wiring small vintage sew machine motor

MaxHeadRoom

Joined Jul 18, 2013
28,702
If the squares in series with 5 are the fields then it appears to run it full power if AC is applied to 4 and 5.
As a normal Universal motor.
Max.
 

MaxHeadRoom

Joined Jul 18, 2013
28,702
If you just want to run it full power, identify the two lines that go direct through the fields in series with the armature and apply power to each.
Ignore or disconnect the variable speed unit.
Max.
 

Thread Starter

Jpols

Joined Apr 16, 2018
31
Okay, success! Using the Blue & Grey wires (nos. 4&6) I got the motor to work!! Without the foot rheostat in line, it spins ridiculously fast. Thanks guys! My problem now is that the motor runs clockwise, and I need it to run counter-clockwise. Can you advise me on how to reverse the direction?
 

Thread Starter

Jpols

Joined Apr 16, 2018
31
You need to change the polarity of the field windings WRT the armature.
Max.
Thanks Max:) figured had to change polarity somehow, but as indicated I know enough about electricity to be dangerous :) so you need to literally draw me a picture how to do this with AC:))
 

Thread Starter

Jpols

Joined Apr 16, 2018
31
Thanks Max:) figured had to change polarity somehow, but as indicated I know enough about electricity to be dangerous :) so you need to literally draw me a picture how to do this with AC:))
The motor normally would have run cow, not sure what happened. What is WRT? Did the suppressor or capacitor that was across the brushes have anything to do with direction? The motor runs without the suppressor in place but clockwise. The only thing I did different was remove that suppressor.
 

MisterBill2

Joined Jan 23, 2018
18,599
It would probably be simpler to swap the connections to the two brushes. Field winding connections are often quite fragile, and breaking one could end the game, as it were.
 

MaxHeadRoom

Joined Jul 18, 2013
28,702
The motor normally would have run cow, not sure what happened. What is WRT? Did the suppressor or capacitor that was across the brushes have anything to do with direction? The motor runs without the suppressor in place but clockwise. The only thing I did different was remove that suppressor.
WRT, 'With Respect to'.
The suppression cap does not have any influence on the ability to run.
This is the typical Universal motor so it may be easier just to swap the brush leads as suggested.
Max.

upload_2018-4-19_22-32-20.png
 

Thread Starter

Jpols

Joined Apr 16, 2018
31
WRT, 'With Respect to'.
The suppression cap does not have any influence on the ability to run.
This is the typical Universal motor so it may be easier just to swap the brush leads as suggested.
Max.

View attachment 150870
Thanks Max. This morning I switched wires to the brushes. Still runs clockwise! When it came out of the machine, it was running CCW, (it has to for the machine to operate properly). Also discovered that the motor runs using the black (#6) and blue (#4) wires. It actually seems to run smoother for some reason. Anyways, not sure what to try next. So close, yet so far:)
 

Thread Starter

Jpols

Joined Apr 16, 2018
31
WRT, 'With Respect to'.
The suppression cap does not have any influence on the ability to run.
This is the typical Universal motor so it may be easier just to swap the brush leads as suggested.
Max.

View attachment 150870
You need to change the polarity of the field windings WRT the armature.
Max.
How do I go about changing the polarity of the field windings? Am assuming the brush contacts would remain the same then? The grey wire enters one of the fields, and the black & blue both enter the other field.
 

MaxHeadRoom

Joined Jul 18, 2013
28,702
As they are in series I am not sure why it did not work with the armature?
But the easiest way is when the two field are connected one after the other, not as the pic I showed where they where either side of the brushes.
When they are separate you need to swap or reverse the connections each in turn.
It should be fairly easy to trace which applies in your case.
Incidentally it is advisable to run it with some kind of load as these motors operate in a runaway condition and can easily reach 20krpm or higher.
Max.
 

Thread Starter

Jpols

Joined Apr 16, 2018
31
As they are in series I am
It's not clear to me what connections I swap or at what location I do it in the motor. Is it possible to give me an example? ie. Take the blue wire at location X,cut it, take the purple wire at location y, cut it. Take wire from x and connect to y, then take wire that was at y and connect to x . Sorry to be so dense, but I am learning a lot and do appreciate the guidance:))
 

MaxHeadRoom

Joined Jul 18, 2013
28,702
If you can draw out Exactly what you have and the disposition of the fields with respect to the armature, i.e. if the fields are connected to each other rather than each side of the armature as in post #30.
You should end up with either field-armature-field or field-field-armature.
I still don't understand why it did not reverse when you swapped the brush leads?
Max.
 

Thread Starter

Jpols

Joined Apr 16, 2018
31
If you can draw out Exactly what you have and the disposition of the fields with respect to the armature, i.e. if the fields are connected to each other rather than each side of the armature as in post #30.
You should end up with either field-armature-field or field-field-armature.
I still don't understand why it did not reverse when you swapped the brush leads?
Max.
I too am baffled why the brush connection swap didn't work?? I will take the motor apart again so I have a better look at the windings.
 

Thread Starter

Jpols

Joined Apr 16, 2018
31
Okay the attached sketch is what I believe I am looking at. Fields are joined together at one end, Grey to one field, then a field wire comes out same end to brush. Other field, black & Blue enter, then at opposite end of field, a wire comes out to the other brush.IMG_3930.jpg
 

Thread Starter

Jpols

Joined Apr 16, 2018
31
The mystery is, Why was it running CCW properly when connected to circuit board and not now? Would the Red wire (that looked like a ground to the motor frame but was connected to the circuit board at pin 2) have a role to play?
 

MaxHeadRoom

Joined Jul 18, 2013
28,702
The frame ground should Not in any normal circumstances have any thing to do with the running operation.
That appears to be a very strange non-standard motor connection.
Max.
 

Thread Starter

Jpols

Joined Apr 16, 2018
31
The frame ground should Not in any normal circumstances have any thing to do with the running operation.
That appears to be a very strange non-standard motor connection.
Max.
Did you see my sketch of the connections to the windings and brushes?
While exploring online I came across this note to somebody trying the same thing. Can you make any sense of it? :
"The brushes in a universal motor are tied to the same lines as the stators, so the rotor switches polarity the same as the stator poles. To reverse it you must 'CUT' the two lines to the stator/rotor and put a double pole double throw switch in.
You want to cross the connections to the rotor brushes, but not the lines to the stator. Hook the cut lines from the stator to the two end poles of the switch and put the rotor/brush wires the center poles of the switch. attach two jumpers to the other end of the switch and 'cross' them and attach to the first end."
 
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