Like the price of oil. Raise the price of oil and people conserve, reducing demand. So the price falls.

I think this is playing around with numbers that economists spend a lifetime trying to figure out.

Lay all the economists in the world head to foot and they still would not reach a conclusion.

 

I dunno I don't think our country is hard to fix at all. Even the immigrant problem is easily fixed with common sense. Heres how maxpower would fix the world!
1.Legalize Marijuana and have the gov, and pharmacies work with mexicans and columbians to produce medicinal quality marijuana. Then cut out the cartels and take it from mexican grower to dispensory taxing it along the way.

I have long been in favor with this, minus the part about involving mexicans and columbians. We could grow it here on our own soil, instead of subsidizing our farmers. The only reason the cartels exist is because the they have a monopoly on their product. If we grew it here, and sold it for less than they sell it for, they would cease to have a reason for existing. This would also all but eliminate the "war on drugs" - and generate a hefty profit in "sin tax"

2. Buy up all the opium the middle east produces to make legit painkillers rather then buying it from US pharma-farms that charge 50X the price. This would take a ton of money away from the terrorist like it would the cartels.

disagree here

3. Tax chinese products imported into the united states 300% no deals, or breaks!

search this forum for "strantor's plan to save america"

4. Abolish political parties

I'm not sure that political parties could be abolished in the minds of the people as an ideal, but I do agree that at this point in time, political affilliations are doing more harm than good. This is a time in history when we really need to be working as a team, and we have never been more divided (except maybe during the civil war)

5. Send a monkey to mars.

icing on the cake. love it. I would add, cut go****ment spending, but that might lead to politics.

 

Like the price of oil. Raise the price of oil and people conserve, reducing demand. So the price falls.

I think this is playing around with numbers that economists spend a lifetime trying to figure out.

Lay all the economists in the world head to foot and they still would not reach a conclusion.

yeah I don't think it is possible to figure out. There's a lot of human aspect to all of it, any way you go it depends on the people.

 

It is also not very clear at all now as the jobs of today are very different from the jobs when minimum wage was first set in place. In addition, at least here, people already routinely work for room and board during harvest season.

Check this out if interested http://www.princeton.edu/~tleonard/papers/Womenswork.pdf- eugenics!? somehow it fits right in.

 

@strantor, I would also allow Medicinal patients or even everyone a small amount to grow on their own. It wouldn't only be mexicans only, but there is a demand for imported medicine like that because if you look at some of the legal states and dispensories their prices are higher then some of the illegal states. I think the whole market of legalization/medicinal or otherwise has enough room for imported and grown here in the US. But we need to help them become legal and have jobs in mexico growing it and not give the money to the cartels.

About the middle east thing, people of all types are loyal to money. The taliban buys the raw opium from the afgan and iraq farmers then sells it for money to the mob to turn into illegal heroine to flood EU with. If while in the ME, we had forged relationships to buy all their opium it would cut off a vital money line to terrorist. Plus medication cost would go down because where we get it now <MA> we pay way more then the taliban. And with the baby boomer generation aging were gonna need more and more opiates.

 

@strantor, I would also allow Medicinal patients or even everyone a small amount to grow on their own. It wouldn't only be mexicans only, but there is a demand for imported medicine like that because if you look at some of the legal states and dispensories their prices are higher then some of the illegal states. I think the whole market of legalization/medicinal or otherwise has enough room for imported and grown here in the US. But we need to help them become legal and have jobs in mexico growing it and not give the money to the cartels.

Why do we need to "have jobs in mexico growing it and not give the money to the cartels"? Why bother with that? Chances are the cartels will wind up with it anyways; they run that land. We have massive expanses of fertile crop land not being utilized right now. why not grow pot there? fields of it, not a couple of plants on a handful of back porches. That would drive the cost down to the point where we could tax the crap out of it and still make it cheaper than mexican swag. And I think that our American farmers are a lot less likely to be giving money to cartels.

opiates are bad news. whether the chemists chop it up and call it antidepressants or not.

 

we will soon find out how the vote in Washington State goes (they are counting signatures right now).

