My wife is in a convalescence/rehab place with a badly broken knee. They locked down the place today, no visitors for 2 weeks. One of her nurses that refused the vaccine came down with the (deleted by moderator). The place allowed him to work without the vaccine but had to be checked very other day, yesterday he was positive. None of the patients there are too happy not get any visitation for 2 weeks.

 

To further the above post, I asked my youngest son if he got the jab. No was his answer. When I asked why he told me some thing I haven't sen yet! It seems that he and his family, my grandkids, won't get the vaccine be cause ALL of them were created using "fetal cells from aborted fetuses". Supposedly for testing and even to come up with the formulas. Anyone else seen that some where?

 

Just curious, why are you so fiercely defending this particular company?

I don’t think he is so much defending the companies, but defending his own sanity from people making gross, unsupported claims based on logical fallacies.

 

yes, but here someone is trying to make that decision for me and force me (if i don't want the risk) regardless how insignificant perceived "extra layer for protection" is even if it only may benefit others and put me at risk.

Yes, but you perceive a risk that others have concluded doesn’t exist. Some people are more susceptible to propaganda than others. I don’t know for sure if you are. I got vaccinated because it helps me. I wear a mask because it helps me, even by improving my sense of self worth because I exhibit empathy.

Those who obsess over THEIR rights, the possibility that THEY may be the one to get sick from side effects, the imaginary attack on THEIR rights… I personally have no use for.

 

Yes, but you perceive a risk that others have concluded doesn’t exist. Some people are more susceptible to propaganda than others. I don’t know for sure if you are. I got vaccinated because it helps me. I wear a mask because it helps me, even by improving my sense of self worth because I exhibit empathy.

Those who obsess over THEIR rights, the possibility that THEY may be the one to get sick from side effects, the imaginary attack on THEIR rights… I personally have no use for.

As already stated, risks are different for male/female. A risk for a 30 year old male is different than a risk for a 70 year old male. And so on.

Anyone under 40 should fully question these directives. You can tell which group is represented here (no offense).

Perhaps we will be able to find out the truth of what happened in the last 2 years in 10 or 20 years from now, not sooner. Like with TSA measure, or with the wallstreet bailout. Problem is, events today have much more dire consequences.

 

To further the above post, I asked my youngest son if he got the jab. No was his answer. When I asked why he told me some thing I haven't sen yet! It seems that he and his family, my grandkids, won't get the vaccine be cause ALL of them were created using "fetal cells from aborted fetuses". Supposedly for testing and even to come up with the formulas. Anyone else seen that some where?

Doctors talk about fetal cells and the vaccine in videos in Google. 38 years ago fetal cells were used to test vaccines. Pfizer and Maderna Covid-19 vaccines do not use fetal cells in their vaccines but Astrazenica and J+J do use them in their vaccines.

 

DDT, asbestos, lead cans and lead water piping, various now illegal drugs, etc. were all thought as beneficial initially. we still have to see what the long term effects of the vaccines are.

This is a false equivalency fallacy - Lead cans and vaccines are quite different... Conclusions from one thing do not apply to the other

So according to the CDC itself only about 5% of deaths recorded list Covid as the ONLY contributing factor. Which of course means that the actual number across the entire US could well be less than 38,000!

This is an argument from ignorance - i.e. We can prove it is not 'X', so it is definately 'X'.

 

https://www.science.org/content/art...leads-criminal-charges-researcher-philippines

Dengvaxia and the covid-19 vaccines are different and conclusions from one do not apply to the other.

This is a false equivalency fallacy and arguably a strawman fallacy.

 

This is an argument from ignorance - i.e. We can prove it is not 'X', so it is definately 'X'.

The point is if deaths aren't even being recorded properly (and they most definitely are NOT) then it's anyone's guess what the actual numbers are. I have personally spoken with several doctors about this and they have confirmed the problem.

As far as most hospitals go it's actually to their advantage to put COVID as a contributing factor towards the cause of death simply because it equates to MORE MONEY for them. It's basic economics really...

 

In Canada the media is claiming that the vaccines were never intended to stop a Covid infection they were only meant to reduce the severity of the symptoms and reduce the chances of hospitalization. That is a lie. We were bombarded for well over a year with a campaign to get people to get vaccinated to protect us from infection. Why has the story changed? Why are they lying to us.

