Electric De-Soldering Pump damages pads

Thread Starter

didvidyn

Joined Jul 18, 2017
16
Hello. new here. my first post.
I do lots of desoldering work.
used to use "manual radisoshack non-electric desoldering sucker. worked ok even thou very slow.
but just got an electric desoldering pump, and it does 90% damage, rips out the terminal pads, i tried even on lowest heat setting but it still does same damage.
any recommendation / suggestions or tricks ?
 

dl324

Joined Mar 30, 2015
12,871
Welcome to AAC!

Can you post information about the desoldering tool and pictures of the damage?

I have a desoldering attachment on my Aoyue hot air tool. I have never had a problem with a pad being lifted.

With my spring loaded solder sucker, I've had pads lift on (home made) single sided boards. Good technique mitigates the problem.

I've also had pad lift problems on low quality PCBs.
 

Tonyr1084

Joined Sep 24, 2015
5,976
Pads generally lift off when there's too much heat applied. Too much means either too high a temperature or too long dwell time in the heat soak. I've used high temp to lift traces that needed to be removed from a PCB (engineering products). So if you have to de-solder, do it as quickly as possible. IMO the worst offender is usually solder wick. Especially when they get stuck to the pad and you pull.

A higher heat may heat the solder fast enough to suck it away without having to put too much heat into the board. De-soldering is far more difficult than soldering, so it may take a little practice.
 

Tonyr1084

Joined Sep 24, 2015
5,976
Sometimes people apply too much pressure with a soldering iron in the attempt to get heat into the board. They cause mechanical stress inadvertently.
 

JohnInTX

Joined Jun 26, 2012
4,444
+1 I use a vacuum system by PACE. The key is not to apply pressure to the pad at all. I use 700 degF, place the tip over the lead and gently stir it around until I can feel the solder has melted in the through-hole then just a quick blip on the vac will pull the solder. If you still have some left, re-apply some solder to the joint for heat conduction then repeat. Don't try to de-solder a dry hole. Keep in mind that you want to transfer heat along the lead and into the hole. If the component or pad has a big surface on the other side, it can be hard to get enough heat to get a clean pull without overheating the board. In that case, I will usually cut the component off the board then use the vac-puller to get the solder out of the hole and free the lead.

Keep the tip well tinned and the hole clear. I find that used guitar strings of various sizes and wrappings cut to length are ideal for clearing the hole.
Good luck!
 

bertus

Joined Apr 5, 2008
21,364
Hello,

I see a temperature adjustment in the handle.
It shows a scale in centigrade.
As @JohnInTX uses a temperature of 700 °F, wich is about 375 °C.

Wich temperature did you set on the handle?

Bertus
 

dl324

Joined Mar 30, 2015
12,871
here are photos of elcetric pump desolderer vs manual finger-pump desolderer
Looks like too high of a temperature and/or too much pressure on the pads. Let the tip melt the solder before attempting to remove it. If you don't get all of the solder, apply more and try again.

On double sided boards, the plated through hole will hold the pads down while the adhesive is melted. You have a mechanical issue. Your rubbing/dragging while the solder is molten (and the glue is melted). When you're activating the vacuum, don't move the tip; or at least don't move it much and make sure you use almost no pressure on the tip.

That tool looks very similar to the attachment for my hot air tool. Do you have a vacuum adjust control? Though it's very unlikely it will develop that much vacuum. I used an industrial version and never had a problem. But we melted solder with an iron and than activated the sucker.
 

recklessrog

Joined May 23, 2013
985
Another thing to watch with this type of desoldering tool is how sharp the nozzle tip hole is. Where the coned end is cut off at the tip, some have a very thin sharp lip that can damage the pad if too much pressure is applied. Use a small oil stone to round off any sharp edges and a fine round needle file to take the edge off circumference of the hole.

I have used a similar tool for 30 years and have found that most of the nozzles needed this treatment.
 

IMP002017

Joined Jan 28, 2017
192
I think add some good Flux or add some lead solder may cure the problem. I like Amtech NC-559 for all kinds of things. If I don't want to add extra solder I will use little bit of flux.
 

Tonyr1084

Joined Sep 24, 2015
5,976
I think add some good Flux or add some lead solder
Flux? Yes. Lead solder? No. Not good for the environment. The industry has been moving away from Leaded solder. Silver solder has a higher melting temperature. IMP is right about adding lead solder, it flows so much easier. But again, it's an environmental concern. I have some lead solder I haven't used in years. Some day I may actually dispose of it at the haz-mat land fill.
 

dl324

Joined Mar 30, 2015
12,871
I have some lead solder I haven't used in years. Some day I may actually dispose of it at the haz-mat land fill.
Your solder with lead isn't going to amount to any meaningful contamination. The guy target practicing, plinking critters with lead pellets, or runoff from battery recycling will swamp anything you could do.

When RoHS took effect, I bought a lifetime supply of 63/37 solder. I think hobbyists in the EU can use leaded solder. Even if they can't, who could catch them?

RoHS was a political statement. They still allow lead acid batteries in the EU...

I always add solder with lead to unleaded solder I need to remove. It lowers the melting point and makes removal easier.
 

dendad

Joined Feb 20, 2016
3,835
Yes, if you are having soldering/desoldering problems with lead-free particularly, adding more lead based (60/40) makes the work a lot easier.
I've been soldering PCBs for many years and have tried the lead-free stuff and do not like it much. Saying that, my last 20 or so PCBs have been assembled with lead-free and it went ok, mostly.
A syringe gell flux is a must!
Also, do check the desolderer point, and was mentioned above, make sure it is not sharp. The same goes for the soldering iron. And to help desoldering, one of the best tricks is to ADD solder to the joint first. With enough solder there, the heat can travel through it to melt the lot.
Ans there is no need to push. Try adding a bit of solder to the point of the desoldering tool too so there is a bead of molten solder there as that can help the heat transfer too.

On another point, make sure you wash your hands well after soldering, no matter what solder you use. And I'd recommend wearing safety specs too.
I've developed bronchiectasis now and I blame many years of breathing solder fumes for it. Now, a bit late, I've installed an exhaust fan system.
 
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IMP002017

Joined Jan 28, 2017
192
If you can find it in your pocket and don't want to use Lead solder and ran out of FLUX I would say use some CHIPQUIK. that is amazing stuff. Just make sure you take it all off your PCB and don't use it as solder. It will melt at low temps and can even melt do to components installed.

Been soldering for over 30 years, Have Fume Extractor and starting in 2006 started using Exhaust fans any time I enter my shop. Always wash hands before leaving the soldering area. Keep things cleaned and try geez I said TRY and not eat or drink in same area... Also Smoke Cigars and have a Pipe collection of over 200 pipes so sadly I am almost always smoking a Pipe or Cigar while in the shop. Oh and yes I have been smoking Cigars and Pipes as long as I have been soldering. Not always together. That started in 07 or so. Before I was always afraid to do them both together. Now days I am not getting any younger...
 

Tonyr1084

Joined Sep 24, 2015
5,976
Your solder with lead isn't going to amount to any meaningful contamination. The guy target practicing, plinking critters with lead pellets, or runoff from battery recycling will swamp anything you could do.

When RoHS took effect, I bought a lifetime supply of 63/37 solder. I think hobbyists in the EU can use leaded solder. Even if they can't, who could catch them?

RoHS was a political statement. They still allow lead acid batteries in the EU...

I always add solder with lead to unleaded solder I need to remove. It lowers the melting point and makes removal easier.
I agree with you. However, law is law. Just because someone in the Grand Canyon decides to shoot a deer with a lead bullet thinking it won't cause any harm, has to understand that the Condor eats that flesh along with the lead poisoning, then passes it on to their chicks. Lead IS a problem. And if only you or only I use lead solder - likely no measurable harm. But if everybody uses lead - it adds up.