Clearly pot should be legalized and grown at home, Mexico would be partially excluded, although not completely as their plants would still be cheaper, but of much lower quality. It would all depend on the regulatory system set up. The cartel would then be largely Mexican problem. Also would be good to switch from cotton to hemp

 

The more I think about this, the less clear it seems. Unfortunately, I don't think any of this can be more than opinion for most of us. Could removing minimum wage rates really precipitate a demand collapse? Is there such a thing as a mathematical model which could predict that with any degree of certainty?

I started out thinking that removing the minimum wage would on the whole be helpful, albeit in a limited way and with some risk of increasing the conflict between rich and poor. The idea of it triggering a more profound recession is a frightening one. Perhaps it would be wise not to do anything too precipitous.

I admitted that facet of the problem in paragraph six in my first post.

If we do not voluntarily cut back in all areas, let the businesses that were forced by lack of profit to move overseas to return, allow the stock market to reflect the true state of business today, we are only going to hit the wall going faster.

Cutting minimum wage would probably result in riots, though very few are affected by that one thing, and they receive a few extra thousand a year for EIC, and qualify for Food and Heating and Rent assistance in many cases already.

Where the real riots would break out is if welfare were to be cut. Not disability, not social security, not unemployment insurance, but simply receiving a check for being alive. There are many abuses to it, which hurt those who need it by a huge margin (remember also what I stated in my post). Nobody wants to investigate the abuses, since it would be racist (seriously, just look up senate welfare study).

If Mexicans are taking jobs nobody else would work at, such as Florida, then fruit would cost more if the jobs were made OSHA compliant, they simply don't want to do that and anger the hispanics (umm, racist again).

30% the US just wants to be left alone, including being forgiven their debt, and given a "living wage" whether they work or not (hello inflation) Of course, many protests on TV are formed and managed by "professional demonstrators", so I guess lining up for mace is something I would want to be paid to do as well. The whole 99% thing turned funny when theft and rape turned up to be common when they wouldn't let the police in. The NY Group had over half a million dollars (becoming those who they hate), and were still asking for food, clothing, and money donations. One guy wrote a check from the "public donation account" for 5 grand to buy food for his area which was away from the chefs, the organizers called it theft, though his name was on the bank signature card. Seems those people want to be in control/power more than anything else.

That's another group that would be rioting.

I don't have the solution, and I don't know all the problems, but I can point a lot of fingers around at things that are easily solved and those that aren't.

As I said before, this system is on the brink of collapse, and I'm pretty sure no matter the result in November, there will be minor rioting, just like in 2008 (but that was happy rioting!).

It's a game of hot potato and nobody wants to be holding it, or even looking at it.

For all we know, the world will end in Dec, 2012, and that's why everybody is fiddling while Rome burns, I can't think of a different answer to the backwards and poorly thought out "solutions" to the "problems" we have.

The problem we have is people are bored, so they are ready to carry a flag for any cause, how do you think we got lead free solder that makes multi-million dollar satellites fail? People want a nice cabin in the woods away from people for a while, then get all angry when somebody else builds a cabin in the last purchasable land in the US as well, even though they both moved there for the same reason.

I've never seen the public so polarized, and not just about R vs. D, it's Vegetarian vs. Meat eaters, Electric car drives vs. SUV drivers, I don't need to type out an entire list, but you get the gist. I don't have facebook, but have heard some odd stories of it. How many of you with facebook up up something of a funny joke, and lost friends because of it? That makes no sense to me, which is why I don't partake in social experiments like Facebook and Twitter. It'd be easier to walk into the NSA and tell them my true desire to rule the world instead.

crap, was that out loud?

 

Nice rant! That gets an A from me. What percentage of Americans do you think share your precognition that we are on the brink of failure? I do, and some I talk to do, but seems we are content to go about our daily lives as if it's not coming. why is that?

 

Nice rant! That gets an A from me. What percentage of Americans do you think share your precognition that we are on the brink of failure? I do, and some I talk to do, but seems we are content to go about our daily lives as if it's not coming. why is that?

