The fight for higher wages is an integral part of capitalism. So what I say to a person who got a job as a street sweeper earning $50 per hour is "Congratulations!"

Of course, but what you don't understand is that the government didn't mandate it. Otherwise, why congratulate someone who is simply the beneficiary of an illwitted government mandate?

John

 

May I, at this point, recommend some reading material? Try Ayn Rand's "Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal".

After you read it, if you disagree with any of it, I'd like to hear some (rational) reasons why.

 

If the minimum wage was a livable wage, there would be less people dependent on big government.

The only reason people depend on the government is because they want them to.

Not so many decades ago there was very little government assistance for anyone who was of true able body and mind other than federal work programs like the ones that built the majority of our nation's road and flood management, power generation and distribution infrastructures we know today.

If you didn't want to work you starved or did something to get yourself put in jail. Anything else you found a job and if there were no private jobs every state had more than enough government funded 'Pick and Shovel' work projects to go around.

 

Ever wonder why you never see those infrastructure projects anymore?

I think everyone felt better when they earned their money.
Remember the CCC?
Can you imagine private industry building a new dam, state park or interstate.
Trickle, trickle.

 

Ever wonder why you never see those infrastructure projects anymore?

I think everyone felt better when they earned their money.
Remember the CCC?
Can you imagine private industry building a new dam, state park or interstate.
Trickle, trickle.

I haven't. Ever wonder why the debt keeps going up? Why there seems to be a minimum amount of money to make it through the year and tax cuts seem to be the answer. I don't understand their line of thought.

 

Ever wonder why you never see those infrastructure projects anymore?

Because the vast majority of major base infrastructure systems got built already and now we are in what is largely a maintain and improve mode with what's being used.

Also, construction techniques and machinery to do the work have came a long way since then. Today one person with a large earth mover does the work of a 100+ people with picks and shovels from back 70 - 100+ years ago.

No one has built a major new road in my area for at least 60 - 70 years. What they have done is upgrade dirt roads to basic paved ones and basic paved roads to high traffic or multi lane roads. The county road I live on was put in back in the 1930' or 1940's and now it's being surveyed for a major overhaul to go to basic paved. Upgrade but not a whole new roadway where none existed before.

Same with flood control and other such systems. Not much new never before done work but lots of maintenance and upgrade work is still being done all the time.

 

Because the vast majority of major base infrastructure systems got built already and now we are in what is largely a maintain and improve mode with what's being used.

Also, construction techniques and machinery to do the work have came a long way since then. Today one person with a large earth mover does the work of a 100+ people with picks and shovels from back 70 - 100+ years ago.

No one has built a major new road in my area for at least 60 - 70 years. What they have done is upgrade dirt roads to basic paved ones and basic paved roads to high traffic or multi lane roads. The county road I live on was put in back in the 1930' or 1940's and now it's being surveyed for a major overhaul to go to basic paved. Upgrade but not a whole new roadway where none existed before.

Same with flood control and other such systems. Not much new never before done work but lots of maintenance and upgrade work is still being done all the time.

Tell that to the people on the coasts. They have highways that are trying to move half the people in North Dakota every day.

 

In the San Francisco Bay Area, the minimum wage is NOT what's driving inflation - it's government handouts to big business and other politically connected groups.

As a prime example, Obama's been to San Francisco 24 times and Hillary Clinton's been here 6 times, both of them visiting to "fund raise" -IE- collect "sanitized" bribe money in order to get more federal $$$ out of Washington.

They claim the high cost of housing is due to a "tech boom", however most of the so called 'techies" are nothing but a bunch spoiled brat kids with rich parents living high on the hog. It's an illusion of prosperity and the region's economy is dangerously dependent on the flow of government money. Eventually, the bubble will burst and there'll be an economic collapse worse than 2008.

So forget about blaming the person working at McDonalds. It's the artificially wealthy that are creating double digit inflation.

 

In the San Francisco Bay Area, the minimum wage is NOT what's driving inflation - it's government handouts to big business and other politically connected groups.

As a prime example, Obama's been to San Francisco 24 times and Hillary Clinton's been here 6 times, both of them visiting to "fund raise" -IE- collect "sanitized" bribe money in order to get more federal $$$ out of Washington.

They claim the high cost of housing is due to a "tech boom", however most of the so called 'techies" are nothing but a bunch spoiled brat kids with rich parents living high on the hog. It's an illusion of prosperity and the region's economy is dangerously dependent on the flow of government money. Eventually, the bubble will burst and there'll be an economic collapse worse than 2008.

So forget about blaming the person working at McDonalds. It's the artificially wealthy that are creating double digit inflation.

So Glenn, How's the infrastructure? Could you use another lane or track or is all you need are a few pot holes fixed?
Got plenty of water?
I hear your boy is coming for some of that free money.

 

So Glenn, How's the infrastructure? Could you use another lane or track or is all you need are a few pot holes fixed?
Got plenty of water?
I hear your boy is coming for some of that free money.

