How to connect a relay coil in parallel with other components without it shorting?

R!f@@

Joined Apr 2, 2009
10,007
IS he missing the part power out is less than power in.
TS did say higher winding ratio and voltage multipliers. Which requires high power input than a measly coin cell.
 

SirFlickka

Joined Jul 6, 2024
6
""Is there a way to connect the relay coil in parallel with everything else without short?""

Maybe this could be abstract way by observation
As Idk if all these are proper terms I used
-
I'd say I think the opposite happened to me when in a container
1 a opened 10v DeWalt battery
2 capacitor terminals were crossed by my metal caliper,
when I accidentally seen that,
3 "one side of a test probe" touch the caliper
or contact with the short(or is it open) battery circuit ...
Yet my observation was the led turned on...
When it did-- I kind of jumped back...
Because only one side needed to touch + probe terminal
4 turned the led on
Not needing to even be connected to ground side of led

Didn't think I would be able to think of a useful way to even say this .
Hope some unique possibilities happen

Other notes
As im nearing proficiency in circuit testing and component recognition
..
Building a diy oscilloscope
And having to replace a missing "regulator
With either zenner diodes, transistor, or even some form of divergent rectified resistors
Where I'm only limited by access yet it's funny Im missing a single component.
78L05
 

Tonyr1084

Joined Sep 24, 2015
9,744
Wattage. In a nutshell, it's all about the wattage. Power out never equals power in. Well, that's not true. Energy can not be created nor can it be destroyed. It can only be converted. Even in a short circuit, a battery may be capable of producing 10 amps. A 12 volt battery at 12 volts and 10 amps produces 120 watts. But in that dead short, just a simple wire, 10 amps is not what's going to flow through that wire. The wire has some resistance. The battery also has an internal resistance. That resistance, in particular the wire resistance will convert some of the energy to heat. Yes, the wire will get hot. Some of the energy is lost as heat. So you're not going to get out as much as you put in. It may be close, but never equal. And for absolute certain, never "More" out than in.

A coin cell may be capable of X amount of watts. Therefore you can not design a circuit that outputs X + 0.1. At best it's going to be X - 0.1 (as an example in mathematical terms). In short, there's going to be less out than in. It took me a while to learn that a diode will drop some voltage before it begins to conduct. Same holds true for transistors. ALL components have a payoff that must be taken into account. Therefore under the best of circumstances you can get close to but never equal output to input.
 

MisterBill2

Joined Jan 23, 2018
27,976
""Is there a way to connect the relay coil in parallel with everything else without short?""

Maybe this could be abstract way by observation
As Idk if all these are proper terms I used
-
I'd say I think the opposite happened to me when in a container
1 a opened 10v DeWalt battery
2 capacitor terminals were crossed by my metal caliper,
when I accidentally seen that,
3 "one side of a test probe" touch the caliper
or contact with the short(or is it open) battery circuit ...
Yet my observation was the led turned on...
When it did-- I kind of jumped back...
Because only one side needed to touch + probe terminal
4 turned the led on
Not needing to even be connected to ground side of led

Didn't think I would be able to think of a useful way to even say this .
Hope some unique possibilities happen

Other notes
As im nearing proficiency in circuit testing and component recognition
..
Building a diy oscilloscope
And having to replace a missing "regulator
With either zenner diodes, transistor, or even some form of divergent rectified resistors
Where I'm only limited by access yet it's funny Im missing a single component.
78L05
If the tool crossed a capacitor and there was a spark then somehow energy was stored in the capacitor. And the fact that a disturbance triggered an LED to light, or maybe just flash, does not reveal a new discovery. The fact that you did not observe the other connection does not prove it was not made.
 

SirFlickka

Joined Jul 6, 2024
6
If the tool crossed a capacitor and there was a spark then somehow energy was stored in the capacitor. And the fact that a disturbance triggered an LED to light, or maybe just flash, does not reveal a new discovery. The fact that you did not observe the other connection does not prove it was not made.
The battery's were charged but how only one side of led needed to light the led when the say active load was by connection of a meta caliper that had black marks on it..
But this brings up another point...
My truck battery had somehow allowed positive terminal to "POW" blow sparks from connecting to my truck body and while I was driving in traffic so being able to "thank the lord" drop the clutch and jump it back off while the battery was melded to my body or fender and as I had a frisnd riding with me he wasal to jump out de weld the battery and idk how it even started like that or if anyone else has had such illogical connectiins to be observed in action.
 

