I’d love to get into micro controllers and maybe I will at some stage but I just want to get my car back on the road now.

I guess that would be job #1.

Let me go back and look at the original drawings. The Pololu switching boards seem to come in several flavors and I can see where some of the reasons for your problems could be related as was mentioned by Alec_T.

Ron

 

OK, Now the rest of the details are revealed. Many of the posts are from folks in "third world" places where repair parts are unavailable and so they are attempting strange repairs. A kit car is a totally different item in every aspect. Quite possibly, if you have the room for it, a small PLC, (Programmable Logic Controller), is the simplest way to go. They program in ladder logic and include both relays and timers, as well as counters. Ihe inputs and outputs typically come in multiples of 8, so it would not need to be expanded a lot. An added advantage is that the programs are simple to write and easy to modify. And from the supplier that I mentioned before the programming software is free. And if one of the relays needs 20 contacts that is no problem. And in the UK there should be no problem getting the system. It will probably be a smaller package than adding all of the functions with relays, and it has the added advantage of being industrial rated hardware right out of the box, which is great for a kit car. An added advantage of ladder logic is that you can watch it running using your computer, so tracking down problems is much simpler than with discrete logic or relays. AND, Automation Direct has good customer support for these products. They may even want to use your application in one of their ads.

 

I guess that would be job #1.

Let me go back and look at the original drawings. The Pololu switching boards seem to come in several flavors and I can see where some of the reasons for your problems could be related as was mentioned by Alec_T.

Ron

Thanks Ron

 

OK, Now the rest of the details are revealed. Many of the posts are from folks in "third world" places where repair parts are unavailable and so they are attempting strange repairs. A kit car is a totally different item in every aspect. Quite possibly, if you have the room for it, a small PLC, (Programmable Logic Controller), is the simplest way to go. They program in ladder logic and include both relays and timers, as well as counters. Ihe inputs and outputs typically come in multiples of 8, so it would not need to be expanded a lot. An added advantage is that the programs are simple to write and easy to modify. And from the supplier that I mentioned before the programming software is free. And if one of the relays needs 20 contacts that is no problem. And in the UK there should be no problem getting the system. It will probably be a smaller package than adding all of the functions with relays, and it has the added advantage of being industrial rated hardware right out of the box, which is great for a kit car. An added advantage of ladder logic is that you can watch it running using your computer, so tracking down problems is much simpler than with discrete logic or relays. AND, Automation Direct has good customer support for these products. They may even want to use your application in one of their ads.

Sorry, I thought you were asking me some strange questions

Although some parts of the uk seem third world.

The reason I configured it the way I did was because I have no experience with micro controllers. I knew at the time of design that pic would be the better solution but I guess you have to go with what you have.

I lead such a busy life that it’s hard to think about learning something new so I thought the pololu had everything I needed.................. doo!

Thanks for all the info on micro controllers. I’ll have a look. If I was to go down that route I would probably incorporate short flash time and long, plus self cancelling too

 

A PLC is totally different from a typical micro controller, first in that most of them program with ladder logic, which simulates relay logic but without the limitations. So it is much easier to understand and use. Second, the hardware of a PLC is ready to connect wiring suitable for an industrial environment, meaning decent terminals made for reliable operation on a production line enclosure. So if you are comfortable with relay circuits you should be able to create a PLC program. That is why I suggest considering a PLC. While there may be a microcontroller buried deep inside, what you wind up dealing with looks very much like a panel full of relays as far as the logic goes. And the best part is that you are usually able to comment each line while writing the code so that it is simpler to follow years later when you work on it.
AND, the user interface uses standard words instead of made-up names for things, unlike the company that sells those toy modules. That makes it a lot simpler to work with.

 

Ah I see sorry for the confusion.
Had a look on the automation direct site.....
no idea what I’m looking for feel like a bit of a noob

 

Ah I see sorry for the confusion.
Had a look on the automation direct site.....
no idea what I’m looking for feel like a bit of a noob

They are usually able to provide useful assistance. The information that you need to start with is the number of inputs that you will need, the number of outputs, and the system operating voltage. It may be that you will still need to have a few relays to interface with the higher powered loads, but the specifications of the various output options will help you make that decision. I presume that your kit car has a 12 volt system, that might be a challenge because a lot of the PLC packages require 24 volts for the system power, independent from the voltages they are controlling. But since there have been PLCs used in vehicles there may well be a 12 volt option available. It is definitely worth investigating.

 

Thank you. I appreciate the time given.

 

If you could just help me out with this I would be so great full. I miss driving the car.

Not to state the obvious, but shouldn't this all have been worked out before removing the original system?

 

As stated at the beginning of the thread I had to butcher the original parts to try it out.

Thought I had it all worked out but what do you know. Turns out my answer would be not.

Are you in a position to help or just making obvious statements

 

Kit cars can be quite interesting projects. Even just building a car from pieces of others can be quite an exercise. I built a 1965 Barracuda from a race-car with a blown engine and a missing transmission and a number of parts that I could make fit. Then I drove the car for a bunch of years, and unfortunately I was talked into selling it. It had been the very best handling car ever.
For the kit car with the highly modified steering wheel controls, there may be other options available, although I am certain that it could be made to work.
My guess is that your biggest problems would be with the MOT inspectors, unless there is a special class for kit cars.

