Those Gosh Darn Ancient Aliens

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MrAl

Joined Jun 17, 2014
7,511
I've seen his interviews, he refers to a Q like technology for the Trekkies. A counter argument might the fact that scientists are actually baffled that we've found no evidence of alien life anywhere. Looking out a million years it's difficult to do anything but speculate fantasies. My personal hypothesis is that some millions of years from now our galaxy will teeming with life forms, some advanced, some vegetative, all or most of which originated on Earth. Many civilizations will exist that have no idea where their species began.I've heard you'd be fried by X rays as the ambient radiation changes frequency.
How about fantasy about a parallel universe?
They say they have now found one...
https://whdh.com/news/nasa-uncovers-evidence-of-bizarre-parallel-universe-where-physics-time-operate-in-reverse/
 

402DF855

Joined Feb 9, 2013
194
Perhaps the hardest part of the show to take is the assertion that aliens came to earth and interbred with apes/early man to produce modern humans. How could you seriously believe that any life that evolves elsewhere in the universe would have a genetic coding apparatus that is in any way compatible with ours?

Now the possibility that Earth's life origin involves impact events that brought the most basic of genetic molecules shouldn't be rejected out of hand, but I think it is logical to conclude that all known life on Earth evolved from that life origin some 2 billion years ago without alien intervention in the interim.
 

Thread Starter

MrAl

Joined Jun 17, 2014
7,511
Perhaps the hardest part of the show to take is the assertion that aliens came to earth and interbred with apes/early man to produce modern humans. How could you seriously believe that any life that evolves elsewhere in the universe would have a genetic coding apparatus that is in any way compatible with ours?

Now the possibility that Earth's life origin involves impact events that brought the most basic of genetic molecules shouldn't be rejected out of hand, but I think it is logical to conclude that all known life on Earth evolved from that life origin some 2 billion years ago without alien intervention in the interim.
Yes that is a long shot and that first paragraph is almost the exact words that Carl Sagan used when asked about alien and human interbreeding.

Another idea put forth is that if they are that advanced they might view us as completely insignificant if not boring in the same way we look at ant hills in causal life.
 

Thread Starter

MrAl

Joined Jun 17, 2014
7,511
I guess maybe something like “Benjamin Buttons” he is born old and decrepit then gets younger and younger until he pops out of existence.

kv
Well if we have a time gradient then something at point A could be aging faster than at point B, so we could see a person with baby feet and the head of a 80 year old man :)

But here is something interesting to think about...
We have a pipe bent into a circle filled with a liquid maybe water or better yet hydraulic fluid . There is a pump somewhere in the midsection of the pipe pumping water continuously through the circular pipe.

Now we throw that pipe in a direction toward a black hole and it starts to get pulled in. As it gets closer, time slows down for the portion of pipe closest to the black hole and does not slow down for the portion farther away from the black hole. That would mean that the water flow rate is less within the portion closest to the black hole. So how does the water remain in circulation with a closed system where some of the water is moving faster than other parts of the water yet still going around the circle.
The gravity gradient would also turn the circle into something like an ellipse or oval. But both the forward part and rear part would have the same width the oval being symmetrical, yet time dilation says that time would slow down for the forward part so the distance the water traveled would have to be the same yet with the water going slower in the forward section.
However, the "slower" part is only due to an observation by an outside observer, so really the water and pipe dont see anything wrong with it even though the outside observer does.

So how do we reconcile this possible paradox?
 

402DF855

Joined Feb 9, 2013
194
Another idea put forth is that if they are that advanced they might view us as completely insignificant if not boring in the same way we look at ant hills in causal life.
Two replies to that. First, ant hills get a lot of attention by us at some point. Like when we're kids, or bug scientists. Second, consider if our Martian expeditions located an ant like life. Our scientific community would go insane, right?
So how do we reconcile this possible paradox?
All jokes aside, don't you think that getting that close to the black whole would turn any matter into a quark cloud or something? Googling "spaghettification" apparently maybe not....
 

Thread Starter

MrAl

Joined Jun 17, 2014
7,511
Two replies to that. First, ant hills get a lot of attention by us at some point. Like when we're kids, or bug scientists. Second, consider if our Martian expeditions located an ant like life. Our scientific community would go insane, right?
All jokes aside, don't you think that getting that close to the black whole would turn any matter into a quark cloud or something? Googling "spaghettification" apparently maybe not....
Arguments (discussions) are often preceded by a set of paradigms that are taken to be true regardless what might actually take place in real life.

1st paradigm: "casual life". That means a very brief and casual look similar to how a child might view the situation.
2nd paradigm: A circular pipe that can survive would only have to obey some laws because any laws that force it to be destroyed are no longer in question because the experiment was set up to avoid those difficulties.
 

killivolt

Joined Jan 10, 2010
756
Arguments (discussions) are often preceded by a set of paradigms that are taken to be true regardless what might actually take place in real life.

1st paradigm: "casual life". That means a very brief and casual look similar to how a child might view the situation.
2nd paradigm: A circular pipe that can survive would only have to obey some laws because any laws that force it to be destroyed are no longer in question because the experiment was set up to avoid those difficulties.
We want to say that anything with mass will not escape a black hole but is consumed by it regardless of time expansion or contraction, muons, protons, electrons, bosons, all have enough mass to be fit compacted neatly inside the black hole, we know this because it gains mass as matter is pulled inward to the fixed point, gravity will have it’s day in this Universe.

