I am conceptually designing an outer-rotor, gearless magnetic hub-drive wheel for a surface rover on Venus. To avoid the Curie temperature limitations of permanent magnets at 460°C (733 K), the system relies purely on an AC induction motor topology. The primary coils (stator) are locked to a stationary center axle, while the secondary loops drive the external wheel rim across a sealed air gap. Given that the Venusian atmosphere is highly dense (~ 67 kg/m³) and composed primarily of supercritical CO₂, managing internal I²R coil heat dissipation is a massive engineering barrier. To address this, my current 3D CAD iteration incorporates a specialized geometry

Cyan for bearings and structural support

Gold for electromagnetic induction or space for electromagnets

Blue for the heat management and prevention of dust

Redish pink for tire

 

Is the title a rhetorical question or a real one?

 

Is the title a rhetorical question or a real one?

Yes it is a real question and I am currently researching about this and I really want to know whether my project is right or wrong. Please help me in this regard.

Thank you.

 

So you joined an electronics forum to ask about thermal shielding of mechanical systems on Venus????

Is this some kind of school project?

 

Is this what modern 3D mechanical design tools look like these days?

It looks like a 3D version of MS Paint from the 1990s.

I'll stick with my 2001 version of Solid Works.

 

Given the "Go Premium" icon prominently displayed, my guess is that it's a free, possibly online, app. Plus, the "Join Content" makes me wonder if this isn't some kind of design competition such as NASA has done in the past.

 

What sort of question about thermal shielding?? Shielding must reflect the thermal radiation waavelengths. That is the most effective method. The alternative is to alter the wavelength and radiate the energy. I am not sure how to do that.
Really, this looks like a less expensive graphics program, or something emulating that sort of program.
If it is actually a real project with an actual request for engineering level assistance then the posting party needs to message more than one of us to verify that it is real.
That has been done previously so I know it is possible.
If the individual is a student then use the method that students can use to contact me.
If the individual is seeking engineering level expertise, understand that I am not a thermodynamics master.

One terribly unfortunate reality is that heat can only be conducted to a point of lower temperature by conduction. Radiation to a cooler location may be possible.
If the individual is totally serious my very best advice is to use materials for rolling bearings that will be sized to not bind from thermal expansion. THAT is the important starting point! That could include roller bearings with clearance adjustsd to be correct at the high temperature involved.
Depending on the required wear-life time, and the load, graphite bearings, or a graphite/teflon mix might work.

 

It's completely unclear what they are trying to do. They say manage the internal I²R heat dissipation, which implies trying to carry that heat somewhere else. But where? The surrounding environment is at over 460°C, which is about 130°C higher than the melting point of lead.

 

What sort of question about thermal shielding?? Shielding must reflect the thermal radiation waavelengths. That is the most effective method. The alternative is to alter the wavelength and radiate the energy. I am not sure how to do that.
Really, this looks like a less expensive graphics program, or something emulating that sort of program.
If it is actually a real project with an actual request for engineering level assistance then the posting party needs to message more than one of us to verify that it is real.
That has been done previously so I know it is possible.
If the individual is a student then use the method that students can use to contact me.
If the individual is seeking engineering level expertise, understand that I am not a thermodynamics master.

One terribly unfortunate reality is that heat can only be conducted to a point of lower temperature by conduction. Radiation to a cooler location may be possible.
If the individual is totally serious my very best advice is to use materials for rolling bearings that will be sized to not bind from thermal expansion. THAT is the important starting point! That could include roller bearings with clearance adjustsd to be correct at the high temperature involved.
Depending on the required wear-life time, and the load, graphite bearings, or a graphite/teflon mix might work.

Thank you for this reply. I am truly sorry for the misunderstanding from my heart. I am truly trying to design this into real life so that one day rovers can be launched in venus. IN this reply i want to say that I am really a student is am really new in this field and I am really looking for an engineering level help to get my project perfect. I AM TOTALY NEW IN THIS FEILD AND NEED HELP

 

OK, thatexplanation is reasonable. First, consider that heat transfer requires a difference in temperatures, and so what ever temperature is outside will be the temperature inside eventually.
Thereally GOOD NEWS is that high temperature bearings are already in use in some very hot applications!!!
Consider the rolling process in a steel mill, where a glowing-hot chunk of steel is rolled back and forth to squeeze it into sheet metal. (You can view videos of this process in-line)
THAT is much hotter than Venus and at a much greater load, and those bearings do not fail very often.
AND, I am aware of ceramic bearings available for high temperature applications in food processing ovens.
My point here is that high temperature bearings are already available, so that certainly will not be the big challenge
of exploring the hotter planets. The biggest issue that I see is the battery power part of the systems.

