Built this circuit from a gifted SSR. 12-18v on DC side, 120v on AC side. I want to turn a bulb on and off with two 9v batteries. The 18v turns the SSR to ON just fine. But when the SSR is OFF the bulb blinks like there is some current leaking. Do I need to ground the metal plate on the back of the SSR? A test wire from the ground didn't seem to indicate that it made any difference. The circuit is plugged into a 3-prong outlet and tests good with an outlet tester. The blinking is kinda cool, but not what I want.

Do I have a bad SSR?

Is the SSR not comparable with an LED bulb (or CFL as a similar thing happens.)

Thank you.

 

hi,
Is the Control pin of the SSR 'floating' when the 18v is not connected.?

 

What is happening is the small (normal) leakage current flowing through the SSR slowly charges up a capacitor in the LED bulb, when the cap gets up to the minimum starting voltage for the driver chip inside, it tries to start, then dies out because the leakage is too low to continuously power it.

The solution is to place a high value resistor across the lamp, it will shunt away the leakage, preventing the flashing.

Try a 100K 1/2 watt as a starting point, if it still flashes, add more of the same in parallel.

 

hi,
Is the Control pin of the SSR 'floating' when the 18v is not connected.?

Not sure what you mean but it happens whether ore not I have the two 9v batteries connected.

 

What is happening is the small (normal) leakage current flowing through the SSR slowly charges up a capacitor in the LED bulb, when the cap gets up to the minimum starting voltage for the driver chip inside, it tries to start, then dies out because the leakage is too low to continuously power it.

The solution is to place a high value resistor across the lamp, it will shunt away the leakage, preventing the flashing.

Try a 100K 1/2 watt as a starting point, if it still flashes, add more of the same in parallel.

I think this is it. I used a different SSR on a different project and I don't recall it doing this. Is this what is called a "pull down" resister? Can I wire it across the AC terminals of the SSR?

 

The solution is to place a high value resistor across the lamp, it will shunt away the leakage, preventing the flashing.

Try a 100K 1/2 watt as a starting point, if it still flashes, add more of the same in parallel.

Across the LAMP, not SSR.

 

Across the LAMP, not SSR.

Here are some pictures of my project. Please don't laugh. Doing the best I can. Not sure where to put the 100K resistor.

BTW, yes, the cover plate has been taken off. It would go back on to be used.

Thanks.

 

Here is a link to a movie lighting effect I did with an earlier project. Trying to make another box. Don't know where I stored the previous one used in this video. Please excuse the camera's rolling shutter problems which makes the flashes seem to bounce up and down. A fault of the camera.

 

It looks like you are switching the neutral side (white wire). Shouldn't you be switching the high side (black wire)? Not that it should matter.

Ron

 

It looks like you are switching the neutral side (white wire). Shouldn't you be switching the high side (black wire)? Not that it should matter.

Ron

I am switching on the black wire. Maybe I'm missing some standard in the crude schematic.

Or if you mean the picture, the black wire out of the cord goes into a wire nut which connects it with the hot side of the SSR and the hot side of the switch on the outlet. So the switch can bypass the SSR. In the past was told that was okay. The switch is to turn on anything plugged in, usually lighting to set position and take light meter measurements, etc.

Then the neutral of the SSR goes into a wire nut connecting the neutral side of the bypass switch and the outlet hot side. I have by-hand colored some of these wires striped black and white. Because it's a neutral coming out of the SSR and bypass switch, but a hot going into the outlet. Well, it helped me keep track of stuff.

Then the white wire from the cord goes into a wire nut connecting the neutral side of the outlet.

And the ground goes into a wire nut connecting to the ground of the outlet. That's why there are 4 wire nuts packed in their. Probably not standard but seems to work in my deranged mind. (should see some of the things I shoot. Actually, mostly comedy, some sci-fi.)

Hope that clears things up. Still not sure where to connect the before mentioned 100K resistor. Is that like a snubber, I see mentioned?

I don't want to pull the wires out to prove the connections as it took considerable work to stuff them all inside the box.

 

I guess if I had used enough length of wire out of the cord I could have ran the white wire directly into the outlet, saving one wire nut there.

And the green directly into the outlet as well, saving another wire nut. But I wasn't sure if the SSR should be grounded so I used a wire nut to leave that option open.

The wires are packed in fairly tight. Using wire nuts everywhere seemed to simplify things for me. But I'm nutty anyway.

 

Still, where do I put the 100K resistor? And the blinking might not be a problem for incandescent or quartz lighting that might be used instead of the CFL or LED bulbs.

