i have a homey buff ceiling fan that is a 6 speed forward and reverse fan. it has a harbor breeze remote and i bet the receiver is als a harbor breeze. anyway i got a spare remote off ebay that looks the same and when i got it it has the exact same numbers but it will not run the fan. it seems the harbor breeze tech people are telling me these receivers can't be easily re programmed. so i took the remotes apart and they are identical but one does not have the little toggle buttons on it for a few options like the one that runs the fan has. but the techs claim that would not make the remote not usable to the receiver only some features would not get coded to the receiver.

so because the little for lack of a better word transistor. or that little oblong unit that i believe to be the transmitter to the receiver having different numbers, if i could source the correct unit that i may be able to un solder it and exchange it and then have the remote work. it looks to me to just be soldered at the ends? or it may just be a plug in unit? so what is your thoughts? and if it can be done and that may be the reason for this remote not working the fan where can i get one? i'm thinking the numbers on the back of the unit would be when i look for just like any other transistor. or would i also have to exchange the ic unit as well. i'm thinking all that might need to be done is the transmitter unit and the boards are about the same but for 5 functions on the recent remote that we just would never need. as all i connected to this remote was fan speed and directions. the light is wall switched. thanks for any ideas and help.

i took the other remote apart just now and the rf transmitter on that one is KXY13.560 so from what i have found out they are 315 or 433 mhz now maybe different but most of the remote transmitters i have found so far that is there freqs. no the board is missing some of the button disks but i do not think it is sending different codes i think the reason it is not working is just the rf transmitter is a different freq. and the receiver cant get the codes. also if this is the case it looks like i can unsolder it and replace it. but there is not solder spots on the bottom of the board so maybe just pressure points? maybe someone can point me to a YT showing this being done? thanks.

ok this seems to be the crystal and it seems to be 13.560 mhz and 2 pins so i may ebay one and take this apart and see if installing a 13.560 mhz crystal will do the job. again if anyone has a YT showing this it would be great and save me a bit of the learning curve. i have done lots of electronics repair but i never had to take the crystal out with out seeing the pins for soldering? i think this is a sandwich type board. i could be wrong and the pins are just pressing on the conductors or a small spring. thanks

 

These things likely send a digital code over their broadcast frequency, which is probably set by the crystal. To succeed, you'll need to know what codes are sent by the working remote and then reproduce those codes with the second remote. Step one may not be too hard if you have an oscilloscope. It's even possible that someone has already done that. However that second step may be nearly impossible.

I think it's likely that the radio frequencies are fine. It's those darned digital codes.

 

it looks like i can unsolder it and replace it. but there is not solder spots on the bottom of the board so maybe just pressure points?

There are two different methods for connecting components to the board. Old school is what's known as "Through Hole" technology where a component with legs is mounted through a hole in the PCB (Printed Circuit Board). The current trend is called SMT (Surface Mount Technology) which doesn't have legs or leads that go through the board, they're soldered in place to pads on the component side of the board. If you've never soldered (or unsoldered) parts that are SMT then there's a high probability you'll damage the board trying to remove the crystal. (the part you show in your last photo).

Also, wayneh said:

These things likely send a digital code over their broadcast frequency, which is probably set by the crystal.

What he's telling you is that the crystal sets the radio frequency that the receiver listens for. When you push a button you set a frequency that wakes up the receiver. The remote also sends a code which the receiver is programmed to understand as commands. High, Medium, Low, Off, Forward, Reverse, Lights on, Lights off and maybe even Dim the lights. In order to use another remote it has to be both on the same frequency as the receiver AND use the same command codes. If the codes are not the same then the remote won't work.

It's unlikely you'll get the new remote to work. There's a chance, but it might still not work even if you change the crystal. And again, working with SMT is not hard ONCE YOU KNOW HOW, but given the level of understanding you possess it's unlikely you'll succeed in changing the crystal. Also, often crystals are flanked by specific capacitance values which can not be read on the caps directly adjacent the crystal. You'll probably have to replace the caps with the correct value as well. Those caps are marked C1 & C2. They're specific to the crystal. And since they, too, are SMT removing and replacing those without the proper equipment is likely going to damage the caps and PCB as well.

In short, I'll be happy for you if you get it to work. But I don't have high hopes for your success based on several factors.

 

First: how sure are you that the remote from abay even works??
Then, is it for the exact same model receiver? Are you able to verify that they actually ARE set to the same frequency? One other possibility is that the serial numbers are not the same.
All that i can verify from those two photos is that both PCBs are green. The one set of white characters ends in a 5, on the other PCB it looks like it ends in a 3. In addition, the black lettering on the two PCBs is entirely different. THAT tells me that they are from different production runs. So they may not even be using the same digital code.
Do the ICs on the boards have the same part numbers?? If not, they may not even be the same generation of IC.

 

well the board numbers are the same as for the numbers at the end. but yes they are different year runs.
i do have lots of soldering skills but mostly with thru hole stuff. but if i have issues my girl works at rami and they do circuit boards for teh goverment army radios and jet instruments. so i bet she has the skills
i do not know about the caps i can't read them they may be different.
being the remotes have the same model numbers the harbor breeze tech thinks the components are the same but the crystal is the only difference.
the ebay remote lights up just as the original one with the same color indicator light the difference is the ebay remote is missing some features from the original remote but again the harbor breeze tech told me that should not make much difference as the receiver would just not be getting those commands to process.
tell me this i found a 13.560 crystal on ebay for 2$ and being your all thinking this is a surface mount unit i'm thinking because it is setting on the black insulator that, that insulator has grooves in it to allow the pins to be bent over and thru those grooves in that insulator and then soldered at the ends. correct? if so how do i tell polarity? will that be marked on the bottom of the crystal?
i'm leaning on that insulator has grooves and i can put the crystal thru it bend the pins and solder it to the board? and for 2$ i really have not much to loose. based on the tech telling me more than likely the main ic will still send out the correct code for the receiver. thanks

 

i'm thinking because it is setting on the black insulator that, that insulator has grooves in it to allow the pins to be bent over and thru those grooves in that insulator and then soldered at the ends. correct?

