One possibility that occurred to me is that bad people don't go to "hell"(if it exists) because we are already here.l look at what goes on in the world and couldn't think of a better way to punish sinners than to make them live here.

This is also my take on things. Life that we are experiencing is what is also known as 'purgatory' in some religions. And we just don't know it. And it is a second or unknown chance to set things right with the 'soul'.

 

Nobody cares.

If your religion is to police all false statements on the Internet, to be the burr under the blanket, the stone in the shoe, to prove who is wrong in all aspects of everything they say, just say so. This could be an epic Thread, a sampling of what people believe after they have climbed the Science tree. As long as the Trolls don't derail it into religion or politics or petty bickering, it might have a glorious path. Maybe you could do your correcting of everybody in Personal Messages?

I don't follow anything you are saying.

Is me or anyone else pointing out proven facts wrong to you now because that's how I am reading your implied meaning here.

Just as nasspook says here,

I'm willing to believe if there is one solid data point of scientific evidence of this intelligent cause. If intelligent design is a scientific theory instead of just fancy creationism then it must pass the test of the scientific method, observations, hypothesis, experiments, and conclusion.

and so does cmartinez here

there are times in which stating the dry, plain facts becomes necessary...

So if you have a problem with me or anyone stating that unless something you, or anyone else's, claims can be backed up with solid provable scientific fact and or plausible theoretical basis they are likely not true let alone facts, that is a problem of perception reality on your end and not mine or anyone else's.

and yes, to answer your question when I do find something that someone stated wrongly on any forum or such that I actively participate on line, I do make a point to bring the facts out to where everyone can see them. You don't learn if you are not presented with things that challenge your views. Especially so when your views are in fact provably wrong.

 

If you think he's being bad here, go read the voting thread.

Exactly! I have zero issue with slapping someone hard with the proven cold hard reality of fact based truth if they act like an idiot just to avoid having to accept that something is not in fact not what they believe or claim it to be.

I can respect someone's opinion and ignorance but I do not respect stupidity and lies, especially so when they are clearly being used to push a less than rational agenda or belief system.

 

If aliens are so smart why do they only abduct stupid people

As far as you know based on "news" that is selected to fit in a timed article or show.

How much of the nightly news did you personally observe? I can tell you from my prospective, absolutely a minuscule number. In a broader view, a lot more happened in the day than that one hour, two hour, or even 24 hour news reports and all the newspapers in the world prints.

Here's "stupid person"

 

Personally I have been accused of being an alien, an ancient near immortal human and a combination of both.

It all came from my Ex who felt that since she was the smartest person she ever knew and that I was obviously smarter than her I had to be either not from this earth or incredibly old to know what I know because she could 'just feel' I have an old soul therefore I had to be something more than the average person.

But then that was the same woman who refused to believe she had multiple growing medical issues that had been well defined in her annual medical evaluations because her horoscopes and astrological charts didn't say anything about her developing such conditions.

Her views were that modern medicine does not know how to properly diagnose hypertension, hypothyroidism, and diabetes nearly as well as they claimed and that horoscopes and astrological charts have been around fro far longer therefore they are obviously more accurate in diagnosing such life changing stuff.

I called BS but still shopped around for a $250K - $500K life insurance policy to take out on her anyway. As far as I am concerned if people don't want the accept the truth of what or now well known and understood reality has to show them who am I to not profit from their stupidity.

 

So if you have a problem with me or anyone stating that unless something you, or anyone else's, claims can be backed up with solid provable scientific fact and or plausible theoretical basis they are likely not true let alone facts, that is a problem of perception reality on your end and not mine or anyone else's.

I posted a nice, long list of my beliefs (post #65). Have a ball convincing the Internet that I'm wrong.

I have zero issue with slapping someone hard with the proven cold hard reality of fact

Is that your belief about Life, the Universe, and Everything?
Is that your religion?
Have you read post #1 by strantor?
Did strantor delegate to you the job of keeping everyone's belief system in line with cold, hard, fact?