 

OK, thatexplanation is reasonable. First, consider that heat transfer requires a difference in temperatures, and so what ever temperature is outside will be the temperature inside eventually.
Thereally GOOD NEWS is that high temperature bearings are already in use in some very hot applications!!!
Consider the rolling process in a steel mill, where a glowing-hot chunk of steel is rolled back and forth to squeeze it into sheet metal. (You can view videos of this process in-line)
THAT is much hotter than Venus and at a much greater load, and those bearings do not fail very often.
AND, I am aware of ceramic bearings available for high temperature applications in food processing ovens.
My point here is that high temperature bearings are already available, so that certainly will not be the big challenge
of exploring the hotter planets. The biggest issue that I see is the battery power part of the systems.

Thank you very much!! Sir! I would like to further do researchs on it and with your help, I would be very greatful to complete this project with you

 

I once read a book about the Soviet Venera missions, the only man-made objects ever to touch and function on the Venusian surface.
The surface not only has an extreme pressure and temperature, but it is also very corrosive. If I recall correctly, the 'window" that the camera peered outside had to be made of synthetic diamond.
Eventually the Soviet scientists realized that anything they could land there would have a very short lifetime in such an environment. And planned the mission accordingly.

 

I once read a book about the Soviet Venera missions, the only man-made objects ever to touch and function on the Venusian surface.
The surface not only has an extreme pressure and temperature, but it is also very corrosive. If I recall correctly, the 'window" that the camera peered outside had to be made of synthetic diamond.
Eventually the Soviet scientists realized that anything they could land there would have a very short lifetime in such an environment. And planned the mission accordingly.

If the atmosphere on Venus is indeed both hot and corrosive, then it seems that the very smartest choice will be to wait until it cools to a less hostile temperature, and the atmosphere becomes less hostile, before visiting. YES, I understand that may never happen.
SO, what would be the motivation to visit that might make it worth the effort?? I se no RATIONAL reason.?????

 

If the atmosphere on Venus is indeed both hot and corrosive, then it seems that the very smartest choice will be to wait until it cools to a less hostile temperature, and the atmosphere becomes less hostile, before visiting. YES, I understand that may never happen.
SO, what would be the motivation to visit that might make it worth the effort?? I se no RATIONAL reason.?????

Well sir after my two day research what i understood is that we have to do it in step wise that is we have to make a probe first and then rover. Probe will be our lab rat here. From my research we can make a probe with an alloy of titanium, platinum and palladium which would make the hull fully resistance to chemical attacks and atmospheric pressure. Inside the hull we would make a chamber made of the same alloy but it would be hollow inside it we have to make its temperature higher than the venus planet's surface temperature and then use a coolant like specialized high pressure helium gas which would start from the circuits and then frame so that it stays cooled and use something like Stirling cry cooler which mechanically compress and pump heat out of the circuit zone and will also dump the heat into the box which would dissipate naturally

 

I once read a book about the Soviet Venera missions, the only man-made objects ever to touch and function on the Venusian surface.
The surface not only has an extreme pressure and temperature, but it is also very corrosive. If I recall correctly, the 'window" that the camera peered outside had to be made of synthetic diamond.
Eventually the Soviet scientists realized that anything they could land there would have a very short lifetime in such an environment. And planned the mission accordingly.

Thank you sir for giving this valueable peice of information.

Well sir after my two day research what i understood is that we have to do it in step wise that is we have to make a probe first and then rover. Probe will be our lab rat here. From my research we can make a probe with an alloy of titanium, platinum and palladium which would make the hull fully resistance to chemical attacks and atmospheric pressure. Inside the hull we would make a chamber made of the same alloy but it would be hollow inside it we have to make its temperature higher than the venus planet's surface temperature and then use a coolant like specialized high pressure helium gas which would start from the circuits and then frame so that it stays cooled and use something like Stirling cry cooler which mechanically compress and pump heat out of the circuit zone and will also dump the heat into the box which would dissipate naturally

 

From all my experience I don't think this "project" is feasible at all.

But if you want to do it "step wise", start with some "rover" (or "submarine") able to survive in a bath of molten tin (230+ °C). Then you can proceed to a bath of molten lead (330+ °C).

Or you get access to a simulation tool like COMSOL (or some other multiphysics simulation package) to get an assessment for the cooling power required. It's no only the power dissipation of your circuitry etc. you have to get rid of but also the massive thermal inflow from the environment. Not to be forgotten: your cooling equipment also creates heat you have to get rid of.
(You may have to invest at least 1 kW to get rid of 4 kW of thermal energy. Where would the energy for the cooling equipment come from?)

 

Cthis point I have seen no description of any onsidering that the Venus atmosphere is both toxic to humans and also rather corrosive to many metals, what is the claimed value (benefit) of even visiting Venus with a probe of any sort???
To this point I have seen no benefit at all. So an explanation should be provided. And the explanation should not be like the one for climbing a mountain!!