The death-trap in Oakland

Thread Starter

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
16,405
http://www.eastbaytimes.com/2016/12...-map-but-fire-spreads-fear-of-code-crackdown/
So Friday’s tragedy has put city officials in a bind: Red-tagging unsafe or unpermitted buildings used by artists will likely reduce an already scarce supply of affordable space. But ignoring code violations puts residents at risk.

In January, Oakland city building inspectors deemed 1919 Market St., a large, two-story warehouse hub in West Oakland unsafe because of illegal construction and ordered the metal and wood workers to leave. In May, residents at Ghost Town Gallery on San Pablo Avenue, a 12-year-old warehouse shared mostly by musicians, were evicted. The landlord claimed the construction done inside by tenants was unsafe, but after doing some minor renovations, the place is advertising for new tenants — at a much loftier price.

An ad on Craigslist last month listed the rent as three times what the Ghost Town Gallery residents paid and boasted of having space for a yoga studio.

“They don’t want you to have affordable rent,” said Damon Gallagher, who was the master tenant at Ghost Town and has since left Oakland. “There was blood dripping out of their mouths, dollar signs in their eyes.”

The 1919 Market evictions had artists who live in warehouses around the city worried that their buildings were next. Now they wonder if that was one reason why no one at Ghost Ship answered the door when city inspectors showed up Nov. 17.

“Who is going to want to call inspectors and risk losing their space?” Dunn wondered.
It's time to start saying NO with a heavy hand to this illegal construction madness.
 

ronv

Joined Nov 12, 2008
3,770
How so?
By a wide margin us rural people are the most capable of going full closed loop self sustainment with the least difficulty. Our money works just fine amongst ourselves and the vast majority of goods we need to survive comfortably come from our own rural regions of every state.

Food, water, electrical production, oil, coal, financial institutions, service industry, transportation. If we don't have to produce products to support millions of city people our lives become so much simpler cheaper and easier to handle.
Farmers do not have to farm anywhere near the acreages they do. Electrical generation systems have far less load to supply, rural water resources that are tapped into to serve cities are freed up, oil and gas production and refining requirements drop way off.

To be honest form a life long lived rural citizen the urban half of our populations kinda a parasite on our collective backs.:rolleyes:

So what exactly do the blue areas have that we can not produce or manage locally ourselves that we cannot live without?
Well, I'm not sure how you define rural, but to me cars and trucks for example are built primarily by the city folks. Gas for those refined in cities. It is why the country went thru the industrial revolution - why other countries strive for it.
Mexico can farm as well as us when they have the equipment, maybe better (remember the climate?) Sure you can go back to 1799 if you want to, I'll stick with what I've got.
upload_2016-12-5_9-39-22.jpeg
 

Kermit2

Joined Feb 5, 2010
4,159
Computer man says, its the end of time, December 31st, 1999
People buyin up on the surplus things
Afraid of what the New Year will bring

I live back in the woods you see
Y2K dont mean a thing to me
Ive got a shotgun, a rifle and a 4-wheel drive

Country boy can survive
Country folks can survive

I can plow a field all day long
I can catch catfish from dusk till dawn

We make our own whiskey and our own smoke too
Aint too many things these old boys cant do
We grow good old tomatoes and our homemade wine

Country boy can survive
Country folks can survive

'Cause ya cant starve us out and ya cant make us run
Well survive the new millennium
We say grace and we say maam
If ya aint into that we dont give a damn

We came from the West Virginia coalmines
And the Rocky Mountains and the western skies
If the bank machines crash well be just fine

'Cause a country boy can survive
Country boy can survive

I had a good friend in New York City
Never called me 'Bocephus' called me 'Hillbilly'

Well he was killed by a man with a switchblade knife
For 43 dollars my friend lost his life
Now this dudes gonna get out in a year or two
'Cause the system dont work for me and you

But a country boy can survive
Country folks can survive

'Cause ya cant starve us out and ya cant make us run
Well survive the new millennium
We say grace and we say maam
If ya aint into that we dont give a damn

Were from North Carolina and south Alabam
And little towns all around this land
If the bank machines crash well be just fine
And a country boy can survive