 

Living in Utah gives one the ability to not get offended. The Church I live near has missionaries from other States and it's been their goal to send them to me and convince me I'm wrong in my belief system. First they started with just 2 at a time, then it was 4, then it was 8.

Then it was the Bishop of the church who in disbelief was apparently not understanding how I could engage them without being affected. However, I refuse to banter or allow a heated conversation. It's not my fault some people have very thin skins about their belief so I will close the conversation and tell them I have no time for angry people and I have no will to change or convince you of something that is your responsibility to do, it's a free country.

So, I'll do me and you do you. Then I say, Good day.

kv

Edit: I haven't seen them since, and they never ever got angry or frustrated with me during the free exchange. They walked away smiling every time.

 

Exactly! I have zero issue with slapping someone hard with the proven cold hard reality of fact based truth if they act like an idiot just to avoid having to accept that something is not in fact not what they believe or claim it to be.

I can respect someone's opinion and ignorance but I do not respect stupidity and lies, especially so when they are clearly being used to push a less than rational agenda or belief system.

At the risk of getting this shut down, I apologize in advance to Strantor.

TCM, no one is saying your not smart, you are. But you can't like in the voting thread say that what you think is the only way to think. Sorry but that is just one of the facts you seem to be unwilling to accept. This thread and the voting thread are open to interpretation, and opinion. Yours is one but others have theirs. That's just the way it works, sorry. Subjective views don't have a right and wrong, they are not 'numbers', they are open to the individuals own ideas.

 

So sorry about my screw up posting a reply. T'is my first time and clicked where I should not have clicked.

" People also forget that all of the founding fathers of your country (and mine) were all Christian. And that the entire constitution, starting with the "all men are created equal" statement is completely soaked in that belief."

This is wrong on so many levels. I would you try doing some research before making such statements. For
example: https://www.britannica.com/topic/The-Founding-Fathers-Deism-and-Christianity-1272214
***************************************************************************************************

Some thoughts....
If Adam & Eve were the first, then aren't we all the products of incest?

Evolution takes a looooooooooooog time. I agree it is hard to get your head around it. But, if one is
skeptical, just look at dogs. Started out as wolves. Yet over a relatively short period of time, WE have turned
the wolf into the gazillion different breeds we have now. Evolution on steroids.

There is more "evidence" of alien visitation than any evidence of ANY god or supreme being.

The universe may very well be eternal. The latest is parallel of multi-verses. One idea of the big bang is two
of these universes colliding, creating the bang. Parallel universes may explain de ja vu. There is another you
in some other universe.

I will try to do better the next time.

Ron

 

This is also my take on things. Life that we are experiencing is what is also known as 'purgatory' in some religions. And we just don't know it. And it is a second or unknown chance to set things right with the 'soul'.

This is one of the questions I asked to my parents as an adolescent. Why is there no "Book of Jesus?" Why do we have the red letter version of the Bible? Jesus's words as quoted by his disciples. Jesus was an educated man, taught by the scribes. If the things he had to say pertained to everyone present and future, why did he not write them down so they could live on exactly the way he intended? Why would a infallible diety choose to rely on fallible men to record his message of utmost importance for the rest of time?

There are plenty of possibilities but the one that pertains to this reply is that Jesus' message was only relevant to the people then and there. The rapture already happened while he was here or shortly after he left, and was so small it didn't make the history books. We exist in purgatory or hell, waiting for a day to come that has long passed.

 

This is wrong on so many levels. I would you try doing some research before making such statements. For
example: https://www.britannica.com/topic/The-Founding-Fathers-Deism-and-Christianity-1272214

Interesting article, thanks.

From that page:

"If the nation owes much to the Judeo-Christian tradition, it is also indebted to Deism,"

"... the Founders came from similar religious backgrounds. Most were Protestants. The largest number were raised in the three largest Christian traditions of colonial America—Anglicanism (as in the cases of John Jay, George Washington, and Edward Rutledge), Presbyterianism (as in the cases of Richard Stockton and the Rev. John Witherspoon), and Congregationalism (as in the cases of John Adams and Samuel Adams). Other Protestant groups included the Society of Friends (Quakers), the Lutherans, and the Dutch Reformed. Three Founders—Charles Carroll and Daniel Carroll of Maryland and Thomas Fitzsimmons of Pennsylvania—were of Roman Catholic heritage."

