Understood that makes sense so my best bet might be keeping the storage bins a ways away if they are regular plastic and removing the wrist band grab all the bags I need and walking them over to my bench placing them on the mat putting on the band and removing them there. Sounds like the best solution without going nuts over it.

 

One other alternative would be to place an ion generator blowing a cloud of ions over the workspace. Positively charged plastic (or negative) will draw the opposite charge from the cloud and neutralize the charge. This works, but I find there's a subtle odor of ozone associated with the cloud. I still think the best approach is to keep plastics and other static generating materials away from the work surface. Styrofoam is a killer. Paper can be a bit dangerous. Cellophane tapes generate lots of static when pulled from the reel. This can get to be quite a deep subject.

 

One other alternative would be to place an ion generator blowing a cloud of ions over the workspace. Positively charged plastic (or negative) will draw the opposite charge from the cloud and neutralize the charge. This works, but I find there's a subtle odor of ozone associated with the cloud. I still think the best approach is to keep plastics and other static generating materials away from the work surface. Styrofoam is a killer. Paper can be a bit dangerous. Cellophane tapes generate lots of static when pulled from the reel. This can get to be quite a deep subject.

That makes sense, does the thought of keeping the regular plastic bin (sterilite type tote)on the other side of the room unstrapping retrieving what I need (housed in esd bags) then restrapping and placing them on the mat to allow everything to equalize, make the most sense to you then in this case ? Thus keeping a good 8-10’ between the plastic bin and work surface ?

is conductive foam to push the ics into something you’d suggest inside the metallized shielding bags or is that redundant and either or is fine.
As far as the breadboard with a partially finished circuit , I assume the same protection into a metalized shielding bag would protect it until I got back to it.

as far as something like a soldering iron the haako fx888d I have it should be grounded through the plug and be safe as long as it’s on the mat as well I think?

thanks again for helping me stay sane during figuring this out lol.

 

These kind of totes unless grounded somehow wouldn’t really change much from the plastic non esd bins for dangers if kept near the station would they? Just curious https://www.uline.com/Product/Detail/S-18439/ESD-Storage/Corstat-In-Plant-Handler-17-x-10-x-4

 

Copy that, I’ll just leave it at making sure I do everything on the mat. Last question would anyone bother with esd totes or the esd (cardboard?) boxes for storing bulk components in shielding bags ? Or just regular run of the mill plastic totes under my bench and let the shielding bags do their thing. Sorry for all the questions as an outsider it’s a lot to parse lol.

I try to keep plastic totes away from things, since they generate a lot of static. I have no problem using cardboard boxes (black esd ones, or otherwise (often digikey boxes)) near exposed components.

It doesn't sound like you're doing anything professional, at least right now. It's way more important (and fun) to gain experience soldering by building circuits and testing them than worrying about ESD - which will likely not be an issue at your skill level.

oh no I’m not soldering for my employer my shift as maintenance ends an hour and half before my wifes in operations, we carpool so id be soldering for my hobby stuff in the shop to pass the time after my shift ends.

I'm glad to hear that. I'd still be careful though. Who owns anything you build? Who's paying for what? If it ends up that you build a profitable little device, does your company own it or do you? Stuff like that is important to consider (and get in writting) before doing this sort of thing. It might be best to sit under a shade tree and do a crossword puzzle or play chess online. In that situation it's clear that you're off your shift and there's no room for misinterpretation by you or your company.

I only mention this because I've seen this sort of thing go south in a hurry.

 

Honestly there's no need to keep them clear across the room. Standard rule of thumb in an aerospace defense manufacturer is no closer than 3 feet. If you have plastic totes underneath the bench that'd be fine.

As for the conductive foam - it has its advantages and disadvantages. The advantage is that all pins are kept at the same potential and thus, no conduction of ESD through the components internal structure. The disadvantage is that it can cause some corrosion on the pins and make them difficult to solder. While that's true, it's never presented a problem for me.

