The above two links refer to forum posts that are 12 years old and 10 years old. Have you got any recent information on quality?





I have found the alignment and overall boards very good.

 

Let’s do a sanity check on labor cost being responsible for the difference in price between US and China fir OCB fabrication.

I calculated a difference of over $1 / in^2.

I looked up manufacturing wages in the two countries, and it is about $15 / hr in the US vs $5 in China. That is a difference of $10 per hour, so it would require 1/10 of an hour of labor per square inch to explain the difference in price.

I can produce a 10 in^2 board at home in less than an hour, so the PCB manufacturers would have to be just as inefficient as my truly labor intensive home fabrication. That is not credible.

Bob

 

The above two links refer to forum posts that are 12 years old and 10 years old. Have you got any recent information on quality?





I have found the alignment and overall boards very good.

Those links were posted in 2020. Some of my most recent boards from them have been better but I also usually upgrade the FR-4 and finish on boards that might be used in a industrial application like the PIC32MK board on top.

BMX160 IMU solder tabs.

 

Diagnostic board from OSHPark. Default quality from them. As usual very good.


The board was sized and large connectors (X10) placed to match an OEM power supply control board in some 30+ year old equipment still in heavy daily use.

 

Diagnostic board in operation.

Software DEV station running Linux.

Operation and bare diag boards

HV tube shunt regulator.

Connectors from the OEM board connected to the new DIAG board with serial port I/O connector. It's just 'floating' above the normal board for testing.


The trusty old analog meter for calibration I/V scaling factors.

Static 1000V output testing with an early version of the board software.
https://github.com/nsaspook/ps_tester/tree/v1.9/ps_test.X

 

V2 of the DIAG board from OSHPARK with enhanced troubleshooting capabilities for several types of OEM power supplies using the serial port command processor.

 

With OSH Park pc boards, I found using IPA to clean them does not work well, it seems to attack the soldermask and make it flat, dull looking.

 

With OSH Park pc boards, I found using IPA to clean them does not work well, it seems to attack the soldermask and make it flat, dull looking.

I don't understand the fascination/fandom.

 

I don't understand the fascination/fandom.

I use their boards because they are better by most objective standards. If a board failure causes machine downtime the cost savings of a cheaper pcb will vaporize in a few minutes.

 

better by most objective standards

I'm not getting it. If they are objective, share the numbers with a board recently made by your favorite foil - JLCPCB. Not a board made before they set up their new shop - a recent board from the past three years.

 

I'm not getting it. If they are objective, share the numbers with a board recently made by your favorite foil - JLCPCB. Not a board made before they set up their new shop - a recent board from the past three years.

The thread subject is:
PCB prototyping and manufacturing in the USA

but here are some recent examples of JLCPCB boards I've ordered. Perfectly good for a hobby level PCB at the default quality but not equal to OSHPark even with upgrades.
https://forum.allaboutcircuits.com/...-manufacturing-in-the-usa.185238/post-1713099



JLCPCB default quality



OSHPark default quality.

 

better by most objective standards.

My objective standard is IPC class 2 as the minimum quality - and JLCPCB meets those specs. Better quality is available from JLCPCB. OSHPARK does not list a quality standard on their website. So, since no numbers are available (even when asked twice) - the phrase "objective standards" really seems to be subjective, personal opinion, wishful thinking and fandom standards

 

My objective standard is IPC class 2 as the minimum quality - and JLCPCB meets those specs. Better quality is available from JLCPCB. OSHPARK does not list a quality standard on their website. So, since no numbers are available (even when asked twice) - the phrase "objective standards" really seems to be subjective, personal opinion, wishful thinking and fandom standards

Some people have higher standards than others.

Yes, proud to be a fan and a supporter of a good business doing quality work.

I've selected and evaluated the JLCPCB product many times and will continue to use it on hobby-grade projects.

 

Some people have higher standards than others.

Yes, proud to be a fan and a supporter of a good business doing quality work.

I've selected and evaluated the JLCPCB product many times and will continue to use it on hobby-grade projects.

View attachment 264787

Glad to hear that you realize you are mis-using the term "objective standards".

 

Glad to hear that you realize you are mis-using the term "objective standards".

No I'm not misusing the term. My top "objective standard" is that the board work as designed and built. I've have board failures with JLCPCB boards on fine-pitch traces even with their upgrades. I could care less about some IPC class 2 standard listed on a website if the actual stuff they make is inferior and fails in the field.

JLCPCB trace repair after operational failure of a signal trace to a SPI port from a PIC32 TQFP-100 part.




It opened somewhere between the via and a inner trace. I've not had this problem with less critical line-widths on their boards.

These boards are all JLCPCB. I use them but I also know their production quality limitations.

 

i have to say my boards including ones from JLC are all sparkling clean. that board is clearly dirty and corroded. looks like it may have spent some time exposed to elements. are you sure that failure after such experience can be attributed to the PCB manufacturer? you did mention quality difference and of course there will one given the bargain price JLC offers. but comparing el cheapo PCB with tin finish that spent some moths at the bottom of the lake with a shiny and new gold finish PCB is not exactly fair.

btw. i like your camera/monitor setup... i need to upgrade mine.

 

i have to say my boards including ones from JLC are all sparkling clean. that board is clearly dirty and corroded. looks like it may have spent some time exposed to elements. are you sure that failure after such experience can be attributed to the PCB manufacturer? you did mention quality difference and of course there will one given the bargain price JLC offers. but comparing el cheapo PCB with tin finish that spent some moths at the bottom of the lake with a shiny and new gold finish PCB is not exactly fair.

btw. i like your camera/monitor setup... i need to upgrade mine.

I can't figure out how the spots, dust and grime were so evenly dispersed yet randomly sized to get this effect (or why).

photo zoomed in from post 35.

 

maybe similar to this.

 

PCB prototyping and manufacturing is getting more popular in the USA
They are putting on a whole new look.

Smart Community Plan Developed by Japanese and U.S. Students on the TOMODACHI Toshiba Science & Technology Leadership Academy | TOMODACHI (usjapantomodachi.org)

 

https://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/2022-02/ICT Supply Chain Report_0.pdf

Heavy dependence on U.S. defense contracts. U.S. PCB manufacturing companies often are small and medium sized businesses that do not have the capacity for large scale production, nor do they have the capital to purchase additional equipment, so they concentrate on specialty PCBs for defense, medical, or industrial use. While U.S. manufacturers have an advantage in quality, performance, and lead time, they struggle to complete on price. Many U.S. producers say they would not survive without defense contracts.58 Thus, beginning in 2023, Section 808 of the National Defense Authorization Act (FY 2021) prohibits the Department of Defense (DoD) from sourcing PCBs from China and other covered nations without a waiver.59 However, focusing solely on PCB production for DoD will not create the economies of scale to re-develop a significant PCB industrial base for commercial uses in the United States. In summary, PCBs are essential for the electronic functions of ICT hardware as well as for a wide array of automotive, defense, and medical devices. In the past 20 years China has overtaken the U.S. as the global leader in PCB manufacturing and sales. The small PCB industry left in the U.S. leads in quality and performance, but lack efficiencies created by automation technologies. Thus, the market has become specialized and dependent on government and defense procurement and limited production for highly regulated specialty electronics for medical and industrial use. U.S. PCB facilities must overcome these risks for long-term viability.