# MOS 6510 Simulation

#### supertony

Joined Jan 15, 2013
25
As I am a big fun of commodore c64 I am trying to build one from scratch. Do you know if there is any simulator capable of running the PIC MOS 6510 ? I want to play with it without still buying one. Thanks.

#### MrChips

Joined Oct 2, 2009
24,211
PIC MCUs are made by Microchip Technology Inc.

MOS 6510 was made by MOS Technology and second sourced by Rockwell, Synertek.
You can also search for MOS 8500 and CSG 8500 CPUs, and 7501/8501.

Reference:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MOS_Technology_6510

#### Papabravo

Joined Feb 24, 2006
16,814
Your other pathway is to learn VHDL or Verilog and do your own. It will indubiously[sic] run faster than the original.

#### DickCappels

Joined Aug 21, 2008
7,721
I'll bet you dollars to donuts that a 6502 can do anything a 6510 can do. The main difference is that the 6502 has a wider address bus.

#### Ian Rogers

Joined Dec 12, 2012
919
As I am a big fun of commodore c64 I am trying to build one from scratch. Do you know if there is any simulator capable of running the PIC MOS 6510 ? I want to play with it without still buying one. Thanks.
I just built one with a Raspberry pi.. I used a Pi 1 as it can sim the whole thing, but you can do it with a pi zero...

https://hothardware.com/reviews/commodore-64-emulator-with-raspberry-pi-diy

As for simulator C64 forever... only about £10 but well worth it.

#### Ian0

Joined Aug 7, 2020
3,249
I'll bet you dollars to donuts that a 6502 can do anything a 6510 can do. The main difference is that the 6502 has a wider address bus.
The 6510 loses the Non-maskable interrupt, Clock out, sync, and ready pins and gains a 8-bit GPIO port.
Otherwise it's a 6502. Sort of a microcontroller with no memory.

So, the good people at Acorn Computers designed the ARM after years working on the 6502 - I get the "retro design" philosophy about designing around a 6502, and even using one of the high-speed modern ones, but the concept of using a high-spec ARM processor to pretend to be a good-old 6502 baffles me.

#### DickCappels

Joined Aug 21, 2008
7,721
The 6510 almost certainly uses the same die as the 6502 but with a different bonding configuration. It is up to you.

#### Ian0

Joined Aug 7, 2020
3,249
The 6510 almost certainly uses the same die as the 6502 but with a different bonding configuration. It is up to you.
Do you really think so? It's got the zero page ram built in and the normal 6502 hasn't.
I'm with you on the 6502 being the best way to proceed, you can soon "make" a 6510 by adding the RAM and a VIA, or PIO

#### Ian Rogers

Joined Dec 12, 2012
919
Nice but the goal is to use original component or at least the same architeture
Okay... I don't see 6502's anymore... let alone 6510's... and the support chips... 6581!!!
This is why the C64 maxi / mini are FPGA's...

#### metermannd

Joined Oct 25, 2020
211
The only real difference between the 6502 / 6510 is that I/O port (addresses $0000 /$0001). There is NO on-board RAM on the 6502 OR the 6510; both have a full 16-bit address bus and 8-bit data bus. The 'zero page' mode refers to the first 256 bytes of RAM, most of which is taken up on the 64 by various system variables (ex-breadbox owner here).

The 6502 is still in production... in fact, you may have heard of two of the consoles that have a 6502 in it - the NES and the Super NES.

The infamous PLA is available in a fair number of replacement versions. The SID (6581) was recently replicated using an ARM chip, and apparently even the VIC-II (6567) is now available as a FPGA daughterboard replacement.

The only chips in the C64 that have yet to be replicated in hardware are the 6510 and the 6522 CIA (PIA). It does seem both would need to be replicated with FPGA.

#### supertony

Joined Jan 15, 2013
25
Your other pathway is to learn VHDL or Verilog and do your own. It will indubiously[sic] run faster than the original.
Since I am learning Cortex M3 it will be nice to learn also how to interface the ARM micro to an FPGA. ( interested mostly in I/O). Which is a good entry level FPGA dev board you recommend I can also use for C64 ?
I am thinking about these after a research :

- artix-7 to learn FPGA and maybe c64?
tinyfpga (for trying to emulate a C64 basic) - I found this nice resource : http://c64onfpga.blogspot.com/2017/11/introduction.html
- ICE40 to learn FPGA and maybe c64?

Which one you recommend for c64 video signal ?

Thanks a lot for your help.

#### Papabravo

Joined Feb 24, 2006
16,814
Since I am learning Cortex M3 it will be nice to learn also how to interface the ARM micro to an FPGA. ( interested mostly in I/O). Which is a good entry level FPGA dev board you recommend I can also use for C64 ?
I am thinking about these after a research :

- artix-7 to learn FPGA and maybe c64?
tinyfpga (for trying to emulate a C64 basic) - I found this nice resource : http://c64onfpga.blogspot.com/2017/11/introduction.html
- ICE40 to learn FPGA and maybe c64?

Which one you recommend for c64 video signal ?