SirFlickka

Joined Jul 6, 2024
6
The battery's were charged but how only one side of led needed to light the led when the say active load was by connection of a meta caliper that had black marks on it..
But this brings up another point...
My truck battery had somehow allowed positive terminal to "POW" blow sparks from connecting to my truck body and while I was driving in traffic so being able to "thank the lord" drop the clutch and jump it back off while the battery was melded to my body or fender and as I had a frisnd riding with me he wasal to jump out de weld the battery and idk how it even started like that or if anyone else has had such illogical connectiins to be observed in action.
If the tool crossed a capacitor and there was a spark then somehow energy was stored in the capacitor. And the fact that a disturbance triggered an LED to light, or maybe just flash, does not reveal a new discovery. The fact that you did not observe the other connection does not prove it was not made.
O the negative to led was not connected to anything I'll find the two in a few minutes And givea image I'm not speaking to make believe anything
 

SirFlickka

Joined Jul 6, 2024
6
Wattage. In a nutshell, it's all about the wattage. Power out never equals power in. Well, that's not true. Energy can not be created nor can it be destroyed. It can only be converted. Even in a short circuit, a battery may be capable of producing 10 amps. A 12 volt battery at 12 volts and 10 amps produces 120 watts. But in that dead short, just a simple wire, 10 amps is not what's going to flow through that wire. The wire has some resistance. The battery also has an internal resistance. That resistance, in particular the wire resistance will convert some of the energy to heat. Yes, the wire will get hot. Some of the energy is lost as heat. So you're not going to get out as much as you put in. It may be close, but never equal. And for absolute certain, never "More" out than in.

A coin cell may be capable of X amount of watts. Therefore you can not design a circuit that outputs X + 0.1. At best it's going to be X - 0.1 (as an example in mathematical terms). In short, there's going to be less out than in. It took me a while to learn that a diode will drop some voltage before it begins to conduct. Same holds true for transistors. ALL components have a payoff that must be taken into account. Therefore under the best of circumstances you can get close to but never equal output to input.
Yet I know how to redesign the set up it just had happened at a odd time and understanding I'm not going to blow my house up with12v anything possibly blow my self up at +120v yet I think i have touched the power line once as it blew up on me and to say all hair felt like it was steamed not only straightened out, but went parablind from the arc white whjte burst my friend says ooo man hes dead.. i took a sec to respond as "no.. not deax... Only blind..." Fixing the breaker to one room in garage. But knowing that wires get extremely burnt and melt the cords I have become inclined to better learn each component and have Arduinos and a half built oscilloscope where one function generator is complete I just recently say found a geekvape of 100w and put my solder iron on it at 10w to see it work well as when i googled it said 8-13v or close by so I mean i have a good inclination on digital and analog components just known that by better designed circuits, or more efficient elements in energy transmittance and actually updating bioses to qubit logic gates would produce better OS registries yet were still in the 19th century only two more years before we make it to effectively proficient object orientation in logic for microcontrollers.
 

MisterBill2

Joined Jan 23, 2018
27,976
The battery's were charged but how only one side of led needed to light the led when the say active load was by connection of a meta caliper that had black marks on it..
But this brings up another point...
My truck battery had somehow allowed positive terminal to "POW" blow sparks from connecting to my truck body and while I was driving in traffic so being able to "thank the lord" drop the clutch and jump it back off while the battery was melded to my body or fender and as I had a frisnd riding with me he wasal to jump out de weld the battery and idk how it even started like that or if anyone else has had such illogical connectiins to be observed in action.
What I can tell you is an absolute MUST is that batteries and cables MUST be well anchored. ALL the time. And now you have seen the WHY. And now you know it is instant, not slow.
 

SirFlickka

Joined Jul 6, 2024
6
What I can tell you is an absolute MUST is that batteries and cables MUST be well anchored. ALL the time. And now you have seen the WHY. And now you know it is instant, not slow.
Well they were deeply anchored but how why or in what way could the truck not only crank up but stay running with both terminals connected to the body it would seem the car running would be by active live ground fault to not heat as bad as it would if the car was off, just trying to comprehend, illogical revelations that have happened to me first hand
 

MisterBill2

Joined Jan 23, 2018
27,976
Since crank and run require power, it seems that at some point the connection between the points that were welded had opened. A vehicle body usually has unanticipated circuit interruptions. S.F. was fortunate, it could also have been "Divine Intervention", which is often in violation of the laws of physics as we see them. Just because we do not understand how something happened does not mean it did not happen.
 

MisterBill2

Joined Jan 23, 2018
27,976
And now back to the original discussion about a square wave signal generator that must be very small:
"I want the batteries to be as compact as possible, and two AAs would be quite bulky. Is there no way to use coin cells / could you please explain why not?"
But since then it has been mentioned that it might be used for a number of other very much "Not Small" projects, including the FAKE Tesla coil.
Certainly a square wave generator can be built that will be useful, but not so very tiny. THAT device was for some other purpose not disclosed. Actually, a square wave generator can be built, powered by 2 or 3 coin cells, and using a surface mount dual "D"/R/S ff like the CD4013. But it will not be powerful.
 
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