Country folks can survive
Country boy can survive
Country folks can survive
Any year, any time
 

tcmtech

Joined Nov 4, 2013
2,867
Well, I'm not sure how you define rural, but to me cars and trucks for example are built primarily by the city folks. Gas for those refined in cities. It is why the country went thru the industrial revolution - why other countries strive for it.
Mexico can farm as well as us when they have the equipment, maybe better (remember the climate?) Sure you can go back to 1799 if you want to, I'll stick with what I've got.
Where I come from we have every bit of the modern conveniences any city person has only far more room and less cost to do it with. Running water, flushing toilets, lectic' light flipswitch thingies on the walls, the works! Heck, even the old hound dog chews on one O' them manufactured bone thingies too! :D

The only reason some oil refineries are in cities if because the city grew up around them. Out here they are outside the defined city limits and even a that our cities barely brake the 100K population level.

And yea, I know the vast majority of city born and raised people think what you have in your picture is the standard of living outside the city. Its not. Most of us live better than the average city person when it comes to general life conveniences and all around ownership of stuff.

In city person terms the guy who owns the $100K vehicle as a daily driver is seen as well off. In our rural way of life the average nobody has one or more buildings the size of a small apartment complex full of machines that cost $100K or multiple times over that each! ;)

So yea, we really don't put much faith in the accuracy of how the big city person sees us. :rolleyes:
 

joeyd999

Joined Jun 6, 2011
6,390
Where I come from we have every bit of the modern conveniences any city person has only far more room and less cost to do it with. Running water, flushing toilets, lectic' light flipswitch thingies on the walls, the works! Heck, even the old hound dog chews on one O' them manufactured bone thingies too! :D

The only reason some oil refineries are in cities if because the city grew up around them. Out here they are outside the defined city limits and even a that our cities barely brake the 100K population level.

And yea, I know the vast majority of city born and raised people think what you have in your picture is the standard of living outside the city. Its not. Most of us live better than the average city person when it comes to general life conveniences and all around ownership of stuff.

In city person terms the guy who owns the $100K vehicle as a daily driver is seen as well off. In our rural way of life the average nobody has one or more buildings the size of a small apartment complex full of machines that cost $100K or multiple times over that each! ;)

So yea, we really don't put much faith in the accuracy of how the big city person sees us. :rolleyes:
And there's nothing uglier than a muddy city street in the middle of winter.
 

joeyd999

Joined Jun 6, 2011
6,390
Said the kettle to the frying pan...
You just can't help but be wrong, can you? Even I am not as ugly as a muddy city street in the middle of winter.

Which brings up a funny story:

Years ago, I took my wife to Chicago around January, I think. I, being from Florida, don't have a winter wardrobe to speak of, so, before we left we went shopping. I bought myself a really nice white suade coat. I think I paid around $100 for it, and this was when $100 was a lot of money for me.

The first day, we visited some of her friends who lived on a residential block, and it happened to snow (just a bit, maybe 1/4 inch) while we were there. My wife had never seen snow before, so I took her outside for the experience.

We were walking down the street (in the street -- there was no traffic), and my wife thought it'd be funny to kick some snow on me.

$100 bucks down the drain.
 

jpanhalt

Joined Jan 18, 2008
11,087
Really? Isn't that the kind of thing repubs are usually fond of doing? You know, the whole, "less regulations" thing?
First, read about the history of Oakland. It is one of corruption from its founding. Mayors of both parties have been involved. However, in the last 30+ years they have been Democrats. More on point, if you bother to read about the background for that disaster, there have been numerous citations and complaints about the sub-standard conditions, legitimate code violations, and illegal aliens crammed into uninhabitable quarters, and so forth. All of that blind-eye enforcement of existing safety codes was provided by Democrat administrations. Were they paid off? Follow the money.

Try updating with facts before replying.

John
 
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GopherT

Joined Nov 23, 2012
8,009
Why didn't the current crop of politicos reverse such a egregious error?
Because they would have to raise taxes. No citizens reelect a tax raising administration.
Unfortunately, citizens look only at cash and not the big picture, asking themselves questions like, "Why should my tax dollars pay for code inforcement if I don't want code enforcement officers on my doorstep?"