Those paragraphs more or less prove my point. But you're right in one respect, I shouldn't have said "all of the founding fathers". That was a gross generalization. On the other hand, I remember now that some of them were deeply influenced by freemasonry, and that is most probably what the article's author was referring to.

 

Living in Utah gives one the ability to not get offended. The Church I live near has missionaries from other States and it's been their goal to send them to me and convince me I'm wrong in my belief system. First they started with just 2 at a time, then it was 4, then it was 8.

Then it was the Bishop of the church who in disbelief was apparently not understanding how I could engage them without being affected. However, I refuse to banter or allow a heated conversation. It's not my fault some people have very thin skins about their belief so I will close the conversation and tell them I have no time for angry people and I have no will to change or convince you of something that is your responsibility to do, it's a free country.

So, I'll do me and you do you. Then I say, Good day.

kv

Edit: I haven't seen them since, and they never ever got angry or frustrated with me during the free exchange. They walked away smiling every time.

alternatively, you can engage them like this:

Evolution is definitely easily observable and I do not think is in dispute as to being the main mechanism of how we got here. The evolutionary tree I am sure is wrong so is likely our understanding of genetics. We are going on pieces that we can see currently teasing out their roles. But we only have what we have... any organism is a universe of its own and functions as such, multitude of bacteria, viruses inhabit it, coexisting together. Epigenomics is an emerging field... I also think it is silly to think we are the only "intelligent" life in the universe (our intelligence is highly suspect)

I tend to think that we would do well to realize that there is no time, that universe is infinite and life never ends (i.e there is no death). Imagine if people realized that there was no death? Major fear is gone... no more need for religion

These concepts probably come from similar experiences to what was mentioned above already - I have been in near death state several times and it means nothing. I think someone's quote was "did you fear being born?" so whats the difference?

Fear of unknown, I think is what originally prompted humans to prey to nature Gods. That at least makes sense. As we became settlers, we made up Sun Gods, Rain Gods, etc. But as the cultures became larger and more urban, myths grew and began to be used to consolidate power and control population. Why do so many still feel the need for this fake "security blanket"

 

I note with interest the remarks from RAMARZX2 regarding the theory of parallel universes(universi). I have this idea that ALL the strange sightings we see,ghosts,UFOs, monsters etc. are "breakthroughs" from a parallel universe which in very close in "phase " to ours.
Physicists have postulated that these universe may exits. Many other people have talked about so-called "crystal vibrations" etc and such mystical stuff. while I can offer no proof, I suggest it would explain all the strange sightings over the years. A localized "break" or shift in "phase " between universes could occur and we see these ghosts etc, And the closer we are in "phase" with the other universe the more familiar are the things we see, eg relatives or people we know. But then again maybe its all crap!

 

Physicists have postulated that these universe may exits. Many other people have talked about so-called "crystal vibrations" etc and such mystical stuff. while I can offer no proof, I suggest it would explain all the strange sightings over the years. A localized "break" or shift in "phase " between universes could occur and we see these ghosts etc, And the closer we are in "phase" with the other universe the more familiar are the things we see, eg relatives or people we know. But then again maybe its all crap!

It might just be a 'Matter of Minutes'

http://www.unz.org/Pub/Unknown-1948q1-00054

 

Als

It might just be a 'Matter of Minutes'

http://www.unz.org/Pub/Unknown-1948q1-00054

I loved the original TZ... but back then I liked this "new show" even more...

 

I find this thread interesting.....!
So many theories, so many confusions, yet so many with similar beliefs. All looking for answers.
I only wonder how long this thread is gonna last.

