2 Series MSO Mixed Signal Oscilloscope

Ya’akov

Joined Jan 27, 2019
6,550
Even though I know how and why these scopes are so compact, it is still jarring. I remember Tek scopes that couldn’t approach the functionality of these that required carts, which seemed totally normal. The CRTs, transformers, and other large components made “miniaturization” seem impossible.

Even when it was done, it meant a tiny display with e tiny tube, not the huge display on these that is far larger than even scopes weighing 20x these flat ones. Time and technology wait for no one, I suppose.

But each passing year the contrast between technologies I grew up and current commonplace miracles makes me feel incrementally older with the occasional punctuation, like this one.
 

Irving

Joined Jan 30, 2016
3,127
Nice, but what does an entry-level Tek cost, compared, say, to the equivalent Keysight, Siglent or Rigol? Tho seeing one next to the Keysight that display is rather stunning....
 

Thread Starter

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
10,406
Nice, but what does an entry-level Tek cost, compared, say, to the equivalent Keysight, Siglent or Rigol? Tho seeing one next to the Keysight that display is rather stunning....
Both are not typical beginner hobby scopes and have prices above 2K for either Oscope for the 200MHz models. Long term instrument stability (from calibration records) when used to generate product quality records from PM's and repairs are the top priority. That, and the fact I like new toys. I have digital probes from another TEK MSO that fit the MSO22 but that functionality doesn't seem to be in the early versions of firmware yet. :(
PXL_20220905_185248090.jpgPXL_20220905_184302334.jpg
 

rsjsouza

Joined Apr 21, 2014
366
That is a nice bit of kit you have there.

My biggest beef with Tek's new models was an evaluation I did a few years ago (perhaps 2019) on their then new MDO3 and MDO4 series, whose UI was terribly slow even with just a function or two enabled - and I am talking about seconds to react to a mouse click or a touchscreen press. I was told a couple of years later this was still the case.

Well, perhaps my second biggest beef was the need to pay through the nose to have options that were standard in your entry level offerings from the other manufacturers (even Keysight) - things such as protocol decoding, for example.

I sincerely hope the 2 series has a better track record than its bigger siblings...
 

Thread Starter

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
10,406
That is a nice bit of kit you have there.

My biggest beef with Tek's new models was an evaluation I did a few years ago (perhaps 2019) on their then new MDO3 and MDO4 series, whose UI was terribly slow even with just a function or two enabled - and I am talking about seconds to react to a mouse click or a touchscreen press. I was told a couple of years later this was still the case.

Well, perhaps my second biggest beef was the need to pay through the nose to have options that were standard in your entry level offerings from the other manufacturers (even Keysight) - things such as protocol decoding, for example.

I sincerely hope the 2 series has a better track record than its bigger siblings...
The UI is snappy with a ARM A53 but the prices for what should be default functionality is still high IMO.
https://developer.arm.com/Processors/Cortex-A53
 

Thread Starter

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
10,406
CAN-FD decoding. The KEYSIGHT has CAN as a extra cost serial option but it only does classic CAN (like most value scopes), NOT can-fd (and all variations) like the TEK does.
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https://www.picotech.com/library/oscilloscopes/can-bus-serial-protocol-decoding
CAN bus (Controller Area Network) is a serial data standard originally developed in the 1980s by Robert Bosch GmbH for use in automotive applications. Today it is also widely used in industrial process control and aerospace applications.

It allows microcontrollers and electronic devices to communicate with each other without using a host computer and provides fast and reliable data transfer in electrically noisy environments at low cost and with minimal wiring.

CAN employs differential signaling to provide a high level of immunity to electrical noise.

In 1991 Bosch published the specification for CAN 2.0, which details two formats:

  • CAN 2.0A is the standard format with an 11-bit identifier.
  • CAN 2.0B is the extended format with a 29-bit identifier.
In 1993 ISO (International Organization for Standardization) released the CAN standard ISO 11898, which was later restructured into three parts:

  • ISO 11898-1 which covers the data link layer
  • ISO 11898-2 which covers the CAN physical layer for high-speed CAN (up to 1 Mbit/s).
  • ISO 11898-3 which covers the CAN physical layer for low-speed, fault-tolerant CAN (up to 125 kbit/s)
Bosch subsequently released CAN FD 1.0 or CAN with Flexible Data-rate, which was incorporated into ISO 11898-1:2015. This specification allows for increased data lengths as well as optionally switching to a faster bit rate after the arbitration is decided. CAN FD is reverse-compatible with existing CAN 2.0 networks, so new CAN FD devices can coexist on the same network with existing CAN devices.
 

ronsimpson

Joined Oct 7, 2019
2,385
Thanks for the picture of the two scopes. For decades I lived with B&W scopes, but now I really like Color and large displays.
I do not like a display where 1/2 of it is display is menus and junk. I want a full screen of waveforms.
A scope that is two inches thick is nice. Today I noticed how little space a scope takes up.
I do not like waiting for Windows to startup before the scope functions. "Please wait for windows to update."
Some scopes now have a built-in waveform generator. You can make a low frequency VNA.
I do not like the idea of a low-end scope that will do many more features if you pay more money. The idea of a 70mhz/100mhz/200mhz/300mhz scope that comes in 70mhz mode and wants you credit card to upgrade. Or the 8-bit scope but for $200.00 it turns into a 12-bit scope. From a hardware person's point of view, I hate spending another $1000.00 on upgrades.
What happens when Windows-10 stops working and the scope will not function with Windows-11 or 12 or ....?

At home I have a number of early digital scopes. Back then memory was slow and costly. Memory was measured in Kb not mb or Gb. At work I was looking at a waveform that is 1000 displays long. Nice to zoom in and slide back and forth on a saved waveform.

It is also nice to have a scope on the internet. You can let someone in Japan take over the scope for a while. They can save waveforms and do math on the data.
 
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