It's a bit premature to whip up a circuit diagram, because I don't know if your vehicle currently has single or dual lambda sensors.

I have 1 O2 sensor before the CAT and 1 after the CAT. The one after the cat has a O2 Sensor fake circuit on it. So I don't have to worry about the one after the CAT.

http://www.zzperformance.com/grand_prix/products1.php?id=834&catid=107

This is a link to the O2 emulator.

 

OK, see the attached.

I may have the inverting and noninverting inputs to the comparator swapped, I'm getting tired already.

A 78L05 regulator, not shown, could be used to supply the 5v for the circuit. Proper input and output caps would be necessary.

The signal generator represents an arbitrary input voltage from the wideband O2 sensor. The comparator toggles output states when it's reference threshold voltage (set by pot R2) is crossed. D1 keeps the output voltage from rising above about 0.9v when the comparator's output is off. When the comparator's output is on, it pulls the output below the ECU's threshold range.

The target comparator is an LM2903, which is a dual comparator designed for use in automotive temperature ranges. Right now, the simulator shows it working with a 339 quad comparator, but that is not the right heat range.

R1 would have to be increased to 1.3k for use with a LM2903; current sunk by the output would need to be < 4mA to be reasonably certain the output would fall below the ECU's trigger point of 450mV. A 1N4148 diode will have a Vf of around 650mV at 2mA, so traversal above the 450mV threshold is assured. Experimentation with actual components would be necessary to verify operation through the entire temperature range.

 

cat3rn - I have attached a very simple efie which people are using and it is being sold on ebay for about $40 - all it is is a pot and and a resistor, the ZFF eifie uses transformers which I have not seen in any other designs - I don't how good the design is. I would recomend you monitor your engine temperature for a while before fitting a unit - just to play safe.
Here is a reference for a temp. gauge
http://www.bus-boys.com/bbvdo.htm#temphead

Keep up with the experiments - I know first hand my friend gets between 15 to 20% improvment on his explorer - in fact he was so impressed when his job went south he became a distributor and is running a successful business.
Unfortunately the scientific community can be very narrow minded - and geniuses like Tesla, Meyer etc. are given a hard time.
People have saying it is not possible to produce more hydrogen than defined by Faraday's equations - well that is no longer the case.

Here are a couple of links one contain the efie
http://www.scribd.com/doc/2465199/Water4Gas-Instruction-Manual-How-to-save-Fuel-2-books-

http://www.panaceauniversity.org/Ravi Cell.pdf

I have included some literature by Bob Boyce - he is very knowledgable on cell design

Good Luck - and please share your results!!

 

Just so you know cat3rn...I don't know what year vehicle you are working with, but I have personally tried that EFIE circuit you posted in the very beginning. The problem with the circuit is that it not only adds a voltage to the lower end of your O2 signal, but it also adds the amount of adjustment you selected on top of the O2 signal. (i.e. adjusted with .350v top reading will be 1.350v) Most ECU's will pick up on that higher voltage and totally disregard the O2 signals and go into a fixed stradegy. Just thought you might want to know....not worth the effort.(IMHO)

Also, the circuit provided above in the thumbnail picture is obviously not an EFIE. That circuit will modify the MAP sensor signal but not the O2 sensor signal. In the Boyce file he provided there is a circuit for a rather complex PWM version, but again, no EFIE. The models provided by SgtWookie and RonH on the thread Dual Lambda Signal Modifer, both work. I had better luck with the design from RonH. The only thing it did was not allow the O2 sensor signal back to the ECU to ever go below the voltage I set, and never go above !.0V, no matter how much offset I applied. As a result, my fuel trims DID decrease and the engine ran leaner. Just watch your CHT so you don't run too lean and burn something up. The hydroxy addition should keep your engine running at about the same if not slightly lower temperature, as it did mine. Good Luck

 

Just so you know cat3rn...I don't know what year vehicle you are working with, but I have personally tried that EFIE circuit you posted in the very beginning. The problem with the circuit is that it not only adds a voltage to the lower end of your O2 signal, but it also adds the amount of adjustment you selected on top of the O2 signal. (i.e. adjusted with .350v top reading will be 1.350v) Most ECU's will pick up on that higher voltage and totally disregard the O2 signals and go into a fixed stradegy. Just thought you might want to know....not worth the effort.(IMHO)

Yea I have seen those all over the place and have pretty much decided to never go with something that simple as I know vehicle electronics cannot and are not that easy.