I also agree with the "Political" thing, but I believe more in the environment than I do in corrupt governmental leaders who line their pockets with lead, coal, uranium, oil, carbon and all kinds of other things that prove harmful to the environment. I'm certainly no fan of us in the US pulling out of the Paris Accord. I think it's one of the stupidest things to do - and especially since it's in the light of improving manufacturing in the US. But lets not get off track. Lead is a problem. So when possible I don't use lead. What others do is up to them and their conscence.

I've been soldering PCBs for many years and have tried the lead-free stuff and do not like it much.
I hate it too. But I hated learning new things until I knew them well.
 

Tonyr1084

Joined Sep 24, 2015
5,976
Now days I am not getting any younger.
Aren't we all?!

I've been soldering since age 7 (over 50 years) when I first picked up my dad's Weller soldering gun. Took apart an old reel to reel tape recorder (child's toy). Picked up a bar of lead and fixed radiator leaks using a torch and some acid. Played with my fathers bottle of mercury too (won't go into details on that). Honestly, I shouldn't be alive. But somehow I always managed to act out when death was either sleeping, turned his attention another direction - or he blinked and missed my moment of mass stupidity.

One thing I didn't get away with was Rock and Roll Drums. I have Tinnitus because of it. Wife bought me drugs for my birthday and I absolutely LOVED having them again. Even with hearing protection I was still getting worse with Tinnitus. Sold my drums to a young boy and told him: "I'm going to give you some advice. If you take it - you'll never thank me. But if you don't - you'll definitely remember my words and WISH you had taken that advice: WEAR HEARING PROTECTION!" Gaud I miss my drums. But I always have electronics to do stupid stuff with. I have an old microwave control panel I use to power my soldering iron. Otherwise I always forget to turn it off and leave it burning up the tips. So I can run my iron for 99 minutes and 99 seconds. And if the timer goes off and beeps and I'm not done soldering I can always throw another 99 minutes on there.

We all do stupid things. The point is to learn from them. Whether it's our hearing or burning our fingers on hot wires we just soldered together or whether it's polluting the environment, learn from your mistakes. What was this thread originally about? OH! Desoldering.

Try adding a bit of solder to the point of the desoldering tool too so there is a bead of molten solder there as that can help the heat transfer too.
Excellent point. One of the things I used to teach new soldering students was to tin the tip of the iron to get better heat transfer. I've seen students jamming the tip against the joint trying to get some heat into the board. A little molten tip of solder and a fluxed joint will cause the bead to transfer the thermal energy into the solder joint and make it easier to solder - de-solder. Good point DenDad.
 

dl324

Joined Mar 30, 2015
12,871
However, law is law.
RoHS is an EU law. For the US, it's only significance is that commercial products must meet RoHS certification requirements to be imported. For the vast majority of Americans, it's irrelevant. Even within the EU, hobbyists are exempted and can use solder with lead.

Just because someone in the Grand Canyon decides to shoot a deer with a lead bullet thinking it won't cause any harm, has to understand that the Condor eats that flesh along with the lead poisoning, then passes it on to their chicks.
The last time I checked, the only ammunition in the US that has moved away from lead is shotgun shells; and maybe only bird shot, not buck shot. The rest of the "bullets" use lead.

I heard a lady at a gun counter telling her male companion that he should get lead free 22 rounds because lead was bad for the environment. The counter guy said they're all lead.

EDIT: Because of California's adoption of some RoHS regulations, I checked again. There are some lead free bullets now. This was after my gun counter encounter. Full compliance is in 2019. Lead bullets are still legal in my state.
Lead IS a problem.
It's not that big of a problem. AFAIK, California is the only state that has adopted any of the RoHS ideas.
And if only you or only I use lead solder - likely no measurable harm. But if everybody uses lead - it adds up.
Like I said, RoHS doesn't apply to hobbyists; even those in the EU. If you want to put up with the downsides of using lead free solder that's your business. But my use of solder with lead doesn't violate any environmental laws.
 
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Tonyr1084

Joined Sep 24, 2015
5,976
Like I said, RoHS doesn't apply to hobbyists; even those in the EU. If you want to put up with the downsides of using lead free solder that's your business. But my use of solder with lead doesn't violate any environmental laws.
OK. You make good points.

˚J˚
˘
 
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