The main argument for having a gun at home that are being mentioned here are self-defense, mainly when your home is being invaded.

I would be interested to know if there is a truly reliable source of information or a reliable statistic on that subject.

See mine & debe's comments on the outlawing of guns in australia (posts 15 & 16).

Does having a gun at home really decrease the number of home invasions?

not sure. I would say undoubtedly it would decrease the number of successful home robberies. As I mentioned, you really couldn't say, unless you tested an entire same population both with & without guns.

Giving guns to just anybody involves the risk that a person who shouldn't have one can also get one EASILY. Not talking about the guys who get them illegally.

Once someone is a convicted criminal, they can't get one easily. or at least shouldn't be able to, per the law. Being a convicted criminal in a country that allows guns is the same as being a criminal in a one that doesn't; neither are "allowed" to have guns but they both do. Why not let the innocents also carry guns to protect themselves rather than being defenseless sheep?

 

Like my neighbor cop down the street says, "The bad guys have guns, why not the good guys too?"

 

I wonder how true the Heinlein phrase is in todays modern societies.

It's hard to have an opinion based on facts, I mean to detach the whole thing from subjectivity and rely on statistics (because they don't exist). When I lived in South America there were some situations where I don't know if it was desirable to be armed. They arrive seldom alone, point their guns at you and you pass everything you have, your car, motorcycle, money cellphone, whatever they want.
Happened to several friends of mine.

They also stole a motorcycle from my garage (maybe that could have been avoided)

Now, if they assume you are armed, does that help you or not. Will they shoot first or will they avoid assaulting you. Big question!

The main reason for governments making access to firearms more difficult to the normal population seems to be to avoid murders that are committed by a "normal" person, mainly in relationships or ex-relationships etc. I read somewhere.

I personally would be more afraid of my apparently normal neighbor being armed than of any burglar, just because there aren't so many of them here. The desire to have a gun for self-defense depends probably on where you live. So I prefer living in less dangerous areas and live with less stress.

As for the children, I don't know if explaining anything to them does really help.

"Don't touch the oven, it's hot!" , next thing I hear is someone crying because he burned his hand... Their world is so different from ours.

 

How about this statistic:

In 2007, there were a total of 31,224 firearm deaths in the US, of which 17,352 were suicides. Only 12,632 were homicides.

Also in 2007, there were 41,059 motor vehicle related deaths.

This tells me that firearms are significantly less dangerous than automobiles.

----------------

Yeah, I know, someone is going to say that there are more car owners than gun owners, and I give you that. But my guess is that if more good guys had guns, the firearm homicide rate would decrease, not increase, as has happened (repeatedly) in states that changed to less repressive gun laws.

 

This tells me that firearms are significantly less dangerous than automobiles..

So finally I know why discussions about automotive modifications are not allowed on AAC.

 

I wonder how true the Heinlein phrase is in todays modern societies.

So you think maybe people have changed? I don't.

Automotive modifications are banned because the people who use this site want to keep it around. The USA is sue happy.

 

Bill_Marsden;449733]Automotive modifications are banned because the people who use this site want to keep it around. The USA is sue happy.

So...

How about handgun modifications????

 

Yeah, I know, someone is going to say that there are more car owners than gun owners, and I give you that. But my guess is that if more good guys had guns, the firearm homicide rate would decrease, not increase, as has happened (repeatedly) in states that changed to less repressive gun laws.

Actually in a strange twist, (if you believe wikipedia) the USA has more gun owners (88.8 gun owners per 100 residents) than car owners (828 car owners per 1000 residents).

 

switzerland has estimated 45 guns per 100 people (#2 -to- #4) in the list of guns per capita.

[swiss]Police statistics for the year 2006 records 34 killings or attempted killings involving firearms, compared to 69 cases involving bladed weapons and 16 cases of unarmed assault. Cases of assault resulting in bodily harm numbered 89 (firearms) and 526 (bladed weapons). As of 2007, Switzerland had a population of about 7,600,000. This would put the rate of killings or attempted killings with firearms at about one for every quarter million residents yearly

So, some demographics are perfectly capable of keeping a sound mind about them while surrounded by firearms. This is why I keep saying you can't compare country X to country Z; it all depends who lives there. A good portion of the US I wouldn't trust with a gun.