Those groves you suspect might be there may or may not be there. If they're there then it's to allow the crystal to lay flat on the board. If you replace it with a crystal that has through hole leads then they will be much thicker and will hold the crystal up off the board more than the thickness of the spacer. Plus, it's never a good idea to bend component leads right up against the component. In addition to that - a component that heavy needs to be supported. Holding it up off the board leaves it prone to damage from being dropped. Shock / vibration can break the leads.

how do i tell polarity? will that be marked on the bottom of the crystal?

Crystals do not have a polarity, so mounting it either way would not be a problem. But I still think you'll need to change C1 & C2. And yes, they don't have any markings on them either. Nor do they have polarity, they're not electrolytic caps. Someone more experienced with crystals can answer the question of whether you need to change the caps. If so - they can tell you what value caps to put there.

Here's a generic picture of a crystal taken from the internet. It has legs. Not leads. They extend to the sides. They're very flat, so the spacer may or may not have groves. As for removing SMT components, one needs the right equipment. If you have enough experience - you could desolder the leads and gently remove the components but again, that gets iffy for damaging the pads where the components are soldered. Notice the flat leads on each end.

 

Those groves you suspect might be there may or may not be there. If they're there then it's to allow the crystal to lay flat on the board. If you replace it with a crystal that has through hole leads then they will be much thicker and will hold the crystal up off the board more than the thickness of the spacer. Plus, it's never a good idea to bend component leads right up against the component. In addition to that - a component that heavy needs to be supported. Holding it up off the board leaves it prone to damage from being dropped. Shock / vibration can break the leads.

Crystals do not have a polarity, so mounting it either way would not be a problem. But I still think you'll need to change C1 & C2. And yes, they don't have any markings on them either. Nor do they have polarity, they're not electrolytic caps. Someone more experienced with crystals can answer the question of whether you need to change the caps. If so - they can tell you what value caps to put there.

Here's a generic picture of a crystal taken from the internet. It has legs. Not leads. They extend to the sides. They're very flat, so the spacer may or may not have groves. As for removing SMT components, one needs the right equipment. If you have enough experience - you could desolder the leads and gently remove the components but again, that gets iffy for damaging the pads where the components are soldered. Notice the flat leads on each end.

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thanks i just ordered 2 crystals and we will see, the worst is it will not work. they did refund me so if i get them to work i will pay them back if not i will toss them and be done with this one. this is the crystal i have on the board it looks like it has pins that may be just bent over the insulator/mount. so for 4$ it is woth a try. if it fails it may need different caps but i will not pursue it futher. thanks.


this is what i found online for what they look like. and the 2 pin part in this photo is what i got with the 13.650 in the listing ans the freq. thanks a bunch for the help. when i get it installed working or now i can stop back and let you all know

 

Let us know how that works out for you.

 

When I look closely at that photo in post #1 I see a number 26.2982 ! whatI am sure about is the "26. part, though. THAT seems like it would be for a CB radio channel, which there are some channels reserved for "remote control" I think.
No matter what, though, the first thing will be to verify that the remote you bought even works at all. THAT might be a challenge, unless you have a short-wave receiver that can receive whatever frequency that remote sends out.

 

thanks but for the 4$ it cost for the crystal it is worth giving that a try, if i can't solder if i will have my girl do it she solders circuit boards all day long. thanks

 

if i have issues my girl works at rami and they do circuit boards for teh goverment army radios and jet instruments. so i bet she has the skills

Are you talking about having her take your project in to repair it at her place of employment? If so - they might not allow that. In that case, does she have the equipment at home to do the job?

 

she is a boss they will allow it. she has done it for me before when my iron burned out. thanks

 

Welcome to AAC.

The crystal in the foreground has a legible number on it. What is the number on the one further from the camera?

 

kyx 13.560 is on one and 26.2982 is the other one they one i need is the 13.560 i now have one in the mail thanks

 

The crystal will not be the only tuned component in the circuit. The values of C1 and C2 are chosen based on the crystal's frequency.

 

The other difficulty is this section here:



The capacitors (Cn) and inductors (Ln) for a matching network and a harmonic filter. This is frequency specific.

 

Since remote control schemes have assigned frequency allocations, any frequency will be close to the other one, so that a few kilohertz different is not likely to matter.

 

Since remote control schemes have assigned frequency allocations, any frequency will be close to the other one, so that a few kilohertz different is not likely to matter.

Actually one crystal is 13MHz and the other is 26MHz. So even if they are operating on the same band the load capacitors on the crystal will be different. And, if they are operating in the same band changing the crystal will not be a fix.

And, there are two different bands they could be operating in: 315MHz and 433MHz.

 

If you can get the FCC ID from the housing(s) a lot more information can be found about the two controls.

 

REALLY, though, I would not choose a wireles remote control for a ceiling fan. I have been asked to solve problems with some and so I am aware that they are not trouble free. AND, a that point, they are usually inoperative. If it is not in a sleeping area it is never a big deal to stand up and pull the chain. If it IS in a sleeping area I would either select the lowest speed prior to retiring, or switch it off. That is seldom a challenging decision to make. Of course, adding a timer is another simple option, at least for me.