What's the sound of one hand clapping?

ftp://ftp.mct.gov.br/Biblioteca/109... for the existence of chemists and beyond.pdf

If one hand is CLAPPING....by it's definition that hand would be impacting something. A leg...an ass...a cheek.

One way or another...CLAPPING means it's hitting something.

Split Infinity

 

I'm disappointed I don't see any response to my post#4.

I know it was shorter than any of yours so I will expand a little.

Consider known physical quantities and how many (spatial) dimensions are required to fully define or describe them or, if you will, what is the least number for the known definition to function.

Mass and energy do not even require two dimensions, they can operate in one single dimension.

Forces, velocities, momentum, moments of inertia and so on require at least two dimensions.

Properties such as stress require three dimensions, they are incomplete in two.

This much we know and can completely prove.

The first group we call scalars
The second we call vectors
The third we call tensors

We have unproven theories in abundance that posit further (spatial) dimensions but they remain just that - unproven theories.

Why are they unproven?

Because, without exception, all contain conclusions we do not observe as well as conclusions we do observe.

The only known watertight self consistent system that has never been contradicted by observation is the one I outlined above.

go well

 

We have unproven theories in abundance that posit further (spatial) dimensions but they remain just that - unproven theories.

Why are they unproven?

Because, without exception, all contain conclusions we do not observe as well as conclusions we do observe.

The only known watertight self consistent system that has never been contradicted by observation is the one I outlined above.

go well

not to mention 26 dimensions of Bosonic string theory.... just an exercise in mathematics.

p.s. I don't think you will get a response, neither do i think my link will get read

 

I'm disappointed I don't see any response to my post#4.

I know it was shorter than any of yours so I will expand a little.



Consider known physical quantities and how many (spatial) dimensions are required to fully define or describe them or, if you will, what is the least number for the known definition to function.

Mass and energy do not even require two dimensions, they can operate in one single dimension.

Forces, velocities, momentum, moments of inertia and so on require at least two dimensions.

Properties such as stress require three dimensions, they are incomplete in two.

This much we know and can completely prove.

The first group we call scalars
The second we call vectors
The third we call tensors

We have unproven theories in abundance that posit further (spatial) dimensions but they remain just that - unproven theories.

Why are they unproven?

Because, without exception, all contain conclusions we do not observe as well as conclusions we do observe.

The only known watertight self consistent system that has never been contradicted by observation is the one I outlined above.

go well

You state that Mass and Energy do not even need two dimensions and that they can operate in one.

Unless you are refering to how mass and energy can be effected or partially governed by Gravitational Effect...mass and energy...or at the very most basic construct....Quantum Particle/Wave Forms...cannot exist in a One Dimensional State of Singularity.

One Dimensionality is a Universal Geometry that has no distance, area, time and thus no particle be it one of mass or energy can exist. Neither can frequency of any kind exist.

Velocity, momentum, inertia cannot exist in a 2-Dimensional state as in order for these things to exist there must exist matter and energy as well as time and distance...these things do not exist in a 2-Dimensional state.

Scalars, Tensors and Vectors are terminology that can only exist within the construct of our Multi-Dimensional Universal Reality and they cannot exist independent of one another as well they do not exist as a reality of one dimensional state specific to each or even if three dimensional states were used along with each.

You are confusing a Reality of Universal Dimensionality with a Description associated with a word and it's use.

Split Infinity

 

not to mention 26 dimensions of Bosonic string theory.... just an exercise in mathematics.

p.s. I don't think you will get a response, neither do i think my link will get read

I have posted MANY TIMES that our Universal Reality has at a minimum 10 or 11 dimensional states but that I believe there is more.

Be it String Theory or M or Brane Theory or Multiversal Interconnective Quantum Exchange and Transfer Theory which would have INFINITE DIMENSIONAL STATES....one thing is for certain...because of the way Quantum Mechanics behaves and has been observed...4-D is not a possibility in our Universal Geometry.

Add to this the ability of Quanta to have two or more functions never mind act as both particle and wave.

And lets not forget how and why the Higgs-Boson gives Protons and Neutrons mass.

Split Infinity

 

<snip>

And you base this ridicule upon what?

There exists conditions and cause and effects especially in the Quantum Mechanics arena as well as Linear and Non-Linear time which cannot be difinitively assigned to be a result of Dimensionality or other as yet unknown interconnectivity either within or between Universal States.

Since no one has yet come even close to explaining the Macro and Sub Atomic scales of behavior...anyone passing judgement upon any particular geometry is just spinning their wheels.

Let me ask you this question...In a Black Hole's achieved Singularity...does the matter and energy that collapsed still in our Universal Reality or not?

Split Infinity

 

One very telling observation of our Universes Natural Laws is how an isolated Electron has been detected and observed performing two or more functions. Now after isolating it...it was used to power a micro electric motor...it was also detected grounding out and also was detected as being taken on in an atoms unfilled orbit.

Thus 3 functions for one isolated Electron. There is only ONE THEORY that can explain this behavior and that is a Multiversal System. The double slit light experiment is similar in that it shows Photons having more than one function.

Both experiments also show the possibility of the interconnectivity of Quanta between Divergent Universal States.

Now this next statement might be seen as fringe by some but it is a reality and the U.S. Mlitary has spent BILLIONS researching and developing this. Remote veiwing. As well the FBI has on their payroll actual Psychics. Now why would the U.S. Military, FBI, CIA, DIA, NSA as well as the Russians and Chinese spend Billions of dollars on such programs?

The answer is simple...they work. And despite the statements saying such research was stopped long ago...it has actually increased. One recent major network took 5 remote veiwers no longer on military payroll and on prime time with the aid of a security firm to keep results honest...televised these people finding multiple destinations by remote veiwing with zero errors.

All five of these people risked DEATH as that is the penalty for such disclosure and if it wasn't for the fact that the Military will not confirm they exist...they surely would be. Now how is this ability accomplished?

Quantum Interconnectivity and Transfer. A Sensitives ability to access data or information in the very fabric of what makes up everything as well as what makes Space/Time as without Matter and Energy...there can be no Space/Time.

Split Infinity

 

I believe the current phrase for this nonsense in 'word salad'.

It remains a pity that the OP cannot recognize a post that provides partial support for the premise of the original post.

1) It is possible to construct a mathematical system of physics that is consistent in n = 1,2,3, 4 or more spatial dimensions.

2) A being inhabiting such an n dimensional world could easily determine if she was just on the cross section of an (n+1) world by one of several means. One method is to seek shadows. Another is to seek a physical effect that produces an effect perpendicular to its dimensions of operation. I'm sure there are other ways.

3) Such observations in our physical reality lead to the conclusion that we do not live in a four (or more) dimensional world.

4) Inhabitants of 'Flatland' could easily perform similar experiments to determine the reality of three dimensions.

 

Actually...the vast majority of what you state here is completely wrong.

Matter is comprised of Protons and most of the time...Neutrons which have Electron Orbital Fields with the Quanta known as Electrons existing as both Particle and Wave.

Right there it shows Matter is comprised of Particles of Mass as well as Particle/Wave Forms of Energy. Thus Matter shows itself...just to START...as existing in at least 4-D...but even that is wrong and not enough dimensionality as everything Protons and Neutrons are comprised of are Quantum Particle/Wave Forms such as Quarks, Gluons, Leptons, Mesons...etc...where in some cases such as Quarks are blinking in and out of Universal Reality at will between a numerical minimum and maximum plus other realities such as Quantum Chromodynamics, Higgs-Bosons responsible for giving Protons and Neutrons Mass...Photons and Electrons Frequency...Photons ability to have Momentum and a host of other abilities that exceed 3-D REALITY.

Your statement that an object only has 3 Dimensional States is incorrect as the definition of an OBJECT as a NOUN...is a material thing that can be SEEN AND TOUCHED.

To be able to touch something it the Electron Orbital Fields surrounding the Atomic Nuleus' of any part of your body must be effected by the Electron Orbital Fields surrounding the Atomic Nucleus' of other Atoms. Thus when my finger TOUCHES the keys as I type this the Electron Orbital Fields repell each other as the Nucleus' of the Atoms making up my fingers and the keys never come into contact.

Seeing as a condition to define and object would seem a bit old fashion but still...the Light or Photons that are repelled by the Atoms or Orbital fields of...are detected by my eyes and my optic nerve...thus be it by sight or touch there is MORE THAN 3-DIMENSIONAL STATES existing that make up and define and object as well as allow that object to be touched or seen.

