And one website I visited recommended getting a $210 battery for my car.
I didn't do that, and the car starts just fine with a $96 battery.
My first multimeter
- Thread starter Macnerd
- Start date
I didn't do that, and the car starts just fine with a $96 battery.
Could you say that again with less words?
You can't believe everything you read on the WEB. It depends on your requirements. Since you're just starting out, and this is a hobby, it's highly unlikely that you'll be working on anything that requires a calibrated meter.
That's already been covered within the past month.
With labor costs what they are these days, you're better off using an inexpensive meter and having several to compare readings.
I have several frequency counters and all are long past their calibrate dates. I don't care. They all read within a fraction of a percent of each other and that's good enough for the work I do.
And by now you could have had a couple free meters from Harbor Freight and been doing things instead of vacillating back and forth about what you want for your first meter.
cornishlad
- Joined Jul 31, 2013
- 242
Some random thoughts to someone like the OP. Don't get hung up on accuracy. Most of them mainly get used for measuring Voltages. The apparent presentation of accuracy to 2 decimal places is an illusion and it's unnecessary. The only auto-ranging one I've come across take too long to give a stable reading. DMM's don't give good results if the volts or current are varying as you measure. Several generations of engineers managed ok measuring volts to " 12 and a bit etc" on analogue meters and also they are very good when the volts are constantly changing. Get a DMM that turns itself off after a period of non-use (especially valid if you've got several). Get one that has easy access to the battery compartment and doesn't require opening the whole b***y thing thing with tiny screws that will soon loose their thread. You can't beat a DMM for measuring resistance. And if you intend working on logic circuits get a logic probe as well - google "diy logic probe" to make one as you first project !
But I'm hardly ever right.....
But I'm hardly ever right.....
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Sorry. It won't be less words but more words.
There are 2 kinds of meters. Ones that can't be calibrated & ones than can be calibrated. DMMs that can be calibrated are more expensive than those which can't be calibrated. If I get a DMM that can't be calibrated, how will I know that it is out of calibration? It has to be compared to a standard. I can spend money to get a DMM that can be calibrated. But then I'd have to spend more money to get it periodically re-calibrated! How do I know that a meter that can be calibrated needs to be calibrated? It has to be compared to a standard. HMMM! Interesting! A company charges more to sell a DMM that can be calibrated & also charges to have the DMM calibrated! Capitalists!
You guys are right. You got me thinking. Let's see. In the 1st year, I buy a meter that can be calibrated & at the end of the year, I pay to have it re-calibrated. And that's not cheap. I should get a DMM that can't be calibrated & save my money. Which brings me back to a previous question. How do I know that a meter is out of calibration? It has to be compared to a standard. What tests do I perform? I want one that is accurate. I don't want a cheap, inaccurate, disposable meter. You know the old saying-you get what you pay for.
Demonstrably not true. I have a half dozen meters I've paid exactly zero for, and all are accurate to a higher level than I ever need, probably ±2% or better. Instrument error is rarely the biggest source of error in a well-designed experiment. Of course these meters have some limitations, but nothing I'm willing to spend big money to avoid.
You're looking for a justification to buy quality so I'll accommodate.
In your hobby endeavors you're extremely unlikely to ever get value from calibration so discard that notion. It's nearly impossible to go wrong with Fluke so choose that brand. Hobbyists have little use for logging, remote displays, special automotive and industrial features so something general purpose will do. Being able to test components for value or function is useful to a point in a multimeter but for that, a separate LCR meter is a better option. Being able to read temperature, duty cycle and frequency is all useful.
Despite all that, you have my permission to buy a Fluke 289.
In your hobby endeavors you're extremely unlikely to ever get value from calibration so discard that notion. It's nearly impossible to go wrong with Fluke so choose that brand. Hobbyists have little use for logging, remote displays, special automotive and industrial features so something general purpose will do. Being able to test components for value or function is useful to a point in a multimeter but for that, a separate LCR meter is a better option. Being able to read temperature, duty cycle and frequency is all useful.
Despite all that, you have my permission to buy a Fluke 289.
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In most cases - the calibration service costs more than just buying another meter.
and it's only a extra $70 for cal cert from fluke.
We use several at work but one is special. The AC/DC voltage ranges are not calibrated to standard voltages, its used as a readout for the primary standard high voltage divider used to set energy levels and is calibrated as a system to a NIST qualified high voltage source (1-175kV @ 0.0078 %). The actual output from the divider while extremely stable is not an exact divider voltage that can be displayed on a regular meter for a direct readout of voltage so this meter is adjusted from norm to display the correct value and has a big notice on the front
not to used for anything else.
