# Bitcoin to lead to global warming

#### spinnaker

Joined Oct 29, 2009
7,815

Much of it has to do with bitcoin mining which consumes a significant amount of energy. It makes absolutely zero sense to me how you can run a program to produce a number that has value.

Hard enough to wrap my mind around how diamonds are so valuable (with the exception of industrial diamonds of course).

#### initial_total_mark

Joined Oct 29, 2018
1
I think what you are saying is correct, given the current price of bitcoin and the mining process. However, 12 months ago it was a different scenario - it really depends on the circumstances at any given time. In saying all of this, yes bitcoin mining if contributing to global warming but, realistically, so are MANY many other things

#### spinnaker

Joined Oct 29, 2009
7,815
No it does not make any sense at all that you can simply create a number and get money for it. It is a freaking video game they are playing!

#### FineWire

Joined Oct 12, 2018
4
I think bitcoin mining can impact global warming. In part, the electricity consumed in mining, comes from fossil fuels. So, there’s heat output from the processing power used. However, blockchain can help at the distribution of renewable energy, using smart contracts. Also there new altcoins that don’t involve mining, So maybe it all cancels out?

#### marcuskeene

Joined Oct 15, 2018
27
I think bitcoin mining can impact global warming. In part, the electricity consumed in mining, comes from fossil fuels. So, there’s heat output from the processing power used. However, blockchain can help at the distribution of renewable energy, using smart contracts. Also there new altcoins that don’t involve mining, So maybe it all cancels out?
To the best of my knowledge Bitcoin is the strongest and the most exchanged coin as of now. I don't think other coins match up to it and thus we can't really say the impact cancels out.

#### oz93666

Joined Sep 7, 2010
669
That link is to the most insane article I have ever glanced at ... Just pure logic will tell you it's a lie !
The title is
Bitcoin can push global warming above 2 C in a couple decades
Well if bit coin mining is using all this power who is paying the electric bill?? ! can you imagine how many trillions of $that is ??? there could never be enough computers made in the world to burn that much power .... But the people behind this article know how stupid people are , so it's worth a try .... Does anyone still believe there's no conspiracy ?? I suggest that article is politically driven ... The controlling bankers do not want any rivals to their monopoly , so they try and guilt people into not using bit coin . Next you'll be called "racist" if you buy bitcoin or don't support carbon taxes! #### bogosort Joined Sep 24, 2011 397 No it does not make any sense at all that you can simply create a number and get money for it. It is a freaking video game they are playing! Think of it as looking for a number that's hard to find and getting rewarded for finding it before anyone else. Same idea as mining for precious stones: people will spend significant money and effort to find rare minerals so long as the market value allows them to make a profit. #### nsaspook Joined Aug 27, 2009 6,279 That link is to the most insane article I have ever glanced at ... Just pure logic will tell you it's a lie ! The title is Bitcoin can push global warming above 2 C in a couple decades Well if bit coin mining is using all this power who is paying the electric bill?? ! can you imagine how many trillions of$ that is ??? there could never be enough computers made in the world to burn that much power .... But the people behind this article know how stupid people are , so it's worth a try ....

Does anyone still believe there's no conspiracy ??
Maybe now you can appreciate how hard it was to fake the Moon landing.

#### jgessling

Joined Jul 31, 2009
76
I think the researchers didn’t consider where these mining activities are taking place. Miners naturally looking for cheap electricity. One place they can find it is in the Pacific Northwest. This has led to real problems for small electric utilities that have ample hydropower but limited facilities. See:

https://www.nwpb.org/2018/04/09/central-washington-jurisdictions-call-time-out-on-bitcoin-boom/

Another location with cheap power is iceland. See:

Both locations have large renewable supplies so they don’t contrbute to glbal warning. Be careful with these articles because even though they are relatively recent the whole bitcoin economy is subject to massive shifts in short time periods. Just like any gold rush.

#### marcuskeene

Joined Oct 15, 2018
27
Does anyone still believe there's no conspiracy ??
That's not a new thing. The way crypto currencies are building its potential, even a layman feels intrigued. This market is said to change the future of fiscal system. I don't believe that traditional methods will vanish but atleast massively disrupted.

#### nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
6,279
That's not a new thing. The way crypto currencies are building its potential, even a layman feels intrigued. This market is said to change the future of fiscal system. I don't believe that traditional methods will vanish but atleast massively disrupted.
Bitcoin is a massive circle "" operation wasting massive amounts of electrical power to generate an abstract asset not a currency. The asset only has value because people are willing to invest 'real' money in the hope of finding 'greater fools'. The hype cycle ended this year will nothing but pain for the new investors in this asset.
https://money.cnn.com/video/investing/2018/09/10/bitcoin-investment-loss.cnnmoney/index.html
Large owners of Bitcoin are manipulating the price to extract 'real' money from new suckers with pump and dump cycles using the old standards of GREED and SPECULATION. Where is bitcoin actually useful? In places like Venezuela, where the national currency has already been manipulated into something people weave purses with. Even bitcoin looks good there.