The models provided by SgtWookie and RonH on the thread Dual Lambda Signal Modifer, both work. I had better luck with the design from RonH. The only thing it did was not allow the O2 sensor signal back to the ECU to ever go below the voltage I set, and never go above !.0V, no matter how much offset I applied. As a result, my fuel trims DID decrease and the engine ran leaner. Just watch your CHT so you don't run too lean and burn something up. The hydroxy addition should keep your engine running at about the same if not slightly lower temperature, as it did mine. Good Luck

I have setup my vehicle with a lot of mods for speed. I currently have no KR (Knock Resistance) and my temp gauge inside the vehicle never goes above 130. I plan on adding a CHT gauge soon anyway.

 

Just keep in mind that the BEST way is to monitor the Exhaust Gas Temperature as I do on my 2005 Ranger. That way you get an almost-instant live reading instead of a reading that first has to travel through the head to the sensor. Mine have saved me from going too lean several times. I average @25 mpg w/ my Ranger as opposed to @20mpg without mods and HHO. What year vehicle are you working with?

 

OK, see the attached.

I may have the inverting and noninverting inputs to the comparator swapped, I'm getting tired already.

When you are more awake could you check that out.

A 78L05 regulator, not shown, could be used to supply the 5v for the circuit. Proper input and output caps would be necessary.

Could you show me how that would be wired in.

The target comparator is an LM2903, which is a dual comparator designed for use in automotive temperature ranges. Right now, the simulator shows it working with a 339 quad comparator, but that is not the right heat range.

I thought it was an LM 2904

R1 would have to be increased to 1.3k for use with a LM2903;

If its really an LM2904 what would R1 be then?

A 1N4148 diode will have a Vf of around 650mV at 2mA, so traversal above the 450mV threshold is assured.

Where would this be wired in the circuit?

Sorry for the rapid fire. I am getting anxious to purchase the needed parts to start building the circuit and testing it out. My cell is now ready to fire up.

 

Here is a copy of the O2 modifier circuit from RonH and a waveform of what the output is going to look like going to your ECU.(With the exception of the frequency, of course) I tried it on my Ranger and it worked great. I had to build two though, as my truck is a V6. Hope this helps, although SgtWookie is correct in that WideBand sensors really are the way to go. But you should be able to get some results from your narrow band sensor as I have.(Depending on model year, that is)
Hope this helps your cause.....

 

When you are more awake could you check that out.

For you, it doesn't matter. You can reprogram your EFIE for a positive or negative coeficient on the fly.

Could you show me how that would be wired in.

7805 regulators, datasheets, etc, are available all over the Internet. A quick search for "7805 datasheet" on Google should get you about a billion hits.

I thought it was an LM 2904

An LM2904 is an opamp. An LM2903 is a comparator. While related, they're different animals.

If its really an LM2904 what would R1 be then?

An LM2904 would not be the correct IC to use in this particular case.

Where would this be wired in the circuit?

It's shown in the schematic that I posted.

Sorry for the rapid fire. I am getting anxious to purchase the needed parts to start building the circuit and testing it out. My cell is now ready to fire up.

We're kind of used to that sort of thing around here.

 

Just keep in mind that the BEST way is to monitor the Exhaust Gas Temperature as I do on my 2005 Ranger. That way you get an almost-instant live reading instead of a reading that first has to travel through the head to the sensor. Mine have saved me from going too lean several times. I average @25 mpg w/ my Ranger as opposed to @20mpg without mods and HHO. What year vehicle are you working with?

I have a 1997 Pontiac Grand Prix GTP. Supercharged, headers free flow exhaust with Dual Flowmaster Super 44, Cool Air intake mounted in the front lower fender etc......

