Well, it's the rules. We've all agreed to them when we signed up. I've had many of my posts removed/modified. Those who don't follow/agree the rules should move on.

 

Both of those are CYA boilerplate and would probably be pulled out only in the case of someone that was one the verge of getting banned but not quite there yet. It also provides cover for when spammers are summarily banned (which happens many times a day).

 

Both of those are CYA boilerplate and would probably be pulled out only in the case of someone that was one the verge of getting banned but not quite there yet. It also provides cover for when spammers are summarily banned (which happens many times a day).

Since we've both had posts removed and moderated, I'd say your statement is incorrect.

 

I re-read the tribute as well. There are several paragraphs that I would have found extremely offending several years ago when I was younger, less understanding and less forgiving. Today I would just view these paragraphs as short sighted and arrogant and will let it go. I believe these are the paragraphs that prompted the moderator to react.

This is an international forum. After re-reading the post several times, I find the post extremely patriotic (which is good), but with a subtle threat which will be misinterpreted by international members. Even I have a hard time stepping back

 

There are several paragraphs that I would have found extremely offending...

... with a subtle threat which will be misinterpreted by international members.

I honestly cannot imagine how either impression is possible. I'm as certain as I can be, not being the author, that no offense or threat was implied. You are clearly not alone in your interpretation - Mr.Chips saw something to raise an eyebrow - and I'm not challenging you, just trying to convey befuddlement that a memorial could be seen as anything else.

Kudos to Mr.Chips for stepping up to identify his role as Mod in this issue. I see no reason to accept his resignation.

 

Since we've both had posts removed and moderated, I'd say your statement is incorrect.

I've actually had very few, I'd guess less than a half dozen, removed and most of those was because leaving them would have been confusing because there would have been no context.

But be that as it may, I don't recall any of them (including yours) being removed and either of those reasons being given as the justification.

 

I honestly cannot imagine how either impression is possible. I'm as certain as I can be, not being the author, that no offense or threat was implied. You are clearly not alone in your interpretation - Mr.Chips saw something to raise an eyebrow - and I'm not challenging you, just trying to convey befuddlement that a memorial could be seen as anything else.

Kudos to Mr.Chips for stepping up to identify his role as Mod in this issue. I see no reason to accept his resignation.

kv

 

I re-read the tribute as well. There are several paragraphs that I would have found extremely offending several years ago when I was younger, less understanding and less forgiving. Today I would just view these paragraphs as short sighted and arrogant and will let it go. I believe these are the paragraphs that prompted the moderator to react.

This is an international forum. After re-reading the post several times, I find the post extremely patriotic (which is good), but with a subtle threat which will be misinterpreted by international members. Even I have a hard time stepping back

I'd sure like to know which paragraphs you felt were so short sighted and arrogant. Seriously.

Also, given the very first line where I explicitly pointed out that this is an international forum and that I invited everyone to apply the same thoughts to their own nations, it's hard to see how what I then said could reasonably be taken as a threat. Again, please explain the reasoning if you would care to.

 

Kudos to Mr.Chips for stepping up to identify his role as Mod in this issue. I see no reason to accept his resignation.

I agree -- It seems much of this is issue of misunderstanding based upon timing of posts and PMs --- Then too there is that liability owed 'the one great weakness' of textual communication, to wit lack of cues -- not the least of which is tone of voice...

Sincerely
HP

 

But be that as it may, I don't recall any of them (including yours) being removed and either of those reasons being given as the justification.

Justification is delineated in the TOS, and as such, need not be spelled out when a post is moderated. The TOS clearly states that a reason is not required to be offered.

 

I will elaborate because asked...

The following paragraph:

"As for the debt we owe them - we can never pay it back, for they are gone. So we must pay it forward. We must make it known to the world that we are willing to step up an be counted if and when the time comes to secure these freedoms for our children and future generations - and we must accept that the price for it might be dear. Only by taking on this mantle of responsibility can we even begin to earn the gift we have received."

