Sound Bar, how does this give a Center Sound Channel?

Thread Starter

biferi

Joined Apr 14, 2017
201
Please Watch this Video on the TCL Sound Bar.

I do Understand that it uses Sound Reflection to give the Dolby Atmos Sound.

But the Sound Bar has no Center Speaker so how does this give a Center Sound Channel?
 

LowQCab

Joined Nov 6, 2012
1,340
It's a gimmick.
If You like the sound, and the "look" then go for it.

There's no such thing as tiny speakers in a plastic box that actually sound good.

Treating the Acoustics of your Room will be much more rewarding.
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bassbindevil

Joined Jan 23, 2014
203
You can get a "phantom center" from left and right speakers; that's how stereo works. I did without a center channel for years; the center information was just mixed into L and R equally by the surround processor.
 

Ian0

Joined Aug 7, 2020
3,760
The real test of stereo loudspeakers is how well they create the stereo image.
The better the stereo the less it needs a centre speaker!
 

MisterBill2

Joined Jan 23, 2018
9,824
Post #2 is certainly correct!! I still laugh about the description of one television set that touted the "Large 1 7/8 inch woofers." While small transducers might perform adequately for earphones closely coupled to ears, for other applications it is all done with the frequency response of the amplifier and people's imagination.
Small is not big no matter how much you wish it were.
 

MisterBill2

Joined Jan 23, 2018
9,824
Does that mean that they are closer to 1 15/16" than they are to 1 13/16"?
My quite old Marantz stereo speakers had three inch tweeters and 12 inch woofers. The system did produce quite good sound at reasonable levels and no distortion that I could hear. Of course the speaker enclosures were a bit bigger.
 

Tonyr1084

Joined Sep 24, 2015
6,459
Center channel is a myth. If the left channel and right channel both have the same frequency and amplitude then the center channel (between left positive and right positive for instance) is zero volts. In other words, you're driving a speaker from (lets say) a 10 volt DC left channel and 10 volt DC right channel, the difference is zero voltage. We all know audio is not DC. But for the sake of argument and understanding, the center channel only reacts to when the two channels are at different frequencies and/or amplitude. If the left channel is at 1kHz and the right channel is at 1.1kHz then approximately 100 hertz is the difference between the channels. If you've ever tuned a guitar then you listen for the wah-wah of the tones that are supposed to be in tune. When the wah-wah goes away then the strings are in tune. When out of tune you hear that oscillation of the difference in frequency. No band has ever worked to record a third channel in their music. All members are tuned to matching frequency so that when they play they complement each other.

When the frequency is 180˚ opposed to each other they cancel each other out. Provided they are of the same amplitude and frequency. There IS no center channel.
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
8,904
Center channel is a myth. If the left channel and right channel both have the same frequency and amplitude then the center channel (between left positive and right positive for instance) is zero volts. In other words, you're driving a speaker from (lets say) a 10 volt DC left channel and 10 volt DC right channel, the difference is zero voltage. We all know audio is not DC. But for the sake of argument and understanding, the center channel only reacts to when the two channels are at different frequencies and/or amplitude. If the left channel is at 1kHz and the right channel is at 1.1kHz then approximately 100 hertz is the difference between the channels. If you've ever tuned a guitar then you listen for the wah-wah of the tones that are supposed to be in tune. When the wah-wah goes away then the strings are in tune. When out of tune you hear that oscillation of the difference in frequency. No band has ever worked to record a third channel in their music. All members are tuned to matching frequency so that when they play they complement each other.

When the frequency is 180˚ opposed to each other they cancel each other out. Provided they are of the same amplitude and frequency. There IS no center channel.
Most professional recordings are multi-channel >2 that have been remixed into the required delivery format.
The separate center is not a myth with multi-channel audio >2. There is a discrete center channel in many of the multi-channel/surround systems. Even older quad recordings have been remastered into 5.1 systems.

One of my old collectibles.
PXL_20211016_155905997.jpg
https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...rs-band-at-fillmore-east-dts-cd-re-mix.29414/
 

Tonyr1084

Joined Sep 24, 2015
6,459
I'm not familiar with 5.1 systems. I only know the stereo's I've worked with/on. Left and right channels.