The pendulum keeps swinging. An event like this will cause every community to re-assess their priorities.
 

Thread Starter

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
16,405
Yes, the previous Republican administration cut enforcement funding so the current inspector had to prioritize. Check the facts.
The building inspector was at the property last month before the fire so it was a priority. The people inside were hiding according to reports and didn't answer so he couldn't go inside to actually inspect the fire trap. That's when buildings are RED TAGGED for a safety hazard in most cities if the property has a long history of violations like this one did. This is not about enforcement funding, this is about actually doing your job to reduce the possibility of a mass casualty event because you walk away. I know these types of fire are thankfully rare but this was not a random event of unforeseen circumstances.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/04/us/oakland-fire-codes.html

Oakland officials fielded multiple complaints about warehouse before deadly fire
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-oakland-inspections-fire-20161205-story.html
“I think we have to take responsibility and certainly our staff members that had that task were not as responsive or assertive as necessary,” said Oakland City Councilman Noel Gallo on Monday.

He and others said that the city had been aware of safety and fire hazards at the warehouse for more than two years. Neighbors and former residents have told The Times that they had contacted the city about trash and debris piled up outside the warehouse as well as their concerns about unsafe conditions there.
...
Responding to multiple complaints from neighboring businesses and residents, a city building inspector went to the warehouse on Nov. 17 to investigate but could not get access inside the building, Gallo and city officials said.


Victims of the Oakland warehouse fire: Who they were

“The only question that is still outstanding for me, the administration has to tell us, well, what happened to the code inspector? Why did he just knock on the door and not pursue?” Gallo said Monday. “This thing has been going on for 2 1/2 years.”

Police were repeatedly called to thewarehouse to address complaints, according to one former resident. Those reports could not be confirmed to The Times on Sunday by Oakland police.
 

GopherT

Joined Nov 23, 2012
8,009
The building inspector was at the property last month before the fire so it was a priority
these jobs used to be done by Fire Marshalls or P.E.s and now they are done by someone promoted from the pothole repair crew. Did he knock and walk away or did he fill out his month of reports on the 29th of November with a long list of excuses why he didn't clear his docket that month and assures he'll have something to do next month to quell any talk of further staff reductions in the department and he can feed himself for another month.
 

killivolt

Joined Jan 10, 2010
836
The streets are already filled with so many homeless, an artist community would have been a big deal in the news. So, many laws so many rules how dare you.

Unfortunately they allowed themselves to be inducted by their Artist Leader.

http://www.mercurynews.com/2016/12/04/oakland-warehouse-fire-who-is-the-man-behind-the-ghost-ship/

OAKLAND — Five months before Friday’s raging fire killed at least 33 people at the “Ghost Ship” warehouse, the architect of the cluttered artists’ cooperative took to Facebook in a 1,000-word rant claiming he was “the thriller love child of Manson, Pol Pot and Hitler.
kv
 

joeyd999

Joined Jun 6, 2011
6,390
these jobs used to be done by Fire Marshalls or P.E.s and now they are done by someone promoted from the pothole repair crew. Did he knock and walk away or did he fill out his month of reports on the 29th of November with a long list of excuses why he didn't clear his docket that month and assures he'll have something to do next month to quell any talk of further staff reductions in the department and he can feed himself for another month.
If that's the case, the inspector can be sure of 3 squares a day and a cot for the rest of his life.
 

Thread Starter

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
16,405
these jobs used to be done by Fire Marshalls or P.E.s and now they are done by someone promoted from the pothole repair crew. Did he knock and walk away or did he fill out his month of reports on the 29th of November with a long list of excuses why he didn't clear his docket that month and assures he'll have something to do next month to quell any talk of further staff reductions in the department and he can feed himself for another month.
Lame excuses for a gundeck.
 

Thread Starter

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
16,405
I'm just saying that communities get what they pay for. Whether under trained/unqualified cops or lazy/spineless code inspectors.
You keep saying it's pay but I see little evidence of that as the root cause. I do see plenty of evidence that people have been allowed get away with such gross violations that it boggled the minds of even the uninformed visitors and tenants of the warehouse. These inspections have plenty of advance notice to the owners, managers and occupants before they happen so everyone knows the rules in advance.
 
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