Despite the opening line "I know this is an international forum, so please feel free to apply this to your nation's fallen as well.", once you inserted "America" in the post, it became distinctly American and it is hard to get away from that feeling. Coming to the last paragraph, especially considering the state of the world right now, I can no-longer apply your tribute to myself. And have to fight negative feelings about it.

Why you ask?

- I am russian
- US has continuously disrespected my grandparents who died protecting the world during WWII by ignoring their contribution and acting as world saviour
- As far as the threat part, I do not appreciate the statement of making it known to the world that America will fight for its freedom. Who is threatening its freedom? Currently USA is the aggressor in the eyes of many...

Now, before this thread is closed - these are my personal feelings and most of you will be quite surprised by this reaction to a single paragraph. Normally this would not be so, but the world is in a sorry state right now and it is easy to get carried away. I believe that we should all be careful about how we express ourselves. It became an issue of interpreting personal tribute within a context of current political situation...

I think the post would be truly applicable to any member if the word America was not in it. It then becomes a statement about ANY nation and ALL of that nation's fallen veterans. That one word negated the invitation to apply it to other nations.

I apologize if this is out of line. Please feel free to PM me if you have any questions.

 

most of you will be quite surprised by this reaction to a single paragraph.

For what it's worth, I'm not surprised at all, and I knew which paragraph was going to cause issues before you mentioned it. I'm also sure that was the reason it was moderated, though nobody has said it. That paragraph stuck me as odd and troublesome too. I don't think that a day set aside to remember those who have sacrificed should be a day to remind the world of anything, other than reverence for our fallen.

I think you're gonna get a lot of flack for this from the same members who have been outspoken so far. Keep in mind, it is a pretty small group of people, compared to the total membership, and not everyone borne American agrees with them.

 

I think you're gonna get a lot of flack for this from the same members who have been outspoken so far. Keep in mind, it is a pretty small group of people, compared to the total membership, and not everyone borne American agrees with them.

He won't get an argument from me. He has a right to his opinion, and I respect him for that.

I also know he's correct when he stated "some in the world think the US is an aggressor nation," and I'm sure I can find some right here in the US that agrees with that statement. I don't think the US is an aggressor, but that is my opinion. Each side could offer aggressive acts towards and from the U.S.

In this world, there are people that disagree with those of other countries. That is nothing new. Without delving into the politics everyone has differing opinions of their country and other countries.

Mr Chips and WBahn could have worked this out back channel and I for one didn't need to know who the moderator was. I don't think he needs to resign either. Yes I called for his resignation in option 2 but only option 1 needed to be exercised.

I thank Mr Chips for stepping up and filling in the blanks. I wish he would reconsider his resignation.

Moderators don't have absolute power. Only Dave has that. Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

 

It would be deeply troubling to some of us if a certain fundamentalist organization member posted a tribute to the "martyrs" who perished in their current holy war. Would the mods now be potentially obliged to allow the post to stand?

 

justtrying,

There are so many unsung heroes of WWII we may never discover them all. Those with the power to buy the history books determines what the children learn. But then, we delve into politics at the local level on who is influencing the school boards purchases.

Armistice Day, the 11th hour of the 11th day, of the 11th month, was renamed to Veterans day here in the states. Originally celebrated the end of WWI.

The history of the world is an undiscovered country. Only through the venues like here, do we share some information. In fact, there is a American woman I know who is writing about "night witches". When she gave me the rough story, I told her to definitely pursue it. Everyone needs to know of heroes. The night witches was the nickname the Germans gave the Russian women pilots who, using bi-planes, would cut their engines, and dive bomb the enemy positions. The "swoosh" sound of them flying by gave them their nickname. I told the woman to write to Putin to get some original material to include in her book. I also told her to visit the archives in DC to see what she can find there. She has authored two books so far, and is excited to pursue this one. I hope she completes it. Heroic stories need to be told. Up to the point when she told the story, I had never heard of the "night witches".

 

It would be deeply troubling to some of us if a certain fundamentalist organization member posted a tribute to the "martyrs" who perished in their current holy war. Would the mods now be potentially obliged to allow the post to stand?