 

In Canada the media is claiming that the vaccines were never intended to stop a Covid infection they were only meant to reduce the severity of the symptoms and reduce the chances of hospitalization. That is a lie. We were bombarded for well over a year with a campaign to get people to get vaccinated to protect us from infection. Why has the story changed? Why are they lying to us.

Thinking back to early days, about a year ago, the pharma companies never claimed to prevent infections, only to stop them before symptoms showed up in a large percentage of the patients reducing the need for hospitalization, and to reduce the chances of death. Many people grabbed the idea of vaccinations making them bullet proof which eventually lead to the disappointment we are experiencing today.

As I pointed out a long time ago, if you don't get the virus inside your body, how is the immunity generated by the vaccine supposed to "do its stuff"? Maybe "immunity" is a misnomer giving rise to unrealistic expectations.

 

Pfizer and Maderna Covid-19 vaccines do not use fetal cells in their vaccines but Astrazenica and J+J do use them in their vaccines.

Well why don't we just ask someone at Pfizer about that?

 

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7043e2.htm

By September 21, 2021, an estimated 182 million persons in the United States were fully vaccinated against COVID-19.* Clinical trials indicate that Pfizer-BioNTech (BNT162b2), Moderna (mRNA-1273), and Janssen (Johnson & Johnson; Ad.26.COV2.S) vaccines are effective and generally well tolerated (1–3). However, daily vaccination rates have declined approximately 78% since April 13, 2021†; vaccine safety concerns have contributed to vaccine hesitancy (4). A cohort study of 19,625 nursing home residents found that those who received an mRNA vaccine (Pfizer-BioNTech or Moderna) had lower all-cause mortality than did unvaccinated residents (5), but no studies comparing mortality rates within the general population of vaccinated and unvaccinated persons have been conducted. To assess mortality not associated with COVID-19 (non–COVID-19 mortality) after COVID-19 vaccination in a general population setting, a cohort study was conducted during December 2020–July 2021 among approximately 11 million persons enrolled in seven Vaccine Safety Datalink (VSD) sites.§ After standardizing mortality rates by age and sex, this study found that COVID-19 vaccine recipients had lower non–COVID-19 mortality than did unvaccinated persons. After adjusting for demographic characteristics and VSD site, this study found that adjusted relative risk (aRR) of non–COVID-19 mortality for the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine was 0.41 (95% confidence interval [CI] = 0.38–0.44) after dose 1 and 0.34 (95% CI = 0.33–0.36) after dose 2. The aRRs of non–COVID-19 mortality for the Moderna vaccine were 0.34 (95% CI = 0.32–0.37) after dose 1 and 0.31 (95% CI = 0.30–0.33) after dose 2. The aRR after receipt of the Janssen vaccine was 0.54 (95% CI = 0.49–0.59). There is no increased risk for mortality among COVID-19 vaccine recipients. This finding reinforces the safety profile of currently approved COVID-19 vaccines in the United States.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/us/covid-cases.html

• The country is averaging about 75,000 new cases a day. That’s fewer than half as many as were being reported in early September, but about five times as many as were being identified in June, before the Delta variant had spread widely.
• Deaths and hospitalizations are also declining sharply. More than 50,000 coronavirus patients are hospitalized nationwide and around 1,500 deaths are being reported each day.
• Case numbers have remained persistently high in many Western states. Alaska, Montana, Wyoming and Idaho lead the country in recent cases per capita.
• Only three states — Vermont, New Hampshire and Colorado — are averaging more cases now than they were two weeks ago.
• The situation in the South continues to improve. Florida, which averaged more than 20,000 cases a day during much of August, is now reporting around 2,200 new infections daily and has one of the lowest per capita rates in the nation.

 

Well why don't we just ask someone at Pfizer about that?

Well I did some quick research into the "fetal cells" thing. Seems that that cell line is back from the 1960s or 70's from the Netherlands. Any and all of the cells used today are lab grown from that small group of cells. so while they are technically fetal cells they aren't being harvested today.

I do remember when my kids were born we signed a paper allowing the hospital to "dispose" of the placenta. I knew the doctor pretty well, his wife was one of our babysitters growing up, and he said they were sold to a company the then sold them to "scientists". Have no idea what they were used for though.

