Is there pictures there for you to look at?It's not that hard to work out mate, Motor!!

Yes of course, you said something about a motor, but you see a whole lot of motors are actually wireless in the sense that you are probably looking for, see BLDC motors for instance.

I was asking you to tell us why you want to use such scheme of delivering power to the actual motor. I vaguely understand that you want to use one coil to transfer power to another coil which will ultimately power some motor, but I cannot see why. What is better about that than all the other induction motor principles? Why should your approach be better than all the others?

No offence, but so far what you seem to propose seems way more lossy than anything that Mr. Michael Faraday invented back in the 1830s.
That is close to two hundred years ago, so my advice is to study the old and contemporary designs thoroughly and then maybe try to propose something new and better.

 

Yes of course, you said something about a motor, but you see a whole lot of motors are actually wireless in the sense that you are probably looking for, see BLDC motors for instance.

I was asking you to tell us why you want to use such scheme of delivering power to the actual motor. I vaguely understand that you want to use one coil to transfer power to another coil which will ultimately power some motor, but I cannot see why. What is better about that than all the other induction motor principles? Why should your approach be better than all the others?

No offence, but so far what you seem to propose seems way more lossy than anything that Mr. Michael Faraday invented back in the 1830s.
That is close to two hundred years ago, so my advice is to study the old and contemporary designs thoroughly and then maybe try to propose something new and better.

Lol, no offence taken Kubeek, I wasn't sure if the pics were actually there so you could see.and as I said I'm not the best at making circuits. That's why I'm here to get advice on this project of mine. That's why to you it looks like a cave man made it. Again! No offence taken mate. All good. SO what my idea was to basically have a BLDC with no magnets but with more powerful electromagnets instead, so I was using the power transmission to power the rotor electromagnet to get away from brushes, so powered up electromagnets on rotor & stator with only the bearings as friction.i hope that helps you understand my idea a little more clearer. So a BLDC in runner but using electromagnets!
I DO appreciate your time and help.

 

so at the moment,h-bridge to make the stator electromagnet bi-polar, wireless transmission to get power to the rotor, rectified to have a constant magnet on the rotor. so as you can see for this first prototype it only has one electromagnet on the stator & a single pole rotor. i intend to make it multiple when i get the circuit working better. the motor runs fine,but i know it cane be better.

 

A motor with no permanent magnets or brushes and just electromagnets already exists. And has since around 1838.
It's called the switched reluctance motor.

 

Thanks Shortbus,
Yes that's very close to what I have. But I'm making the rotor a electromagnet too. Don't you think that would make it more powerful or able to reach higher rpm faster due to the opposing magnets? Just like a brushless dc but electromagnet rotor in place of the magnets.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induction_motor a coil on the inside, a coil on the outside and yet no connection to the rotor, so much for reinventing the wheel.

 

Thanks Shortbus,
Just like a brushless dc but electromagnet rotor in place of the magnets.

So basically an induction motor?
Max.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induction_motor a coil on the inside, a coil on the outside and yet no connection to the rotor, so much for reinventing the wheel.

Yes but the rotor coils aren't powered in a induction motor. The coils are inducted! I'm sending power to the rotor first to power the coils to make stronger attraction to the stator coils.
Unlike a induction motor. So my new wheel IS turning differently.

 

So basically an induction motor?
Max.

Max, on a induction motor.Aren't the coils on the rotor inducted by the stator to drag it around?
If so that's different to the effect I have here. As I'm directly powering both stator and rotor.

 

I was really hoping that someone could help me improve on the circuit I have. As I know it could have components of wrong values or missing. I'm sure by now everyone should understand the easy princables here. So help looking at the circuit above for help would be VERY appreciated

 

Yes but the rotor coils aren't powered in a induction motor. The coils are inducted! I'm sending power to the rotor first to power the coils to make stronger attraction to the stator coils.
Unlike a induction motor. So my new wheel IS turning differently.

Where do you see the difference between the current in the rotor being induced directly from the stator coil, compared to the current in the rotor coming indirectly from a separate set of coils? You still need to create AC to feed the transmitting coil, and then possibly rectify it in case of a DC stator. I just don´t see the improvement here.

In case of an induction AC motor the current in the rotor is proportional to the load. In what you propose, the current in the rotor would be derived separately, which turns it into a kind of separately excited motor. Yes the load characteristic would be different and would depend on what you feed into the rotor, but I still think that the losses in the transmission of the energy into the rotor would completely dwarf any losses that you might get from brushed or a squirrel cage motor. And this is what I think are your results so far, the motor being quite inefficient.

Unless you have some very specific reason why you want to do it this way, I dont see justification in the effort and complexity of what you propose. What I see is twice the amount of copper for no apparent reason.

 

Because then I can control the rotor coils on a multi coiled motor for and against the stator coils as I wish! instead of the stator coils dictating the whole thing. Is one reason. But I also understand what your saying about losses in the transmission to the rotor yes.but I'm also sure with the correct circuit this also could be minimized So I was asking kindly at the start of this thread if I could get help to look at the circuit. I want strong electromagnets powered by a hf oscillator pulsing a pushpull transformer rectified to dc & also from a
H-bridge.
Thanks

 

Air coils wont get you anywhere, look how the inside of any actual motor looks like - full of laminated steel cores, and rotor and stator very close to each other. That means your transmit and receive coils need cores arranged in a way that won´t produce huge air gaps. The frequency or arrangement of the drive circuit dont matter as much as the magnetic path between the two coils.

Maybe you could divide this into two parts, one having the rotor with brushes to find out what kind of drive the motor actually needs, and then another part where you focus solely on transmitting that power between the two coils.

 

Ok thanks, so ATM there are 2 seperate circuits a H-bridge to control the stator electromagnet(for now until I make a multi pole motor.then I can use a circuit from a brushless motor to control multiple coils on the stator.) And the other a hf oscillator pulsing a pushpull Air coils the transmitting coil attached to the back or end of the stator. The reciving coil is on the end of the rotor rectified to give dc to a coventional pole on a modified brushed motor rotor.
I have a identical motor that still uses the brushes as I bought it. So your saying I need to know the current draw to the rotor on that standard motor first?

 

The standard motor draws 800ma at 12.5v

 

Because then I can control the rotor coils on a multi coiled motor for and against the stator coils as I wish! instead of the stator coils dictating the whole thing.

A wound rotor induction motor does this to some extent, except there are slip rings to control induced current by load resistors typically.
Max.

 

Which makes that type of motor high maintenance compared to most others due to those slip rings. I want get away from brushes. And see if I can help making my circuit working better.

 

I think I have found a document that outlines the type of motor you are aiming for it is called a Synchro-Pac motor, a brushless synchronous motor, semi conductor exited field.
Max.

 

I was just looking up to see if anyone has come up with this idea yet. If you're interested in finding a partner to work onthis project, i would be interested. I have experience in electrical control of PMSMs. But not in mechanical design.

 

Have a look at this. Is this what you're interested in?