Anyone invested in bit coins?

justtrying

Joined Mar 9, 2011
439
Seriously I have a rich grandfather hiding in a water well for a couple of years bcz immigration is after him, now, would you mind pls to give a cash advance on this it's urgent I need to rescue him?
seriously, bitcoin only, i have billions if i could only find my password to my wallet :D
 

takao21203

Joined Apr 28, 2012
3,702
News item I heard the other day. Apparently Bank of Japan is accepting bitcoin.
If youd ask Ahmadinejad about this for sure he wouldnt be short of a clever and sly answer.

Whats strikes out as suspicious to me is to long lamentation in the linked news article.

Ive identified it as propaganda. For instance it talks about micropayments. But same like other digital currencies or real world money electronic transfers, the infrastructure, electric energy and servicing staff are not free. So claiming tiny micropayments would become possible (at zero cost) is nothing but propaganda.

Or its like an attempt to implement communism (only a postulate never existed so far). Instead of centralized banks, everybody shares their resources to society (i.e. computing power). In real world communism humanity had to be controlled and some were more egible, to own the people owned franchises "more". And they ended up with tremendous bureaucracies, efficiency going towards zero.

The idea as such is interesting but its only a postulate, Marx didnt invent it. He postulated some day humanity would share available resources in social kind of way without payments. Then some controlism freaks did revolutions and installed policies.

Nobody owns it is almost the same as everyone owns it. Who is "everyone" might be subject to proove it. And nobody, well, there has always been population groups who prefer not to be seen. They are "nobody".
 

takao21203

Joined Apr 28, 2012
3,702
Communism went like that,

"we" (the representatives of the people) choose and decide how to do things. The people own everything but some have a better ability to decide what and how to do.

While in free market capitalism, its a race and survival of the fittest, and more than never, the better products, companies and service providers survive more. The others are forced to improve. Running a commercial business often is a battle.

So infact with technology, the capitalist world was miles ahead of the bureaucrat and policy bound socialists. At the end of the 1980s, it collapsed from within and at many places.

The only surviving instance that developed further from that, and still exists as an anomaly, is the DPRK.

I guess the least thing they are waiting for is Bitcoin.

In socialism you simply werent allowed to put a product on the market as you wanted to. Theres examples from eastern Europe where several home computers were designed and built and some tried to mass produce them. Its quite interesting. It actually looks like the capitalist world did win by means of SEGA and a little later, the internet. People wanted it and broadly adopted these new technologies. Well look at the creepy 1970s the advantage is not as much.

Study all this first before you write an article like the one about Bitcoin. Theres no such thing as free infrastructure. Or free natural real world resources. We do live in real world not in the matrix. Everything we need and use is tied to real world needs.
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
16,389
When hordes of people flood into Bitcoin as a get rich quick scheme the more likely it will implode. People that invested toy amounts of cash years ago and used Bitcoin for transactions now have the potential to make millions if they cash out. I don't see those types of people staying all in Bitcoin if its just fodder for speculation purposes for day traders that don't use the currency to buy trinkets.
 

justtrying

Joined Mar 9, 2011
439
When hordes of people flood into Bitcoin as a get rich quick scheme the more likely it will implode. People that invested toy amounts of cash years ago and used Bitcoin for transactions now have the potential to make millions if they cash out. I don't see those types of people staying all in Bitcoin if its just fodder for speculation purposes for day traders that don't use the currency to buy trinkets.
I always felt that if it was never traded on the market, then it would have been truly a new way of exchanging goods and services, untied from any current monetary system... This way it is basically perpetuating existing issues.
 

Thread Starter

spinnaker

Joined Oct 29, 2009
7,830
https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-energy-consumption

With the rise in price the energy required for cryptocurrency "mining" is also going parabolic.

I never understood the concept of mining with encryption algorithms. I think it shows that this whole bitcoin thing is a big game. How is it possible that mined coins have any value at all? What is it used for other than fake currency? But I guess it makes as much sense as diamonds used for jewelry having value. I have never understood that one either. :confused:
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
16,389
I never understood the concept of mining with encryption algorithms. I think it shows that this whole bitcoin thing is a big game. How is it possible that mined coins have any value at all? What is it used for other than fake currency? But I guess it makes as much sense as diamonds used for jewelry having value. I have never understood that one either. :confused:
The value is in the bigger fool with 'real money to pay for the results of the encryption as a unique digital token for value so it may rise to very high values before crashing down again. The current parabolic curve of bitcoin 'value' is a interesting game of chicken, eventually the people worth loads of real cash because of Bitcoins obtained at really low values will begin to convert Bitcoin value into fiat wealth. The current transaction system is currently very slow and expensive due to the dollar value of Bitcoin , the number of buyers and the much smaller number of sellers to the point were Bitcoin no longer can be used for regular transactions like money and is only a store of value today.