 

This is why I keep saying you can't compare country X to country Z; it all depends who lives there.

I guess you are right.

So you think maybe people have changed? I don't.

No, humans don't evolve or change, only technology, general knowledge, education and living standard. You destroy modern society (by one last war for example), people will behave like they did 2000 years ago.

However, a modern society like in any city in western Europe is quite different from what it used to be a few hundred years ago. What I meant with modern societies is the values they thaught us when we were in school, the attempt to teach us to learn something from history, the importance of trying to live in peace etc.... So that it shouldn't be necessary to be armed.

You touched the main problem which is not the gun itself, but the circumstances and/or the hostile environment and last but not least the fact that people don't change that make it necessary to have a gun for self-defense.

This discussion would make more sense if it only had participants from one country, so they would all have the same experiences. I never lived in the US, so I can't say how I'd feel about it if I lived there.

 

I go to a lot of shoots in the summer, usually TX, AZ, NV, KY, and IN.

Ever been to this one, it's in KY at the Knob Creek Range. Check out the night shoot and minigun videos. You can rent any gun you want, if you can afford it.

http://machinegunshoot.com/media/video

 

Well, it's not "guns" in the traditional sense of the word, but I decided to try something new today. I had never been in an airsoft battle before, so I thought I'd give it a try. It turned out to be a lot of fun Now I can cross that one off my bucket list!

 

Ever been to this one, it's in KY at the Knob Creek Range. Check out the night shoot and minigun videos. You can rent any gun you want, if you can afford it.

http://machinegunshoot.com/media/video

Yeah well that looks like fun. Anyone tries this one out without earmuffs? Must be noisy like hell.

 

Tons of fun And yes it's loud, but there are several ear plug vendors around. I have a video of my wife shooting a WW2 Sten gun, when my brother in law saw it he said" Are you crazy!! you put a machinegun in your wifes hands". They shoot at containers of Tannerite, that's the explosions you see in the videos.

 

The Minigun is impressive, I read it can fire up to 6000 rounds per minute, i.e. 100 per second

But it doesn't make the distinctive sound of a machine gun...

I wish they were all made for the sole purpose of having fun though.

Can anyone buy something like this? Is there a list somewhere of what guns are available to the normal population in the US?

 

[QUOTECan anyone buy something like this?][/QUOTE]
Anyone over the age of 21, with no arrest record, living in a Class III state, and possesing a large amount of money
The laws vary from state to state, I can only tell you about TN. If you meet the above criteria, and can get your chief law enforcement official to vouch for you, you can own a full auto or silenced firearm. Then you have to go through the federal background check process.
Several years ago there was a report about automatic weapons in TN, and in it there was not a single incident of a legally owned automatic weapon used in a crime of any type. You can't say that about baseball bats, hammers, knives,etc...

 

For anyone interested in statistics, I found this great document, Firearm Injury in the U.S., but it's from a few years ago.

With regard to the next graph I still wonder: Would the TOTAL number of homicides decrease or not when firearms were not available?

Someone makes a guess?

 

I don't see any mention of how many were used for self defense?
Or how many were used while in the possesion of a criminal who cannot legaly purchase/posses one.

 

Since you're asking for predictions, mine is that [If guns were outlawed and confiscated in america...] homicides may go down modestly (that's a very liberal assumption, and not at all what happened in Australia), but that armed robberies, rapes, home invasions, etc would grow by an eclipsing percentage. The bad guys might not "need" to kill anybody to get what they want anymore, but would have more of a "sure bet" of no opposition to their nefarious deeds. Not worth it IMO. Not to mention, by that action you remove the citizen's ability to fend off a hostile enemy invasion.

 

Since you're asking for predictions, mine is that [If guns were outlawed and confiscated in america...] homicides may go down modestly (that's a very liberal assumption, and not at all what happened in Australia), but that armed robberies, rapes, home invasions, etc would grow by an eclipsing percentage. The bad guys might not "need" to kill anybody to get what they want anymore, but would have more of a "sure bet" of no opposition to their nefarious deeds. Not worth it IMO. Not to mention, by that action you remove the citizen's ability to fend off a hostile enemy invasion.

should I be scared since I do not have one?