 

The vaccines were not made for the new Delta variant from India, They were made for the original alpha virus from China. The vaccines worked very well preventing the original virus and worked fairly well preventing the beta variant from the UK.

In Ontario, Canada today there are 370 new infections of the delta variant and 247 of those people are not vaccinated and most will be sent to the hospital with severe illness. 123 fully vaccinated people will be at home with minor symptoms or with no symptoms.
Today, 84% of eligible people in Ontario, Canada are fully vaccinated.

 

Well I did some quick research into the "fetal cells" thing. Seems that that cell line is back from the 1960s or 70's from the Netherlands. Any and all of the cells used today are lab grown from that small group of cells. so while they are technically fetal cells they aren't being harvested today.

I do remember when my kids were born we signed a paper allowing the hospital to "dispose" of the placenta. I knew the doctor pretty well, his wife was one of our babysitters growing up, and he said they were sold to a company the then sold them to "scientists". Have no idea what they were used for though.

Regardless. It is nonetheless rather odd that she would run away from the reporter as she did. IMO her body language speaks volumes. She is trying to avoid ANY questions whatsoever and in fact so much so that she seems to have worked herself into a state of panic! Would any REASONABLE PERSON react in such a way? Most likely NOT.

 

To further the above post, I asked my youngest son if he got the jab. No was his answer. When I asked why he told me some thing I haven't sen yet! It seems that he and his family, my grandkids, won't get the vaccine be cause ALL of them were created using "fetal cells from aborted fetuses". Supposedly for testing and even to come up with the formulas. Anyone else seen that some where?

Yes, as a matter of fact I have, and I researched it a little bit a few months ago. The fetal cells themselves were not used to develop the vaccine, but they were use rather for testing purposes. But not ALL vaccines were tested that way, to my knowledge, Astra Zeneca's wasn't, for instance. Also, AZ is a "viral vector" type of vaccine, and not the mRna type that so many people (in their ignorance) have criticized so much.

 

Dengvaxia and the covid-19 vaccines are different and conclusions from one do not apply to the other.

This is a false equivalency fallacy and arguably a strawman fallacy.

That is not the point of the post. There are other very interesting cases with vaccine approvals for example, but you wouldnt want to look at what happened, because "strawman".

 

This is a false equivalency fallacy - Lead cans and vaccines are quite different... Conclusions from one thing do not apply to the other

really...? it is very much the same if one if forced through some mandate the consume food that comes from lead cans.

many products were introduced and used on wide scale out of belief that they are great. recognizing problems associated with them often came later (too late). these vaccines were created with massive public funding. you would think that products obtained through public funding for general wellbeing of all humans would be open source and discussed freely.

the problem is not that Covid vaccines are offered. problem is that big pharma along with EVERYONE involved is constantly lying about them and then some political dummy tries to make it mandatory. " it is safe" but "cannot discuss side effects". any reported numbers are highly skewed and clearly manipulated. any mention of other treatments (not experimental ones, medication that has been approved for YEARS) is immediately shut down, despite wide successes in those "other countries where medical care is inferior".
people who were on the frontlines dealing with covid patients for two years, and continue to do so, have seen first hand what the success of different treatments are. but they are muzzled and fired unless they get the experimental jab themselves. what a way to treat heroes....

 

really...? it is very much the same if one if forced through some mandate the consume food that comes from lead cans.

many products were introduced and used on wide scale out of belief that they are great. recognizing problems associated with them often came later (too late). these vaccines were created with massive public funding. you would think that products obtained through public funding for general wellbeing of all humans would be open source and discussed freely.

the problem is not that Covid vaccines are offered. problem is that big pharma along with EVERYONE involved is constantly lying about them and then some political dummy tries to make it mandatory. " it is safe" but "cannot discuss side effects". any reported numbers are highly skewed and clearly manipulated. any mention of other treatments (not experimental ones, medication that has been approved for YEARS) is immediately shut down, despite wide successes in those "other countries where medical care is inferior".
people who were on the frontlines dealing with covid patients for two years, and continue to do so, have seen first hand what the success of different treatments are. but they are muzzled and fired unless they get the experimental jab themselves. what a way to treat heroes....

Maybe the reason your side has failed to make much traction is that people have heard and know all of what you're trying to sell but honestly think it's BS created by a few malcontents with an ax to grind on a host of other issues and are just using known vaccination risks to scare the gullible.