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/12/06/nicehash_diced_up_by_hackers_thousands_of_bitcoin_pilfered/
While NiceHash did not put a number or dollar account on the lost cryptocurrency, estimates are that the loss stands to be around $60m. NiceHash says it will relaunch itself with improved security "at the earliest opportunity."
 

Thread Starter

spinnaker

Joined Oct 29, 2009
7,830
The value is in the bigger fool with 'real money to pay for the results of the encryption as a unique digital token for value so it may rise to very high values before crashing down again. T
That is my whole point. What fool pay for that? Brings a new twist to the old question. If you were stranded on a desert island, would you rather have a billion bitcoins or a book of waterproof matches?
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
16,389
That is my whole point. What fool pay for that? Brings a new twist to the old question. If you were stranded on a desert island, would you rather have a billion bitcoins or a book of waterproof matches?
Some people outside the USA are stuck with poor internal currencies. For them an external store of value, even one as risky as Bitcoin is a good bet. For the lucky guys at the bottom of the pyramid it's a great ride up.

It's moving up so fast the chart change per day will be FTL before the end of next year.
http://www.newsbtc.com/2017/12/07/bitcoin-price-goes-absolutely-parabolic/
 
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Thread Starter

spinnaker

Joined Oct 29, 2009
7,830
Some people outside the USA are stuck with poor internal currencies. For them an external store of value, even one as risky as Bitcoin is a good bet. For the lucky guys at the bottom of the pyramid it's a great ride up.

It's moving up so fast the chart change per day will be FTL before the end of next year.
http://www.newsbtc.com/2017/12/07/bitcoin-price-goes-absolutely-parabolic/

Only problem is they need to be able to collect their money when they need it. Wonder what it will be worth when they go to cash in?
 

wayneh

Joined Sep 9, 2010
18,130
My guess is an imminent collapse. Apple and others are commercializing alternatives that have many of the same advantages but few of the risks. Bitcoins will be an historical oddity once the big boys move in. Bitcoins are carbon hogs and not sustainable.
 

tcmtech

Joined Nov 4, 2013
2,867
My concern is that Bitcoin is going to end up being little more than a huge long running pump and dump scam being played a larger than normal scale. From day one when I learned of it it has just felt that way in the back of my mind. The total available bitcoins number is just too small to become a national let alone world standard currency simply due to the amount of fractionalization it would take to equate to common cash currency.

It just doesn't sit well on the human psychological perceptions scale to go to a store and buy a loaf of bread for .00000001 bitcoins opposed to the familiar and easy to work with $2 value, if the world's gross currency value was all converted over to a proportional Bitcoin face value. Now had they set the finite number at say a million bitcoins per living human based on say 10 billion people (10 Quadrillion) that would give a nice easy and psychologically friendly number system to work with that would convert fairly well to any other currency in present use. Making 100K bitcoins a year for your $50K a year job just feels better psychologically than making .0001 or less.

As envious of what it could have earned me right now, had I taken certain advice and opportunity (~$2 million and rising as of today for a less than $200 investment) and to what level of good I could have done with it, had I taken a few easily financially affordable risks a number of years ago I do wish I had just to have seen what it would be like to be worth a million or two on paper at least once in my life.

Oh well, maybe my 8+ million shares of not totally dead sub-penny stocks will take off someday and solve that curiosity problem.:p:rolleyes:
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
16,389
https://www.technologyreview.com/s/...ckchain-has-been-built-to-outperform-bitcoin/
Now, here’s where things get really interesting. Instead of a blockchain, IOTA uses a “tangle,” which is based on a mathematical concept called a directed acyclic graph. Sønstebø says his team pursued an alternative approach after deciding that blockchains are too costly—it has recently cost as much as $20 per Bitcoin transaction because of high demand—and inefficient to operate at the scale required for the Internet of things.
https://hackernoon.com/why-i-find-iota-deeply-alarming-934f1908194b
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
16,389
http://time.com/5065622/utah-bitcoin-drug-ring-bust/
(SALT LAKE CITY) — U.S. attorneys in Utah prosecuting a multimillion-dollar opioid drug-ring are moving quickly to sell seized bitcoin that’s exploded in value to about $8.5 million since the alleged ringleader’s arrest a year ago.

The U.S. Attorney’s Office for Utah cites the digital currency’s volatility in court documents pressing for the sale. The bitcoin cache was worth less than $500,000 when Aaron Shamo was arrested on drug charges, but the value of the digital currency has skyrocketed since then.
 
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