I actually thought about that in years past. How would I respond if such an organization published a tribute to their dead? And I remembered those Union veterans decorating Confederate graves just three years after the Civil War. I'm willing to let them mourn and even honor their dead, even though I am utterly opposed to what they are fighting for.

 

thank you Joe, for going off topic

Nadezhda Popova flew 852 combat missions. And yes, Washington Post did an article about her in 2013 when she passed away, so i have hope

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...61fb1a-ea3c-11e2-a301-ea5a8116d211_story.html

 

I will elaborate because asked...

The following paragraph:

"As for the debt we owe them - we can never pay it back, for they are gone. So we must pay it forward. We must make it known to the world that we are willing to step up an be counted if and when the time comes to secure these freedoms for our children and future generations - and we must accept that the price for it might be dear. Only by taking on this mantle of responsibility can we even begin to earn the gift we have received."

Despite the opening line "I know this is an international forum, so please feel free to apply this to your nation's fallen as well.", once you inserted "America" in the post, it became distinctly American and it is hard to get away from that feeling. Coming to the last paragraph, especially considering the state of the world right now, I can no-longer apply your tribute to myself. And have to fight negative feelings about it.

Why you ask?

- I am russian
- US has continuously disrespected my grandparents who died protecting the world during WWII by ignoring their contribution and acting as world saviour
- As far as the threat part, I do not appreciate the statement of making it known to the world that America will fight for its freedom. Who is threatening its freedom? Currently USA is the aggressor in the eyes of many...

Now, before this thread is closed - these are my personal feelings and most of you will be quite surprised by this reaction to a single paragraph. Normally this would not be so, but the world is in a sorry state right now and it is easy to get carried away. I believe that we should all be careful about how we express ourselves. It became an issue of interpreting personal tribute within a context of current political situation...

I think the post would be truly applicable to any member if the word America was not in it. It then becomes a statement about ANY nation and ALL of that nation's fallen veterans. That one word negated the invitation to apply it to other nations.

I apologize if this is out of line. Please feel free to PM me if you have any questions.

And how is it that you cannot apply that paragraph to your own nation. Are you NOT willing to stand up and be counted if and when the time comes to secure those freedoms for your children and future generations? If you are not, then that is on you.

As for the US ignoring the Soviet contribution to WWII, I would love to compare history books (I really would -- I think it would be very interesting and enlightening). Even though I grew up during the latter part of the Cold War, all of my history books spent a pretty considerable part of their treatment of WWII on the Soviet involvement and contributions -- and the great human toll suffered by the Soviet Union by both military and civilian populations.

 

What kinda resignation. ?
Did the forum hired them ?
Don't think so. I see no reason anyone to leave just because there was a disagreement.
Human disagree all the time but that does not mean we have to leave them alone and move on.
I for one will not accept any long term and good members leaving.
It will be our loss if members like WBahn or Chips leaves.

 

There are many very intelligent members here, and big egos often accompany big intellects.

The tendency of intelligent people is to assume that their point of view is naturally correct, and if sufficiently explained, will be accepted. Of course, as we have seen, this is not always the case. In matters of electronics, these differences of opinion are often debated, sometimes heatedly, but they don't often raise the emotions that political topics do. Yet, the tendency of many intelligent people is to believe that they can avoid alienating others with their opinions because of their superior intellect and expository skills. As we have seen from recent events and postings, this belief is incorrect.

If this is to be an international forum, we must put nationalistic views aside in all our postings. We don't have to give up those views, but we should not use this forum as a platform for publishing them, no matter how lofty our motives. As I have often posted, none of us are aware of the extent of our own personal lack of knowledge and understanding. And one of the multitude of things we don't know is how and why people of other nations truly feel the way they do about our own nation. We can rationalize and try to justify our opinion based on our own life experiences, but in the end, our opinion is only that...our opinion, and in matters of politics, serves no productive purpose by being posted here.

And, of course, that is just my opinion.