You keep saying that you want an accurate meter, but do you have even the faintest idea how accurate you want it to be?
But when will he know that it's out of calibration?
I think he needs to purchase a primary voltage standard and either get a high quality current balance or some reference resistors. Then he can save money by not having to purchase a calibrated DMM and instead can use a cheaper meter (U.S. made, of course) and check it prior to every use against his standards to make sure that it is still accurate.
Everyday Practical Electronics recently published a project for a 10.0000V standard.But when will he know that it's out of calibration?
I think he needs to purchase a primary voltage standard and either get a high quality current balance or some reference resistors. Then he can save money by not having to purchase a calibrated DMM and instead can use a cheaper meter (U.S. made, of course) and check it prior to every use against his standards to make sure that it is still accurate.
The heart of the equipment is an off the shelf voltage standard chip - the rest is window dressing. They added a divider chip with onboard LC oscillator to time out for auto power off after you press the on button.
The chip needs only a bit of strip board, a noise filter capacitor and leads to a suitable battery.
There is a "trim" pin that you can vary the output over a specified range (you can tweak it to 10.24V for DAC Vref) but leave that pin alone unless you have the means to calibrate the voltage reference.
I watched a YouTube video yesterday where the narrator re-calibrated a Harbor Freight DMM! A non-calibratable DMM. He adjusted a potentiometer. I don't need a DMM that will read to 4 or 5 decimal places. A handheld meter that will read to 2 or, at the most, 3 decimal places is fine with me. 2 or 3 decimal places is accurate enough for me.
Why do you keep touting Fluke meters? How does Fluke justify charging hundreds of dollars for a basic meter? Surely, there are meters as good as Fluke, but that cost less.
What is an LCR meter?
You guys are helping me narrow down my brand choice for a DMM. Made in America, of course!
Why do you keep touting Fluke meters? How does Fluke justify charging hundreds of dollars for a basic meter? Surely, there are meters as good as Fluke, but that cost less.
What is an LCR meter?
You guys are helping me narrow down my brand choice for a DMM. Made in America, of course!
I wasn't the one who recommended Fluke, but the answer is that Fluke has a reputation for making quality meters. You pay for that. Just like you pay more for Apple or BMW. I have a Fluke, Simpson, and HP multimeter. I find them to be fairly equivalent, but not in the same league as my Radio Shack, Harbor Freight, and homemade meters (my homemade will only measure volts, because it's just a panel meter with dividers and a voltage reference added).
L=inductance, C=capacitance, R=resistance.
What does Made in America really mean? Assembling things made in other countries in America??
This is true, it's probably the same thing a tech in the factory does in a quick quality control check. I wouldn't count on it giving good calibration on all settings and scales.
You're referring to precision, which has nothing to do with accuracy. With modern digital electronics, precision is cheap. Accuracy, as you are learning, is more expensive.
Why would you assume that? If it were true, how long do you think Fluke would last?
Lestraveled
- Joined May 19, 2014
- 1,946
Recently I spent $8 for a new, no-name, 3 1/2 digit multimeter for a cable repair kit I am putting together for my grandson. (I didn't know about the Harbor Fright deal.) I compared its accuracy with my recently calibrated, HP3478A bench meter. On the voltage scale they were within 1%. I have two other, not made in America, under $50, portable multimeters. They are within 1-2%. The most inaccurate meter that I have ever owned is a Triplett 9045 (made in China.) It generally is off by 5%.
As #12 asked," What level of accuracy do you need?" I can tell you that for most hobby and repair work, ANY, 3 1/2 digit multimeter will be great. Like many others in this thread have suggested, get an el cheapo meter and use it for a few months. You will be a lot smarter about meters when you decide to buy your deluxe model. Think of it as dating before you get married.
As far as telling when a meter is "not right", or out of calibration, there are a few simple ways to tell. Keep some precision resistors around. They are relatively cheap and quick to test. Also compare the reading of two meters. I predict that a year from now you will have two meters. They both won't go bad in the same way and at the same time.
Don't forget to have fun at it.
As #12 asked," What level of accuracy do you need?" I can tell you that for most hobby and repair work, ANY, 3 1/2 digit multimeter will be great. Like many others in this thread have suggested, get an el cheapo meter and use it for a few months. You will be a lot smarter about meters when you decide to buy your deluxe model. Think of it as dating before you get married.
As far as telling when a meter is "not right", or out of calibration, there are a few simple ways to tell. Keep some precision resistors around. They are relatively cheap and quick to test. Also compare the reading of two meters. I predict that a year from now you will have two meters. They both won't go bad in the same way and at the same time.
Don't forget to have fun at it.