 

Awesome, so regular plastic bins and esd safe bags for sensitive parts I’ll put that to bed. Just to make sure I grasp this since they are in a faraday cage type situation in the bags it’s cool if I go retrieve them un strapped keep them in the bag and then put the strap on place them on the mat wait and few seconds for charge to dissipate and open away ( I’m assuming that makes more sense than putting them on the mat first than strapping but either would result in the same

I’ll probably skip the pink poly bags and store everything in esd shield bags since a case of them makes it seem senseless to bother with the pp at all and risk issues with a charge getting to even the unsensitive parts in those bags ( even though they’d be equalized with everything else on the mat once placed there anyway?)


any thoughts on grounding regarding a soldering iron or it’s good to go connected to the same outlet ground as me/mat.

can I ask where you typically buy the conductive foam from reliably ? The extra little precaution can’t hurt. (I doubt I’d be storing too too much too long to have to worry about corrosion too much as id buy to prototype then build in most cases with how fast shipping is

With any luck the next time I post it’ll be about circuits and not confusing myself about esd lol. Thanks for being great y’all

 

it’s cool if I go retrieve them un strapped keep them in the bag and then put the strap on place them on the mat wait and few seconds for charge to dissipate and open away

It's cool. But you don't need a few seconds for charges to dissipate

any thoughts on grounding regarding a soldering iron or it’s good to go connected to the same outlet ground as me/mat.

Good irons have their tips grounded through their power cord. If you have one of those irons that only have two wires, you can probably get away with it. That is to say I don't know if it would be a problem, but a good grounded iron is likely the best route to go.

can I ask where you typically buy the conductive foam from reliably ?

I haven't bought conductive foam in decades. Couldn't tell you. Will have to let someone else answer that.

 

The other thing that’s confusing to my brain is how breadboards are so prevalent in usage being made of plastic but aren’t typically mentioned as an esd concern ? ( is it because they are on the mat and not moved around a ton to generate static? Typically have a plate on the bottom that’s conductive ? It’s in the prototype stage so it’s not something people sweat) just curious

 

I have never seen any reports or concerns with regards to ESD buildup on prototyping boads.

 

Good irons have their tips grounded through their power cord.

At least you think they're good until you short out your board because you forgot to turn off the board power before soldering. I had a friend do that once!

 

pink poly bags for stuff like resistors and caps
Silver shielding bags for ics diodes transistors and electrolytic caps ?

I wouldn't bother using ESD mitigations for devices that don't need them.

transport them in whatever plastic bin they are in sealed in bags place on mat remove when bag is on mat to work with them?

I got by for many years without having an antistatic mat or a grounding strap. When I was an R&D technician, I got into the habit of grounding before touching any static sensitive components. I worked with some CCD prototypes that had no explicit ESD protection in the late 70's and never killed any devices.

is conductive foam to push the ics into something you’d suggest inside the metallized shielding bags or is that redundant and either or is fine.

Metalized shielding bags can have the antistatic property damaged. Some conductive foam can cause lead corrosion (after many years).

The other thing that’s confusing to my brain is how breadboards are so prevalent in usage being made of plastic but aren’t typically mentioned as an esd concern ?

ESD protection is typically tested at a couple thousand volts. Once parts have been installed, static shouldn't be much of a problem. Just don't go crazy and drag leads across the breadboard where you could build up sufficient static.

 

Once parts have been installed, static shouldn't be much of a problem.

Today there are components sensitive to voltages as low as 20 volts. It's unlikely you'll come across anything that sensitive unless you're building satellites for interstellar travel. Nevertheless, at a place I once worked, there was a satellite on the test stand and being tested. A worker moved a rolling cart PAST the satellite approaching it as close as 3 feet away when the satellite ceased to function. This isn't something I heard, it's something I was there for. Of course an investigation was launched to discover the means of the failure. The cart had a chain that dragged on the conductive flooring. However, the chain was rusted and the rust insulated the cart from complete discharging to ground. When the static field got close enough the satellite quit working. You don't have to TOUCH something to cause it harm. Approaching it can be quite devastating for sensitive things.

Now, lets focus on my statement - I was talking about a satellite. Not likely to be building one in your basement, nor are you likely to be working with electronics so dang sensitive. The story (true as it is) was shared to highlight the misnomer that once installed parts aren't in danger. While it's true there is SOME mitigation to the danger, there is still a chance of harm. And has been said earlier in this thread the worst damage isn't a failed chip it's a damaged chip, one that can not be relied upon to function at the most critical time.

Take it for what it is. ESD should be guarded against. Depending on the materials you're working with you need to take appropriate ESD protection. My little lab has an ESD mat and I have a wrist strap. I don't know of anything I've blown out. I said "I don't KNOW of anything I've blown out." A good number of my projects don't seem to last very long and I'm at odds to know why. But then again my skill level - um - well, the word "Skill" probably doesn't belong in that statement.