Could you own math?

Thread Starter

strantor

Joined Oct 3, 2010
6,782
I have been looking into amateur boat building and come across a number of websites selling boat plans. On some of them I read that you pay once for the plans to build one boat; after that, if you want to build more, you have to pay them 50% the original price for every boat you build after that. I guess even if you burn the plans and build the boat from memory, you still have to pay them?

Anyway it got me thinking, in this world of IP, patents, copyrights, lawsuits, etc., if someone were to come up with a revolutionary new math (think something on par with algebra, trigonometry, etc) that would help all people in all walks of life, could they claim it as IP and/or patent it, and charge royalties for using it? I picture an architect requesting a quote for the usage fee for 9,000 instances of "Function X" in advance of designing a new bridge. Or a store owner paying a monthly fee for the math used in calculating supply & demand, upon which ordering quantities are based.

And if some math could be patented, and people had to pay to use it, then they would have to pay tax on the math that they used, and if the government uses the same math to calculate the tax bill, then I think that might be enough recursion to crash the system. Kinda like when I was paying federal income tax in employ of the federal government; effectively paying myself a portion of my paycheck. But that didn't crash the system.... damned system.
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
13,086
You might be able to patent the application (computer program) of new math you can't patent the mathematical formula.
 

Thread Starter

strantor

Joined Oct 3, 2010
6,782
You might be able to patent the application (computer program) of new math you can't patent the mathematical formula.
Why not? What's the difference between code and math?
If you can copyright a logo so that anybody with a pencil could otherwise draw it, but now they can't, then why couldn't you somehow secure your math in the same way?


To be clear, this is just a thought exercise; I have no revolutionary math under wraps.
 

MaxHeadRoom

Joined Jul 18, 2013
28,619
I have been looking into amateur boat building and come across a number of websites selling boat plans. On some of them I read that you pay once for the plans to build one boat;.
How would they ever know? Unless you went into selling them as a business, I have built a few in my time and never ever considered that clause.
On the subject of Logo's etc, in the late 50's a bright spark in the UK researched up and coming companies in the US, and registered the name in the UK before they went global, he make a bundle selling them the UK rights to the name when they did.
Max.
 

spinnaker

Joined Oct 29, 2009
7,830
How would they ever know? Unless you went into selling them as a business, I have built a few in my time and never ever considered that clause.
On the subject of Logo's etc, in the late 50's a bright spark in the UK researched up and coming companies in the US, and registered the name in the UK before they went global, he make a bundle selling them the UK rights to the name when they did.
Max.

Exactly. And I think is the whole purpose of the license. I am sure the designer does not care how many you build as long as you don't go into business.
 

Alec_t

Joined Sep 17, 2013
14,280
You might be able to patent the application (computer program) of new math you can't patent the mathematical formula.
Mathematical methods and computer programs are among the things specifically excluded from patentability under UK and European Patent law.
 

spinnaker

Joined Oct 29, 2009
7,830
Mathematical methods and computer programs are among the things specifically excluded from patentability under UK and European Patent law.

How can a computer program not be patentable? Who in the hell whould ever want to be a software author in the UK?
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
13,086

spinnaker

Joined Oct 29, 2009
7,830
Sure, it's likely in the public domain as he died over a hundred years ago, just be sure it's listed as a copy of the original by Van Gogh.

His signature should be part of the artwork too. Up to the buyer to determine if it is authentic or not. Just list it as van Gogh painting.
 

#12

Joined Nov 30, 2010
18,224
Patents, Bad Patents, and Patent Trolls are a subject all by itself. You could run a whole Forum on this subject. No way it can be properly addressed in a Thread. I don't mind you having some fun, but knowing the in's and out's of this is unlikely on this site.

Some of the people here have experienced the insanity of the Patent system. I suspect they have concluded that the only way to win is to not play the game.
 

spinnaker

Joined Oct 29, 2009
7,830
Patents, Bad Patents, and Patent Trolls are a subject all by itself. You could run a whole Forum on this subject. No way it can be properly addressed in a Thread. I don't mind you having some fun, but knowing the in's and out's of this is unlikely on this site.

Some of the people here have experienced the insanity of the Patent system. I suspect they have concluded that the only way to win is to not play the game.

Our company has at least one thorn its side from an attorney that sues us constantly along with a whole host of other companies. He makes a living off of buying up obscure patents then makes some extremely thin connection between our business practices and / or systems. He is smart enough to settle out of court because he would likely lose in a trail. But it is so expensive to fight it the companies go ahead and settle.
 

cmartinez

Joined Jan 17, 2007
8,220
Our company has at least one thorn its side from an attorney that sues us constantly along with a whole host of other companies. He makes a living off of buying up obscure patents then makes some extremely thin connection between our business practices and / or systems. He is smart enough to settle out of court because he would likely lose in a trail. But it is so expensive to fight it the companies go ahead and settle.
Down here, we call that sort of people parasites...
 
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