Collective unconscious? The news (any news channel or paper) doesn't seem to touch on the topic. I think it's simple self realization when you actually stand back and look at the problem, and how to fix it, and what the consequences of that correction would be. I personally believe that television has a lot to do with docility of people and lack of free thought. It's hard to have conversations with people who work 8 to 5, then go home and channel surf with a 12 pack until they go to sleep. They think everything is hunky dory. Like some some sort of telegraphic Soma.

 

so it sounds like a plan might be eliminate social assistance first, see how many people survive, then move on to eliminate minimum wage...

There are many abuses of welfare, of subsidized housing and other social systems. Note that government workers themselves receive their salary but fail to do their work. Will removing social support actually solve any problems? Often elderly people and single parents depend on those for survival. I would rather approach it from a humanitarian perspective than a political one...

 

opiates are bad news. whether the chemists chop it up and call it antidepressants or not.

Opiates are painkillers not antidepressents. I agree with you antidepresents are bad. I also agree painkillers are bad. But some of us that live in 24/7 pain need them to function and work so we don't go on welfare. Like it or not painkillers are safer then asprin. Asephetemin is what their finding is screwing up everyones liver. Actual opiate based painkillers without asprin do little damage. Some nerve damage over long times. But as I said I fear anti depressents much more. Many of these new drugs could spread symptoms and effects over generations. Plus I'm just thinking of a way to weaken the cartels. Marijuana is their cornerstone cash cow. We need to kill that off regardless. And until there is an economy in mexico they will keep hoping the border stealing some of our jobs.

 

Opiates are painkillers not antidepressents. I agree with you antidepresents are bad. I also agree painkillers are bad. But some of us that live in 24/7 pain need them to function and work so we don't go on welfare. Like it or not painkillers are safer then asprin. Asephetemin is what their finding is screwing up everyones liver. Actual opiate based painkillers without asprin do little damage. Some nerve damage over long times. But as I said I fear anti depressents much more. Many of these new drugs could spread symptoms and effects over generations. Plus I'm just thinking of a way to weaken the cartels. Marijuana is their cornerstone cash cow. We need to kill that off regardless. And until there is an economy in mexico they will keep hoping the border stealing some of our jobs.

I agree, opium was used for centuries in central Asia before Europeans got there. It is also much safer than morphine or codeine as it has no additives (presumably). It has been shown many times that prohibition never works, but making it legal will not solve all of the problems - think of cigarettes, fairly large smuggling operations exist, mostly due to varied regulatory systems.

I've been getting closer and closer to two possible scenarios for a drastic solution - either close all borders and stop all trade until countries stabilize as they are (and yes stop with the foreign aid) or finally unify all regulations, trades, salaries, etc if the world is to exist as a "global enterprise" - WTF is a chance of that happening?

 

so it sounds like a plan might be eliminate social assistance first, see how many people survive, then move on to eliminate minimum wage...

There are many abuses of welfare, of subsidized housing and other social systems. Note that government workers themselves receive their salary but fail to do their work. Will removing social support actually solve any problems? Often elderly people and single parents depend on those for survival. I would rather approach it from a humanitarian perspective than a political one...

I agree the solution should be humanitarian, rather than cutting everybody off and saying "Good Luck!".

The best start would go into evaluating, truly evaluating the welfare system and food assistance programs. An audit of the overall bureaucracy, then down to individuals.

I'd also put all states as "Right to Work" states, and those who choose to form a union are free to, rather than being forced to pay a union just to work.

Remove public sector/government unions completely, if you look at any of the reasons unions were created in the first place, none exist in government jobs, be it city, county, state, or federal.

Those items alone, while cutting down on corruption, would probably cause riots. Though several studies have shown it's the only way out for states like California, Illinois, Minnesota, and Wisconsin. Pretty soon, all the states will have that as their only option.

Dabbing slightly into politics: Anybody voting must show photo ID and proof of citizenship. Some states require it, some do not, guess which states have the most finger pointing about fraud when an election doesn't go the way some group wants it to? Those same groups are afraid of a National Rule to show ID for some reason.