One reason for doing this is like in a movie scene where a character has to reach under the shade of a table lamp and turn it ON. If the actor fumbles with the switch then that's a bad take and has to be redone. So if a lighting person is off screen, and uses something like this to turn the lamp on for them when their hand goes under the shade then the motion is smooth and doesn't draw attention. You want to minimize those things that can ruin a take, especially if there is other action in the scene. That's where the bypass switch is useful. Or by touching the DC control wires together intermittently you can make the light flicker before "burning out." BZZT, BZZT before burning out, or staying on. OR in using only the control wires you can use a 1000w light outside a window to look like lightning. The SSR should protect the high watt light, right?

 

Wondering if I can put a 100K resistor on a toggle switch so it's only used when needed. Not much room in the box for that. Not many Radio Shacks around here anymore. If I'm not mistaken the switch and it's wires need to handle only 120v / 100K or about a milli-amp. So even 30 gauge wire will work? Maybe?

 

I just read things in more detail. My bad on this. The problem is the LED draws very little current. The SSR has a leakage current. I believe Sensacell has it as I have experienced this personally. The SSR has enough leakage. If you were to remove the LED bulb and just put a standard say 60 watt 120 volt incandescent lamp in there I bet the SSR will work just fine. If you place a resistor across the load, increasing it as was suggested I bet it will work. I wasn't catching the LED part, I read right through it.

Ron

 

I just read things in more detail. My bad on this. The problem is the LED draws very little current. The SSR has a leakage current. I believe Sensacell has it as I have experienced this personally. The SSR has enough leakage. If you were to remove the LED bulb and just put a standard say 60 watt 120 volt incandescent lamp in there I bet the SSR will work just fine. If you place a resistor across the load, increasing it as was suggested I bet it will work. I wasn't catching the LED part, I read right through it.

Ron

Thanks. No problem. I misread things all the time. I'm now thinking that rather than add another switch to the innards of the box, to maybe make a special short cord which has the resistor in it's wiring. Sort of the way they make audio cables with attenuation built in inside of them.

Or wait. Maybe put a 1 to 3 splitter on the outlet and plug in something that shunts some of the current. (like the incandescent bulb you mention, but whatever it is it can't make any light or sound.) So what small current using load might I put on there. Might a very dim night light do? Or a plug only thing which has the 100K resistor wired into it? Need to experiment now.

Thanks.

 

Years ago I got bit by something like this. We had a temperature controller fail on a huge walk in oven. The only controller I had laying around was a SSR output type. I used it on a temporary basis but it was driving a few large SSRs. The large SSR control load was not enough to overcome the normal leakage of the little SSR in my controller. As a get over I just placed a resistor across the output as was suggested. I needed a load of over 100 mA so I think I just temporary shoved a 1 K high wattage resistor in the mix and it worked. Worked till we got a new controller in. Initially I couldn't figure out why my heaters were staying on then the light in my head finally came on. The bummer was I needed a high wattage resistor.

Ron

 

Plugging in a night light in parallel with the bulb worked. It all seems so simple now.

There used to be simple night lights which were not light sensing or motion sensing. Just ON when you plugged them in. I seem to recall ones with little neon (maybe tungsten) bulbs in them. I don't see them anywhere now. So need some low power thing which produces neither light nor sound to add to the kit.

Thanks. Marking the question solved.

 

Not just nightlights where LEDs (240-V AC type) are a pain.
Any live-only supply to timers, dimmers etc. that require a leakage current to operate struggle with LED lamps.
I have a Lightwave RF dimmer with the manufacturer specified dimmable GU10 LED connected, flickers like and old switch start fluorescent tube.
Add another load like a halogen or even CFL, and it works fine. Slightly defeats the object of having low energy lamps.
Just another product rushed out to catch the market. If it was a straightforward LV DC LED, wouldn't be a problem

 

So need some low power thing which produces neither light nor sound to add to the kit.

Thanks. Marking the question solved.
View attachment 135926

That 'thing' would be the humble resistor.

 

Thanks. No problem. I misread things all the time. I'm now thinking that rather than add another switch to the innards of the box, to maybe make a special short cord which has the resistor in it's wiring. Sort of the way they make audio cables with attenuation built in inside of them.

Or wait. Maybe put a 1 to 3 splitter on the outlet and plug in something that shunts some of the current. (like the incandescent bulb you mention, but whatever it is it can't make any light or sound.) So what small current using load might I put on there. Might a very dim night light do? Or a plug only thing which has the 100K resistor wired into it? Need to experiment now.

Thanks.

How's a splitter on the outlet going to work?
It's the current through the SSR that counts.