 

Sounds like a pretty nice ride! Again though, I would caution you against modifying your O2 signals until you have a reliable and fast way to monitor your EGT's. If you modify your system to run too lean, by the time your regular temperature sensor picks up on it, it will already be WAY TOO LATE and the probablilty of severe engine damage will be great. If a CHT sensor is the way you are going, it will help, but will still not give you the fastest indication that something is wrong. Only monitoring EGT's will do that for you. Hope this helps.

P.S.
And please do yourself the favor and do not modify your O2 sensors until you have monitored your STOCK EGT's during a variety of drive-cycles, so you know what is a good temp, and what is not.

 

Sounds like a pretty nice ride! Again though, I would caution you against modifying your O2 signals until you have a reliable and fast way to monitor your EGT's. If you modify your system to run too lean, by the time your regular temperature sensor picks up on it, it will already be WAY TOO LATE and the probablilty of severe engine damage will be great. If a CHT sensor is the way you are going, it will help, but will still not give you the fastest indication that something is wrong. Only monitoring EGT's will do that for you. Hope this helps.

P.S.
And please do yourself the favor and do not modify your O2 sensors until you have monitored your STOCK EGT's during a variety of drive-cycles, so you know what is a good temp, and what is not.

What would be the best way to monitor the EGT? Like an Oil pressure gauge with a readout?

I will do plenty of different drive cycles and keep a log then post it. I will do it after the HOH is installed and post a log then also.

Just for everyones information. A lot of people say HHO but the correct way is HOH as HHO is 2 Hyd molecules and 1 oxygen which would just be water. HOH is just the proper chemical way to signify Hydrogen gas and oxygen gas together.

I found this I think it will work just fine.
http://www.hoppyshopper.com/p/l20ph8/

 

The link for the EGT sensor set-up should work just fine for you. Just remember to have one for each bank as one in common with both banks won't give you the protection you need.

 

The link for the EGT sensor set-up should work just fine for you. Just remember to have one for each bank as one in common with both banks won't give you the protection you need.

I am not familiar with the term "banks".
What are they?

 

Cylinder banks. A V6 engine has two banks of three cylinders; V8, two banks of four.

In GM vehicles, the bank that has cylinder #1 is bank #1, the other is bank #2.

Jaguar decided to do things differently. When they came out with the V12 engine, they were called the "A" and "B" banks, and cylinders were labeled A1 through A6, and B1 through B6. Makes hunting for sparkplug wires a bit of a chore.

 

Cylinder banks. A V6 engine has two banks of three cylinders; V8, two banks of four.

Got it so you are saying that I should put a pickup on the front crossover for the front 3 cyl and another near the collector on the other 3 cyl before it goes into the single pipe to the rest of the exhaust? I have pacesetter headers that go into a collector near the rear 3 cyl then to a straight pipe into then split again into a set of Flowmaster Super 44's. I am going to poss do dual pies in the future each into a single Flowmaster 44.

 

YouTube of my cell in action

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppUnerJGvrY

 

The placement of the EGT sensors should be as close to where each group of three cylinders converge into their common point as possible. That way the sensors will pick up a good average of each group of cylinders on each bank.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cj_FNpdeHUI

My new HOH torch in action

 

Ok I now own the LC-1 by Innovate Motorsports. It comes with the WB O2 sensor and the controller as well as software to keep stats and change settings. Now that I have this, can someone help me build an EFIE that will work with my setup?

What I mean by EIFE is either (like Sgt Wookie stated) just switch between the two channels using a relay or semiconductor analog switch, such as a CMOS 4066 (Maxim/Dallas has much better analog switches)

or (poss and)

build a comparator circuit with a pot to adjust the threshold. Something like a pair of LM3914 dot-bar LED drivers would be beneficial to view what your threshold setting is and the actual output from the wideband O2 sensor. (also suggested by Sgt Wookie) This would be used on the wire that does not emulate the output of a narrowband O2 sensor.

The holidays were great and I have not been on for a while so I am not quite sure where we left off.