Also...4-D with the first 3-D relugated to the OBJECT as you have defined it so...and 1 more or the 4th-D representing TIME...is not enough Dimensionality for Protons, Neutrons, Electrons and all the Quantum Particle/Wave Forms that comprise what is in an Atomic Nucleus to even exist.

Split Infinity

You need to back up most of these statements. Most of them are utterly ridiculous. But for now, I'd settle if you tell me YOUR DEFINITIONS for at least the first 11 dimensions. Because they are obviously different from the rest of the world's.

Also...one more thing to add in reply to Derstrom....TIME is a necessity for Matter and Energy to exist. If there is no time...there is no movement...if there is no movement...there cannot exist Electron Orbital Fields...if these don't exist...neither can anything else.

Although Time is seen and experienced as Linear by us...in a Multiversal System Time would be Non-Linear. Still...without movement thus no time...there can neither be action and reaction or cause and effect.

The Quantum Particle/Wave Forms that comprise every aspect of an ATOM owe part of their existance to TIME. Thus...any existing Particle or Quanta has as part of it's Space/Time dimensionality and interconnectivity to it...intrinsic to TIME or 4-D as it is commonly known.

Still...any Particle in existance cannot exist within only 3 or 4 Geometric Dimensional States.

Split Infinity

Well duh, time is an integrated part of physics, but I'm talking about taking a snapshot at any given point in time. The object will "exist" (in the traditional sense of the word) in three-dimensional space only. All the other dimensions require time to be constantly changing.

 

And lets not forget how and why the Higgs-Boson gives Protons and Neutrons mass.

That has not been proven. It is still theory, and cannot be used in an argument unless it is used as such. You cannot state it as a fact, as it has not been proven to be true.

 

I remember reading an article in a mensa magazine (I think) which talked about there being a real possibility that the third dimension (as we know it) is just a big illusion.

I couldn't grasp what the article was talking about.

There we go.

 

I keep seeing this title in Off Topic, "Why a 2D world is BUNK" and keep wondering, Who asked? Does somebody here live in a 2-D world? What am I missing?

Edit: Hang on. Is this what is called, "begging the question"?

 

I remember reading an article in a mensa magazine (I think) which talked about there being a real possibility that the third dimension (as we know it) is just a big illusion.

I couldn't grasp what the article was talking about.

There we go.

When I first read this reply I thought you meant someone had proved the existence of a third dimension in addition to the two in our world.



PS Wish we had a better laughter icon.

 

It MUST be possible to live in a 2 dimensional world. Where else would Flatlanders come from?

 

I keep seeing this title in Off Topic, "Why a 2D world is BUNK" and keep wondering, Who asked? Does somebody here live in a 2-D world? What am I missing?

Edit: Hang on. Is this what is called, "begging the question"?

I don't know if it is "begging the question," but it sure is what is called "asking a loaded question"!

 

Im perdy gud @ englis, but I'm running into words and phrases that I THOUGHT I understood, all in a row today.

 

I remember reading an article in a mensa magazine (I think) which talked about there being a real possibility that the third dimension (as we know it) is just a big illusion.

I couldn't grasp what the article was talking about.

There we go.

was it related to this ?

 

Bad case of mind f^(k.

If the entire universe is a hologram, where is the projector?

 

Bad case of mind f^(k.

If the entire universe is a hologram, where is the projector?

On Voyager, the Doctor did not need a projector

This is the first time I have read about this theory (thank you Sparky), I like it better than 26 dimensions required to make boson work, considering the fact that this on tries to account for the fact that we are really all mostly empty space (on subatomic level), which always freaked me out...

I wonder how much of current research is actually following scientific method and how much is simply trying to fit data to justify proposed statements. Will we ever know?

 

This thread was a bit questionable to begin with, but we allowed it.

Then I screwed up and moved it to off topic. Sorry about that.

It as diverged from the science aspect quite a bit, it was meant to be a thought experiment, not to be taken literally, which was pretty obvious. Many of the concepts that apply to two dimensions also apply to higher dimensions, but it was possible to do this on a piece of paper. This is what makes it valuable for students and young people.

Since I think we have covered most of the ground needed we are done here.