The infrastructure is a complete mess. Funds that were supposed to go into transportation projects actually got siphoned off for subsidies to developers to build so called high density housing and add bike lanes on the side of streets. As a result, traffic is backed up for 2 hours during commute hours.

Because of continued population growth and development, there will be a chronic water shortage no matter how much it rains. The financial picture is absolutely horrid. Every government agency has its hand reaching out for more $$$ to fix problems that previous taxpayer handouts were supposed to have fixed. I call California a "Government State" because its whole economy is largely dependent on government entities of some sort or another.

<snip>

 

Glenn, you can not seem to keep politics out of your discussions. Please don't make myself or some other mod close this thread. This is a warning.

 

If the minimum wage was a livable wage, there would be less people dependent on big government.

So you're all for those who are working and have not yet reached the age of majority, receive the "livable" minimum wage even though they are still in school and have not left their parent's home and have little marketable skills.

 

So you're all for those who are working and have not yet reached the age of majority, receive the "livable" minimum wage even though they are still in school and have not left their parent's home and have little marketable skills.

By extension, do you think people with roommates or any other "second wage earner" in a household does not need to be paid a minimum wage?

On the other hand, do companies need a subsidy by creating a less-than-minimum-wage-labor-pool of 16- and 17-year-olds? I didn't think you were the subsidy-creating type.

 

Tell that to the people on the coasts. They have highways that are trying to move half the people in North Dakota every day.

What am I supposed to tell them?

Get off your welfare sucking butts and go build more roads or expand the ones you have now if that's what you need?

I don't live there and where I do is not run by big government BS like they run their state.

 

It is a basic human right to work for what you are worth. The American Constitution and Declaration of Independence embody that concept. Read them.

Please support your so-called 90% "data?"

John

And, your opinion is crap according to the Supreme Court.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Coast_Hotel_Co._v._Parrish

Talk about bearing false witness. The word, "wage" doesn't appear even once in the link you provide.

John

John, there is something wrong with your browser if it could not find the word "wage" in the link I provided. Something wrong with you if you could not comprehend the context of the link and needed to resort to the "Find"feature of your browser.

For the record, wage/wages appears 7 times.

 

I find the minimum wage discussion highly offensive.

Chelsea Clinton made 750k in a few hours reading script in front of a NBC camera, her mom made 250k per hour speaking too bankers, and omaba got a couple million dollars in advances on a book ghost written by others.

What makes any of that hundreds of thousands times more valuable than that of the person handing you the burger at McDonald's?

And the politicians have the guts to tell us how much little our time is worth vs theirs?

I demand a minimum wage on park with hillarys, at a minimum.

 

I find the minimum wage discussion highly offensive.

I find compulsion at the point of a gun offensive. Regardless of topic.

I demand a minimum wage on park with hillarys, at a minimum.

Go ahead, demand it. But you'll need a gun to get it.

 

By extension, do you think people with roommates or any other "second wage earner" in a household does not need to be paid a minimum wage?

Those with NO marketable skills will always be stuck in a minimum wage job. Where is the personal responsibility? The "room mates" scenario is common among low income wage earners, even apprentices who are first learning their craft. What about those who won't live within their means no matter how much money they are paid?

We will see where this goes. The costs will be borne by someone, typically the consumer. That "15 dollar per hour" wage costs more than 15 dollars per hour. All those costs are passed to the consumer. The consumer may decide it's too expensive and shop elsewhere. Less sales means smaller workforce requirements. Smaller workforce requirements means more unemployment.

The US Dept of labor has some good info on prevailing wages. If the prevailing wage is less than the mandated "minimum" wage, you must pay the "minimum".

On the other hand, do companies need a subsidy by creating a less-than-minimum-wage-labor-pool of 16- and 17-year-olds? I didn't think you were the subsidy-creating type.

That is a political move to increase the jobs. Did you think the employer initiated that?

Remember the "100,000 more cops on the street" from the Clinton administration? The federal government paid the majority of the salaries for those officers for a number of years. What do you think happened when the funding ran out? How many officers were lost to attrition? It could easily be masked by "retirements" and not replacing those who retired.

 

The costs will be borne by someone, typically the consumer...

It's certainly true that the effect of a zero-sum policy is to shift funds from one group to another. Few (but some) will argue that a minimum wage is not zero-sum. Nothing more is produced, no costs are saved, no resource is utilized more efficiently. It's just another government-mandated wealth transfer.

But I don't think the "loser" is the consumer in this case. Consumers have too many options to end up holding the bag. They'll just take their business elsewhere.

The biggest loser is the young, minority kid that won't be able to get a first job. Somebody willing to work for $5 is forbidden by Big Brother from taking that job. The minimum wage was and remains a purposefully racist policy to protect the wages of middle-age union workers who fear losing their jobs to lower paid minorities trying to get started in the labor market. The policy works.

 

If I were a young man, I think I'd be studying robotics.