 

It all depends on who's the philosophical Scientist, I read a book once about 30 years ago by David Foster

A British trained scientist/author presents a pro-religion argument in this short book. He takes aim at Darwin's theory of natural selection and Herbert Spencer's coined phrase "survival of the fittest," and the Second Law of Thermodynamics. His argument is based on the improbability of the above stated tenets based on specificity -- the probable inordinate lengthy amount time needed for an item to evolve to certain complexity verse the perceived age of the universe (one example used is haemoglobin).

Another read if your bored is this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophy_of_science

Philosophy of science is a sub-field of philosophy concerned with the foundations, methods, and implications of science. The central questions of this study concern what qualifies as science, the reliability of scientific theories, and the ultimate purpose of science. This discipline overlaps with metaphysics, ontology, and epistemology, for example, when it explores the relationship between science and truth.

kv

 

I note with interest the remarks from RAMARZX2 regarding the theory of parallel universes(universi). I have this idea that ALL the strange sightings we see,ghosts,UFOs, monsters etc. are "breakthroughs" from a parallel universe which in very close in "phase " to ours.
Physicists have postulated that these universe may exits. Many other people have talked about so-called "crystal vibrations" etc and such mystical stuff. while I can offer no proof, I suggest it would explain all the strange sightings over the years. A localized "break" or shift in "phase " between universes could occur and we see these ghosts etc, And the closer we are in "phase" with the other universe the more familiar are the things we see, eg relatives or people we know. But then again maybe its all crap!

As the moment there is growing view that the parallel universe concept might works due to a possible 5th fundamental force (quantum eraser) they are now studying regarding quantum physics and how it interacts with the various aspects of reality and what defines it.

Apparently at the quantum interaction level nature seems to be showing it may have a sort of auto correct that cancels out the reality fragmentation effect that would be needed to spawn alternate realities thus leaving us with only the one we all exist in now.

Part 1.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?annot...&feature=iv&src_vid=8ORLN_KwAgs&v=p-MNSLsjjdo

Part 2.

Other related videos and stuff.
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=5th+fundimental+force

https://blog.theuniversesolved.com/tag/delayed-choice-quantum-eraser/

 

TCM, no one is saying your not smart, you are. But you can't like in the voting thread say that what you think is the only way to think.

I have never said my way is the only way to think. What I have said is when someone makes alims they can not provide credible proof for I will call them out on it to whatever limits I feel fitting by my standards. From the everyone else can be the judge of what eve they want to accept from there.

What have said is that just because someone wants to believe something is true that isn't doesn't make it true. Just the same as claiming something happened that did not. You can believe whatever you want but don't go claiming something is what it is not or that something happened that is impossible.

If you claim that you can fly by flapping your arms really fast you have two choice, One, you jump off a building and prove it or you accept that you will be called out for being an idiot fool and liar until you do provide proof and beyond that so long as you keep making a claim that you can not factually back up it is not my credibility that suffer for it no matter how hard you try to show otherwise.

That is what was the issue in the voting thread. You and two others made a huge amount of claims that got proven wrong not by just me but by many people plus reality itself thusly discrediting you the point that no matter what you said it largely held so little credibility it came off as just simple minded empty trolling to which again, you got chastised for it by multiple people many times for in more than just that thread.
You may not have liked it or felt you were ever wrong but that in itself did not and does not alleviate the fact that you were in fact proven wrong (over and over) or that your c0unter claims that others were wrong, when they were not, to be true either.

 

I posted a nice, long list of my beliefs (post #65). Have a ball convincing the Internet that I'm wrong.

Why would I do that? Most everything you base your views on is based on what is known proven science or scientifically rationalized reasoning and explanations.

You aren't making wild unfounded claims that can be easily shown to be not rues so thusly there is little to refute.

Is that your belief about Life, the Universe, and Everything?
Is that your religion?

YES!

If it can't be proven or confirmed with plausible fact based observation it likely does not exist or at least not for the reasons its is being given credit by some if another more fact based alternative explanation hold any degree of plausible accountability for whatever took place.