a delicate balance between shedding of the cold to the environment by way of the exterior casing of the fridge to keep the fridge at the right temp and the cold production from the evaporator. All that is easier with separated compartments.

At least with warmer thermostat, the fridge can run as designed and not freeze the refrigerator section while still having ice production, is my thinking.


I also plan to add 1/2 inch aluminum faced polyisocyanurate foam board to the outside steel.
I can feel quite a bit of cold leaking out the fridge box itself. I assume that also part of the design, to keep the fridge from freezing, leak a certain amount of coldness and keep running the compressor to keep the freezer frozen. Consider that if the box leaked out zero coldness, then the entire box would eventually reach the same frozen temperature.

Anyhow, it is an interesting project.
 
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cmartinez

Joined Jan 17, 2007
8,783
Consider that if the box leaked out zero coldness ... Anyhow, it is an interesting project.
Don't mean to be annoying here, but I'm sure you meant "consider that if the box leaked in zero heat" ... I'm a meticulous engineer, ha ha ha... Anyway, yes it is indeed an interesting project. Congrats.
 

Thread Starter

sdowney717

Joined Jul 18, 2012
805
yes, I know what your saying about heat and cold, just easier for me to think that way.
I will run it as is for a few days, changing various things before I take it back to the boat. No way I could be as productive there like here at home.
 

Thread Starter

sdowney717

Joined Jul 18, 2012
805
I took out the icemaker thermostat. Taped 3 different temp probes onto the face and stuck it in the freezer to cool down to see what they read when it clicks on.
It is reading too low for the click on. Looking at the face it also has a small dent.
These are turn on, close temps in *F
house thermometer, Elenco meter reading in the middle, fish tank thermometer
0.0, 6, 9.1
1.5, 8, 8.6

These are turn off, open temps in *F
53.6, 51, 56.3
54.0, 50, 55.9

I know there is a thermal mass issue between probes and thermo housing.
I will order the warmer thermostat. there is about 1/8 difference in size between the thermostats. The hole in the black icemaker housing is 0.96 inch, so it can be easily opened to fit.
When I took out the icemaker, the mold had solid ice cubes all the way through frozen, and had not ejected them. So IMO, the thermostat is set to cold, maybe even defective.

It was a new item open box ebay purchase..
 
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#12

Joined Nov 30, 2010
18,224
Your, "clicks on" temperatures are typical for an off-the-shelf ice maker. Not broken.

And I am not bothered by people calling heat flow backwards. That's the same as saying, "let the vacuum out". Meh. Some people are meticulous. If you know you're being obtuse, I can get along with it.
 

cmartinez

Joined Jan 17, 2007
8,783
Is there a small fan out there in the market capable of working inside the fridge for prolonged periods of time?

I'm asking this because it just occurred to me that you could completely isolate the freezer from the fridge, and have a fan circulate air on demand from the freezer, through the fridge, and back into the freezer. This fan could be installed in the thermal-barrier and could be activated by a second thermostat placed in the fridge section... that way you'd get optimum results, I think. From my point of view, this wouldn't be too complicated, but of course it all would depend on the proper fan being used for this purpose.
 

#12

Joined Nov 30, 2010
18,224
Is there a small fan out there in the market capable of working inside the fridge for prolonged periods of time?
Certainly. Most refrigerators have one (shaded pole). Anything that can survive 0 F and blow enough CFM will do. The not-freezer thermostat will stop the fan when it's cold enough down there.
 

cmartinez

Joined Jan 17, 2007
8,783
Certainly. Most refrigerators have one (shaded pole). Anything that can survive 0 F and blow enough CFM will do. The not-freezer thermostat will stop the fan when it's cold enough down there.
Well then, there you go... this little addition to our friend's system would certainly gild the lily
 

Thread Starter

sdowney717

Joined Jul 18, 2012
805
I suppose that is a possibility. I might also put some foam sheet under the tray and close seal it to the inside of the fridge. That will only let cold air fall down the front inside by the door. Anyway going to work through this in stages, first will be getting the warmer thermostat. Those 12vdc PC fans ran the whole time at 0*F and less without stopping. I have lots in various sizes, some are 5 inches wide.
My goal is to also be able to make ice faster, not just make some ice. Goal is to turn water into ice at an hour or less per cycle.
I timed our Hotpoint side by side. 45 to 50 minutes per cycle if no one opens the door. Around dinner time if door is opening a lot, that time increases up to 1.5 hours per cycle.

Somewhere I do have another refrigerator thermostat with the dial and long copper tube.
 
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killivolt

Joined Jan 10, 2010
836
I don't know if I'll have time to read your "Thread" but I'm glad I found it.

Takes me back to my Refrigeration days; I did commercial and residential. It's been over 20 years now. Domestic refrigerators today are not liked they used be; more electronics.

Good Luck on your project.

With 3 pages and #12's help with all the others. I obviously have nothing to add.

But; might make a good read.

Happy Holidays,

kv

I've worked on and installed many Ice Makers for people. Thats what took me back:)
 
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