But, in a thought experiment of another kind which begs the questions, we say that energy exists within mass and we say that the higg boson is not the smallest but rather there are an endless states of matter which go beyond anything we know as matter, an infinite amount so tiny that the black hole can no longer hold them in it’s grasp, and traveling at speeds beyond light as it is forced through the black hole like neutrons travel through things as if they were not there, but we can’t see beyond the idea that nothing could be so small or that they could travel faster than light. Limited by our laws we see now, but maybe not in the future.
 

Thread Starter

MrAl

Joined Jun 17, 2014
7,511
I did not know that. Still don't. :)
Well for example if someone sets up a logical statement starting with:
"Everyone in the town had green shirts..."
Then it makes no sense to argue that:
"Well i would bet that at least one had a yellow shirt"
because the whole idea was to set the stage for the next words to come which require that all the shirts were green in order to make that point.
We know that in real life al the colors might not be green, we know that from the very beginning, but in the theoretical world that's not allowed because we already stated that it was not by stating that all the shirts wee green.
 

402DF855

Joined Feb 9, 2013
194
Would this be an example? If my car could be fueled with paint, which color paint would give the best mileage?

Or back on topic, how about this. Assume for discussion the absurd notion that aliens did in fact visit Earth some 5000 years ago and interacted with the Egyptians, helping with pyramid building etc. What if they departed but due to their relativistic velocity capability, they only left a week ago! Or a month, year. They come back and have real life ancient Egyptians as passengers. (Haven't seen this angle on Ancient Aliens - yet.)
 

Thread Starter

MrAl

Joined Jun 17, 2014
7,511
Would this be an example? If my car could be fueled with paint, which color paint would give the best mileage?

Or back on topic, how about this. Assume for discussion the absurd notion that aliens did in fact visit Earth some 5000 years ago and interacted with the Egyptians, helping with pyramid building etc. What if they departed but due to their relativistic velocity capability, they only left a week ago! Or a month, year. They come back and have real life ancient Egyptians as passengers. (Haven't seen this angle on Ancient Aliens - yet.)

Ha ha, good one! I guess that could be possible. That shows how little we have experienced so far and that is all we know as of yet, so who knows what can happen.

I've been watching a little bit more today and i noticed another funny thing.
On some episodes the narrator says "What if it were really true" in regard to ancient aliens having actually existed or visiting earth right now in the present day. Then later in the show, some of the guests state "and they definitely did this to help the Egyptians and they definitely did this...".
So they jump from a reasonable question to an unprovable conclusion, and the way they say it is if they have cold hard evidence. They come off as crackpots and it is so unecessary.
 

402DF855

Joined Feb 9, 2013
194
"Non sequitur" comes to my mind many times per episode. So the pyramids are aligned like the belt of Orion. Therefore the aliens came from Orion? Really? But at least this show has history and real archaeology unlike Oak Island or Big Foot shows, which were slightly entertaining but ultimately tedious and a waste of my time.
 

Thread Starter

MrAl

Joined Jun 17, 2014
7,511
Oh yeah the word "tedious" is a good one when it comes to Oak Island.
Although i find the mystery of Oak Island very intriguing, God dang, they could show one whole hour long episode in 15 minutes. They find some interesting stuff but geeze dont show it over and over again and talk about it for two hours with no new information.
It starts to make me wonder if much of the stuff isnt made up just to make a show series.
 

402DF855

Joined Feb 9, 2013
194
I agree the premise of Oak Island is intriguing, but after about 3 episodes I determined there's no there there. I do watch Expedition Unknown depending on the topic. Josh Gates is a great self promoter and no doubt a lot of his finds are salted, but still some of the episodes are interesting enough to watch.
 

Thread Starter

MrAl

Joined Jun 17, 2014
7,511
If we are truly the only intelagent life form in the universe, does that mean the universe is ours for the taking?
:rolleyes:
Well we seem to be having a problem 'taking' anything except earth. Everything else is so very hard to conquer.
The moon was a good place to start but they still havent set up base there yet. Mars is so hard to get to that you can never return thus any trip there is one way only, at least for now, and the volunteers know this in advance. I have read that once you leave the earth and mars orbits go out of sync so that if you left mars as soon as you got there it would take longer to get back to earth than if you waited several months to leave. The planets rotate around the sun faster than any of our spacecraft can travel right now so it pays to wait until the orbits sync up again to some degree (earth becomes closer to mars naturally because of the path of their orbits).
 

Berzerker

Joined Jul 29, 2018
607
They keep saying that it's a "chariot of fire" or "pillars of fire" but it always has to do with fire. Sorry if they came from another planet they don't use chemical propulsion anymore.
Brzrkr
 

Thread Starter

MrAl

Joined Jun 17, 2014
7,511
They keep saying that it's a "chariot of fire" or "pillars of fire" but it always has to do with fire. Sorry if they came from another planet they don't use chemical propulsion anymore.
Brzrkr
That's an interesting observation. If the did come, they would probably not show any fire coming out from anywhere. Maybe nuclear.
 
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