As for multi-track recordings - those are individual instruments and vocals. The center channel on a stereo is just that - a myth. All the center channel is - is the difference between left and right. The results, which I have tried many years ago, is a muddy and muted signal. It would take a center channel amplifier in order to derive anything from that so-called track.

I'm not talking professional 16 track recordings, I'm talking about the two channel, left and right stereo systems you get in your home and car. There - there is no center channel.
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
8,904
I'm not familiar with 5.1 systems. I only know the stereo's I've worked with/on. Left and right channels.

As for multi-track recordings - those are individual instruments and vocals. The center channel on a stereo is just that - a myth. All the center channel is - is the difference between left and right. The results, which I have tried many years ago, is a muddy and muted signal. It would take a center channel amplifier in order to derive anything from that so-called track.

I'm not talking professional 16 track recordings, I'm talking about the two channel, left and right stereo systems you get in your home and car. There - there is no center channel.
For pure binaural recorded sources I would agree but that's not how most professional audio recording are mastered.

I guess I'm special because I have 5.1+ systems in my car and house for music with separate center channels for both.

Car system and center


Older version of house multichannel source and center speaker.

The TV 'sound bars' are designed for discrete surround speaker emulation. I would never use one purely for stereo source listening.
 

ElectricSpidey

Joined Dec 2, 2017
1,970
My home entertainment system is 7.1 but I only use 5.1 because I don't have room for all of the speakers.

The problem with my system is the center channel volume isn't loud enough relative to the front so the voices are very hard to hear at normal volume levels.

When I listen to music I use "pure direct" stereo. ;) 2 channels only, no enhancements, even the display turns off.
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
8,904
My home entertainment system is 7.1 but I only use 5.1 because I don't have room for all of the speakers.

The problem with my system is the center channel volume isn't loud enough relative to the front so the voices are very hard to hear at normal volume levels.

When I listen to music I use "pure direct" stereo. ;) 2 channels only, no enhancements, even the display turns off.
Improving voicing was one of the reasons I built my own center, high and tilted down. I use front projection for movies and the above center placement keeps the voices near the screen.



+1 for "pure direct" stereo, that's the mode I use for playing records.
 

Thread Starter

biferi

Joined Apr 14, 2017
201
I should have Told you this.

With the Sound Bar above it has no Center Speaker.

So like you Say if it comes Time to Play Say a Voice from a Center Speaker it will Mix the Left and Right Speakers To Gather to make a Center Speaker.

I get this but what if the Left and Right Speakers are doing Sounds and it comes Time to have a Voice in the Center Speaker at the same Time?

Can it do a good Job at doing Both at the same Time?
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
8,904
I should have Told you this.

With the Sound Bar above it has no Center Speaker.

So like you Say if it comes Time to Play Say a Voice from a Center Speaker it will Mix the Left and Right Speakers To Gather to make a Center Speaker.

I get this but what if the Left and Right Speakers are doing Sounds and it comes Time to have a Voice in the Center Speaker at the same Time?

Can it do a good Job at doing Both at the same Time?
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC400748/

The job happens in your brain (psychology) with the signals (physics) from your ears so it's up to us how good a job it does to great extent. Most of the time we process the ears two signals into a mental 3D presentation of a sound field so we will create a phantom center sound image if there are sound patterns matching what the brain processes and localizes. It's also possible for the brain to isolate sounds into distinct ear processing channels. There was a time when I and most of my fellow communicators could type from audio copy in one ear, hold a conversation with another person with the other ear, while also smoking and drinking coffee. We can train the brain to process sensor data in different ways so your good might be my bad.
 

Ian0

Joined Aug 7, 2020
3,760
The centre speaker is not connected between the + terminals of the L and R amplifier outputs, because that would give L-R or R-L depending on which way round the speaker is connected. L-R and R-L should be the Left rear and right rear speakers.
The centre speaker should be L+R, and the only way of achieving that without extra amplification is by connecting the centre speaker in series with the commoned earth return from L and R. It centre position in the stereo would be highly dependent on having two matched speakers, especially having two matched inductances.
 

Thread Starter

biferi

Joined Apr 14, 2017
201
Ok I found this SamSung HW-Q950T SoundBar.

It all Looks good but if you Look on YouTub the Subwoofer is Rated at 28 Watts.

Is this to Low?
 
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