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#### JoeJester

Joined Apr 26, 2005
4,077
Bitcoin can push global warming above 2 C in a couple decades
Yeah, don't do anything about that "cool" currency. It's only 10 times higher than the century estimate those AGW scientists predicted.

What's next ... electric car production?

#### spinnaker

Joined Oct 29, 2009
7,815
Bitcoin is a massive circle "" operation wasting massive amounts of electrical power to generate an abstract asset not a currency. The asset only has value because people are willing to invest 'real' money in the hope of finding 'greater fools'. The hype cycle ended this year will nothing but pain for the new investors in this asset.
https://money.cnn.com/video/investing/2018/09/10/bitcoin-investment-loss.cnnmoney/index.html
Large owners of Bitcoin are manipulating the price to extract 'real' money from new suckers with pump and dump cycles using the old standards of GREED and SPECULATION. Where is bitcoin actually useful? In places like Venezuela, where the national currency has already been manipulated into something people weave purses with. Even bitcoin looks good there.

The big winners of the bitcoin scam will be the bitcoin service owners.

#### marcuskeene

Joined Oct 15, 2018
27
Bitcoin is a massive circle "" operation wasting massive amounts of electrical power to generate an abstract asset not a currency. The asset only has value because people are willing to invest 'real' money in the hope of finding 'greater fools'. The hype cycle ended this year will nothing but pain for the new investors in this asset.
Contrary to this, Bitcoin is gaining acceptance and businesses have started accepting Crypto Currencies in exchange for goods and services.
Markets are always volatile, its not that stock exchange doesn't incur loses. Its an absurd logic to say that Crypto market isn't good since its volatile.
Countries have started accepting the trade and even established businesses are using this market to generate funds. Not that its always fooling the investors. The knowledge around the market is less and it will only grow with time.

#### nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
6,279
Contrary to this, Bitcoin is gaining acceptance and businesses have started accepting Crypto Currencies in exchange for goods and services.
Markets are always volatile, its not that stock exchange doesn't incur loses. Its an absurd logic to say that Crypto market isn't good since its volatile.
Countries have started accepting the trade and even established businesses are using this market to generate funds. Not that its always fooling the investors. The knowledge around the market is less and it will only grow with time.
All that is true, in Venezuela, Turkey and other places with a crap currency from sloppy and even malicious monetary policy. The most successful applications of cryptocurrencies are the black market and tax evasion. Sure, Wall Street has warmed to cryptocurrencies. It's understandable they are licking their chops at a new flock of rubes to fleece.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-bitcoin-gamble-1541064604

#### nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
6,279
It's sad the guy is also potentially messing up his kids lives in the pursuit of monetary unicorns.

#### bogosort

Joined Sep 24, 2011
397
Bitcoin is a massive circle "" operation wasting massive amounts of electrical power to generate an abstract asset not a currency. The asset only has value because people are willing to invest 'real' money in the hope of finding 'greater fools'.
The same could be said for gold. Unlike say copper, gold's value as an industrial commodity is a small percentage of its actual market value. The vast majority of its value is split between its use in jewelry and its use as a speculative investment, with the latter being the primary driver of its price and volatility. What's the difference between speculating in gold or speculating in bitcoin? As stores of "value" that are correlated to global currency prices, both gold and bitcoin are currency-like investments, though its easier to spend bitcoin than gold. And these days most gold trading is virtual: if you invest in gold, you're probably getting certificates rather than crates of bullion shipped.

As for the environmental impact of mining, gold mines are arguably worse for the environment than bitcoin mines. Bitcoin mines need a lot of electricity, but electricity is a secondary source of energy and can be clean or not depending on the primary source (which drives the generators). Through the use of public pressure and perhaps legislation, I can foresee bitcoin mines being required to use cleaner sources of electricity (though I'd think this is a bigger issue for the huge datacenters that currently run the internet as we know it). Gold mines, on the other hand, have direct and immediate consequences on the local environment. The mine itself is a speculative investment, with a very large initial cost and a slow production cycle (the mining process can take decades), putting significant pressure on the mining companies. Ore extraction requires toxic chemicals (like cyanide and mercury), which seep into the local water supply. And then there is the human safety factor: how many people a year die in bitcoin mines?

I'm not saying invest in bitcoin -- I certainly couldn't stomach that volatility. But I don't get why people rant about the "value" of bitcoin, but don't blink an eye about the "value" of gold.

#### nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
6,279
The same could be said for gold.
...
I'm not saying invest in bitcoin -- I certainly couldn't stomach that volatility. But I don't get why people rant about the "value" of bitcoin, but don't blink an eye about the "value" of gold.
Gold at least has a very long track record as an asset to keep because of the traditional physical effort needed to mine the stuff vs the bitcoin computational requirements of blockchain block double spending solution coin awards.
I agree with your points but only total ding-bats in gold speculation think that gold will become the future currency of the world while that attitude is mainstream in the bitcoin universe.

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