 

I just want to throw out a component that may be of use. It's a dual coil latching relay. To picture the operation, picture a reed switch, with two coils on each side and a small fixed magnet. The fixed magnet is not enough for the reed to change state, but will hold it in either.
A pulse of the correct polarity sets and resets the reed.

The coils are labeled SET and RESET and have a polarity. The opposite polarity applied to SET, will RESET the relay.
Other pole configurations are available. I used the reed as an example. They are not all made that way. Single coil relays are available too. In those, you have to change the polarity of the coil.

 

Kit cars can be quite interesting projects. Even just building a car from pieces of others can be quite an exercise. I built a 1965 Barracuda from a race-car with a blown engine and a missing transmission and a number of parts that I could make fit. Then I drove the car for a bunch of years, and unfortunately I was talked into selling it. It had been the very best handling car ever.
For the kit car with the highly modified steering wheel controls, there may be other options available, although I am certain that it could be made to work.
My guess is that your biggest problems would be with the MOT inspectors, unless there is a special class for kit cars.

Shame you sold it sounds like it was a nice car, lots of work gone into it. Thanks also for your optimism, I’ll press on. I’m not one to give up quickly.

The car I have is a Toyota mr2 which I fabricated the kit from scratch. I finished it 6 years ago but decided to tidy up the outside and rip out the interior and redesign that also from scratch. Next will be the dash then I’ll fabricate the seats from carbon fibre same kind of interior as the mclaran senna.

Here’s a couple of pics 6 years ago when I finished and a more recent one

 

A PLC for that purpose would be an overkill. Look into the PICAXE micro-controllers. They are based in the UK and are low cost. The 8pin device would do the job with a couple of relays. Easy to start with, because the BASIC programming language. Programming editor is free.

 

A PLC for that purpose would be an overkill. Look into the PICAXE micro-controllers. They are based in the UK and are low cost. The 8pin device would do the job with a couple of relays. Easy to start with, because the BASIC programming language. Programming editor is free.

Thank you mr fish I’ll check it out.
Will be tomorrow now as work has let me off early and it’s time for a drink.

HAPPY NEW YEAR TO YOU ALL !!! Fireworks

 

A PLC for that purpose would be an overkill. Look into the PICAXE micro-controllers. They are based in the UK and are low cost. The 8pin device would do the job with a couple of relays. Easy to start with, because the BASIC programming language. Programming editor is free.

Automation Direct sells several different lines of PLCs and the cheaper ones would not be that much overkill. But the very best part is that they have a rugged package that could be tucked away up behind the panel in a kit car, unlike the small board packages with their multi-pin connectors and open circuit boards. In addition, a PLC would allow all kinds of add-on features for no extra cost. A huge variety of extra light arrangements, and even a security system that could stop the bad guys fr a couple of hours. And unlike the small chip and circuit board packages that still need cables to the I/O interface boards, a PLC is ready to meet the real harsh world as soon as the code is written. And the programming software is also free. PLUS, the inputs and outputs all can have actual names as you are writing the program. AND ladder logic is easier than basic.
One more thing, those cars in the picture are awesome!! But it may be the same car with different paint coats, I can't tell

 

Automation Direct sells several different lines of PLCs and the cheaper ones would not be that much overkill. But the very best part is that they have a rugged package that could be tucked away up behind the panel in a kit car, unlike the small board packages with their multi-pin connectors and open circuit boards. In addition, a PLC would allow all kinds of add-on features for no extra cost. A huge variety of extra light arrangements, and even a security system that could stop the bad guys fr a couple of hours. And unlike the small chip and circuit board packages that still need cables to the I/O interface boards, a PLC is ready to meet the real harsh world as soon as the code is written. And the programming software is also free. PLUS, the inputs and outputs all can have actual names as you are writing the program. AND ladder logic is easier than basic.
One more thing, those cars in the picture are awesome!! But it may be the same car with different paint coats, I can't tell

All very much food for thought. I will remain open minded until I have a solution that is a. Cheap b. Not too much more effort and c. Well there isn’t a c.

The pics are of the same car, just had it sprayed. Glad you like it.

 

In reality the first qualification would be reliable. A control system that does not function correctly all the time, every time, is really only suited for a show-only car, or possibly a "cafe racer" type of vehicle.
Usually the case is: Easy, Cheap, Good, pick any two.
OK on the car being painted between photos. The orange is very good looking, that night-driving black would certainly allow you to be invisible, if that were a requirement.

 

As stated at the beginning of the thread I had to butcher the original parts to try it out.

Thought I had it all worked out but what do you know. Turns out my answer would be not.

Are you in a position to help or just making obvious statements

Just making statements. As some one who has done car and motorcycle building and modifications for around 50 years.

 

Have you checked with your insurer that a mod of this sort to the lighting meets with their approval? As I understand it, normally vehicles get 'type approved'; but the end result here will be a non-approved type.
IF you can get approval for it and can verify that it would be road-legal, then here's a suggested way of incorporating those Pololu switch units:-

C1,R2,C3,R4 are intended to provide some switch debouncing in addition to any that may be included inside the Pololu units.
C2 and C4 cross-couple the Left and Right units to allow mutual cancelling without blocking the desired press-on/press-off toggle action. The relays could be normal SPST automotive types. LampsL and LampsR each represent a lamp group.
Incidentally, will you add some way of dimming those steering-wheel tell-tale lights for night driving ?