 

Well I think we've covered the original topic, so yeah, why not go down this road... the plan for the future. So, let's go back to what shortbus said. And I suspect mrChips might chime in too. One of the biggest problems with the economy is not the lower class, welfare abusers, "undocumented workers" (PC bleh), et. al.; these are all big problems, but the bigger problem that gets overlooked in almost all cases is the at the other end of the economic spectrum. BANKS/bankers. Banks generate money and water down the economy, while skimming all the profits off. Increasing numbers of debt slaves; we're all working for the bankers by proxy, including the government. We are owned by them. Even if you don't have a penny of debt, they still control how much the dollars in your wallet can buy. And government spending... it matters not what party is in office, and this goes hand in hand with the banks problem. We are spending ourselves into oblivion; into slavery, on a national level.

 

Well I think we've covered the original topic, so yeah, why not go down this road... the plan for the future. So, let's go back to what shortbus said. And I suspect mrChips might chime in too. One of the biggest problems with the economy is not the lower class, welfare abusers, "undocumented workers" (PC bleh), et. al.; these are all big problems, but the bigger problem that gets overlooked in almost all cases is the at the other end of the economic spectrum. BANKS/bankers. Banks generate money and water down the economy, while skimming all the profits off. Increasing numbers of debt slaves; we're all working for the bankers by proxy, including the government. We are owned by them. Even if you don't have a penny of debt, they still control how much the dollars in your wallet can buy. And government spending... it matters not what party is in office, and this goes hand in hand with the banks problem. We are spending ourselves into oblivion; into slavery, on a national level.

And the .gov won't even audit the Federal Reserve Banks. The same government that brought U.S. firearms to Mexico so they could kill border patrol agents in order to enact more gun legislation somehow doesn't have time to send bean counters around to audit the reserve banks and Fort Knox books.

Why is that?

 

opium is extremely addictive. Along with morphine, codine, hydrocodine, and oxycodine. Even the miricle cure drug sboxin is a opiate. Opium is the poppy plant that secretes a latex rubber. This is opium. It is dried and sold to smoke as is, but most is refined into heroine, a type of morphine. Most people don't know this but almost all painkillers hydrocodine, oxycodine, tylenol 3, etc.... All turn into morphine when your body processes it.

As for the epidemic pill problem our countries undergoing I've found its almost always people that snort the pills, shoot them up, or otherwise don't follow their dr's directions. And I have had a close personal friend die on these things about a year ago. We knew he was talking way to many oxycodine tablets and xanax tablets to the point he could barely talk. We got together with his family and sent him to rehab 5 times, on the 5th time they found him dead within one week with a needle in his arm from shooting up xanax and oxycodine. F'n moron! I still wonder what we could have done for him. We were his friends and didn't know he was shooting them up.

 

And the .gov won't even audit the Federal Reserve Banks. The same government that brought U.S. firearms to Mexico so they could kill border patrol agents in order to enact more gun legislation somehow doesn't have time to send bean counters around to audit the reserve banks and Fort Knox books.

Why is that?

because they're not allowed to. There is no government agency which is allowed access to the FED's books.

 

because they're not allowed to. There is no government agency which is allowed access to the FED's books.

So here we are.

Start over with a .gov backed currency?

You saw the video on debt vs. spending each year I posted, right? Even taking all of the bank's money would barely get us through one more year at the current spending level. At the end of that, we would have no jobs, no savings, and 300 million unemployed people, but 2 deficit free years in a row, that ginormous national debt would never even get touched.

 

So here we are.

Start over with a .gov backed currency?

I'm not sure the FED would just let us do that. How many trillions do we owe the FED? They own the government. How do you think they got into the position where they have a total monopoly on the money supply and nobody to keep them in check? They have bought their way into power, and now they have it. total power. To play with the money system would require us to overthrow the FED. To overthrow the FED would be to overthrow the government.

You saw the video on debt vs. spending each year I posted, right?

No, I didn't can you post a link?

Even taking all of the bank's money would barely get us through one more year at the current spending level. At the end of that, we would have no jobs, no savings, and 300 million unemployed people, but 2 deficit free years in a row, that ginormous national debt would never even get touched.

the whole thing is messed up beyond repair. a drastic action is required, and it is going to make a lot of people uncomfortable. or we could always just sleep through the trasition into dictatorship, that would be easier.