# Magnetic field produced by moving charges

#### Alchemy One

Joined Oct 5, 2019
217
It has been observed that if you place two wires parallel to each other and connect t

Last edited:

#### crutschow

Joined Mar 14, 2008
31,116
In a wire the electron negative electric field is canceled by the wire atoms' proton positive electric field, so there is no significant electric field between the two wires, leaving the magnetic field to dominate.

#### Alchemy One

Joined Oct 5, 2019
217
In a wire the electron negative electric field is canceled by the wire atoms' proton positive electric field, so there is no significant electric field between the two wires, leaving the magnetic field to dominate.
Right, but my question is about two point charges.

Last edited:

#### Ya’akov

Joined Jan 27, 2019
6,856
Two-point charges, say two electrons moving next to each other in the same direction, should they repel or attract according to magnetic field explanation?
When considering forces it is necessary to consider all the forces in the system you are concerned with.

First, the electron magnetic moment causes electrons to behave like a tiny dipole magnet, so if they were free to move, they would attract, since they would orient themselves to do that. But, there are many other forces involved in your example. Just considering two electrons in isolation doesn't isolate them from the influence of everything around them.

I'd imagine electron magnetic moment is what you would be interested in to answer the answerable part of your question.

#### nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
10,679
Are you having a change of position in regard to your previous reply?
What position? The neutrality of the wire at the conductor free electron frame of reference?

#### shortbus

Joined Sep 30, 2009
9,760
Lets see here . He comes in(10 -5 -19) not understanding single phase power, and now he's going to start in on the physics of electricity? This should be good for many posts.

#### killivolt

Joined Jan 10, 2010
834
Lets see here . He comes in(10 -5 -19) not understanding single phase power, and now he's going to start in on the physics of electricity? This should be good for many posts.
Maybe it's all about #post count? I only read like 4 post's then I realized

Distinctly similar to others that have posted before on the Forum.

kv

#### Alchemy One

Joined Oct 5, 2019
217
What position? The neutrality of the wire at the conductor free electron frame of reference?
Oops sorry, I thought the video was from Crutchlow.

Last edited:

#### Ya’akov

Joined Jan 27, 2019
6,856
No insult or ill will intended but I am forced to use the ignore feature here.

This is terribly unproductive and it's unpleasant to see friends here trolled like this, so, I'm out.

#### nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
10,679
Oops sorry, I thought the video was from Crutchlow.
Somehow the order of my answer got jammed. I used my cell phone to answer and my click must have been off.
In the video, the presence of protons and using Einstein's relativity to explain the cause of attraction/repulsion. But that is not the real meat of my inquiry. That is one way of describing the behavior of two wires. Except there is a deeper anomoly that I see in my mind's eye.
Since I am here; it is pertinent that we consider the second part of my inquiry, i.e. two of our little point charge electrons in isolation.
Rightfully we should consider two frames of reference, surely both static and moving frames.

Let's consider the lab/our frame of reference. Would the electrons be drawn to each other moving in parallel and otherwise repel moving in opposite direction.
Do you see an anomaly, a certain contradiction if you will in the behavior of the electrons in the above statement?
Furthermore, we consider that it is the electron's magnetic moments, which is resultant of what is termed as their spin and that is related to magnetism and not to their charges if you will.
Aha, one must ask then, what are the exact behavior of the two critters or more like what should their behavior be when they are in each of the above two frames so that our formulas make sense. Are we forcing them to align themselves in certain way as to make sense for us and at the same time it makes in their frame of reference?
In other words, say attraction in our frame of reference ( to give us field we need) and repel in their frame of reference so that makes sense all at the same time). One more way of asking is this. Two stationary electrons repel each other ( due to electric field) what should the behavior of the moving electrons be given the above two directions? If there is no attraction we shall have no magnetic moments. Now we are getting somewhere. Electrons must exhibit both attraction and repulsion........... well how about it?

The thing is it is the beloved electrons that give us what we want, electric charge, magnetic charge and forces and EM waves and photons. These critters are responsible for all our molecules, compounds. They are everything to us.
After all, as far as know it is the electrons that are doing all the work in our world. Without those critters, we will be hurting I would think.
Humanity collectively owe an apology to electrons for not wiping out the entire notion of conventional current pseudoscience. When the truth is stomped on we invent the word convention. Oh, yea we have conventions everywhere alright and we know it and we pay for it.
You have the answer in the most rigorous scientific theory (SR/GR) ever tested. You are welcome to have your own opinions, not your own facts.

#### Alchemy One

Joined Oct 5, 2019
217
You have the answer in the most rigorous scientific theory (SR/GR) ever tested. You are welcome to have your own opinions, not your own facts.
I don't have facts, I have questions. Big difference.

Last edited:

#### nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
10,679
I don't have facts, I have questions. Big difference.
When you say I am entitled to my opinion. That is an acceptable meaningful statement.
When you say " not your own facts", that has no meaning. You have to reference that to an actual thing I have said that I claimed to be a fact.
The other fellow that you put on your stamp of approval show the same rhetoric.
"This is terribly unproductive and it's unpleasant to see friends here trolled like this, so, I'm out." That is in reference to what exactly I have said. My statements are nothing but inquiries.
Please stop this pretense. "Something is very wrong here. Here I go again" doesn't sound like a question. It's a 'bait' drop.

#### Alchemy One

Joined Oct 5, 2019
217
When considering forces it is necessary to consider all the forces in the system you are concerned with.

First, the electron magnetic moment causes electrons to behave like a tiny dipole magnet,

Last edited: