http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/tech/super-battery.html

I just watched this on Nova yesterday, I thought other's might enjoy it.

I thought the Plastic Electrolytic was encouraging, also the Salt Water Battery.

enjoy

kv

 

Great program but in the words of engineer Montgomery Scott.

but YOU CAN BEND THEM!!! and hope it doesn't explode too often.

 

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/tech/super-battery.html

I just watched this on Nova yesterday, I thought other's might enjoy it.

I thought the Plastic Electrolytic was encouraging, also the Salt Water Battery.

enjoy

kv

Hi,

Maybe you could give us a quick summary of what we would see in this video and what improvements to batteries were found. Thanks.

 

I guess what impresses me about the plastic electrolytic as medium carries charge without the possibility of Stalactite/Stalagmite accumulation, which is a major concern as a fire hazard. Plus the inventor can use Lithium metal, which increases charge carriers, it can be cut or punctured and still power your device.

Salt Water Battery was impressive because of it's simplicity.

Benefit:

Today's saltwater battery is actually a fresh implementation of a 200-year old idea. The sodium-sulfate chemistry is non-toxic, non-corrosive, non-flammable, and contains no heavy metals - a refreshing change from the environmental toxins found in other batteries’ cells. The saltwater battery is especially suited for long-term stationary applications like off-grid homes and work sites. They don’t suffer from chronic low states-of-charge, or being operated over a narrow range of their capacity: there’s no “memory” effect so there is no need to exercise if used in a grid-tie application where they may be in float mode for months on end. Aquion batteries are sealed so there’s no need for venting or refilling. They’re also more tolerant of high temperatures than lead-acid.

Drawback:

With all these benefits, it’s a wonder anyone would want lead-acid! The limitations they do have, however, is they are limited in how fast they can deliver or accept energy, and that they are rather large and heavy for a given capacity. Aquions are more likely to find utility in domestic or 24-hour-runtime use rather than short-duration high-peak load applications. The banks are often sized based on peak load rather than energy requirements.

They did show other Technologies, but these seemed interesting to me.

kv

 

The problem for super batteries is eventually they will work too well. If its as Energy-Dense as High Explosives then it can be quite possibility also be used as a bomb by harnessing the total energy quickly.

The most powerful energy storage materials are “metastable.” If we can find a way to make very energy-dense compounds without high-pressure and exotic conditions at the level of powerful explosives like HMX we will have super batteries with the potential of great harm if misused.

 

The problem for super batteries is eventually they will work too well. If its as Energy-Dense as High Explosives then it can be quite possibility also be used as a bomb by harnessing the total energy quickly.

The most powerful energy storage materials are “metastable.” If we can find a way to make very energy-dense compounds without high-pressure and exotic conditions at the level of powerful explosives like HMX we will have super batteries with the potential of great harm if misused.

Hi,

I wondered about this too with all the problems in airport security and the like.
Even when i go to ship something with an Li-ion battery in it i have to tell the mail room attendant that it contains that kind of battery. If the battery explodes or even catches fire on an airplane of some kind people would freak out.

I like the idea of the 'plastic' based batteries though, so far.

 

I like the idea of the 'plastic' based batteries though, so far.

There's just something about the 'plastic' battery that tickles my skeptic bone but it looks great. I've seen generations of 'new' designs in the lab that failed like a stone when engineered for mass production.

Even lead is not dead, yet.
http://www.alabc.org/

 

There's just something about the 'plastic' battery that tickles my skeptic bone but it looks great. I've seen generations of 'new' designs in the lab that failed like a stone when engineered for mass production.

Even lead is not dead, yet.
http://www.alabc.org/

Hi,

Yeah it's good to be skeptic these days with any new material as there is so much old material called BS floating around.

It is amazing how much we still use lead acid, such an old technology.
It is also amazing how other technologies have advanced while some of these older ones have not changed that much. Could it be they are being held back by some entity that sees it being a negative factor in their own industry. Once we get better batteries renewable energy will start to take a larger part of the power industry eventually leaving power companies in the dark (no pun intended but that sounds like fun to me). Maybe they have a way to hold back some new inventions.

 

Hi,
Could it be they are being held back by some entity that sees it being a negative factor in their own industry.

That entity is called profit. R&D is paid for by cash from existing products in old line companies. If you have billions in sunk costs to manufacture X types of batteries (or any product) and the blue haired guy from R&D invents a new battery that requires you to spend billions more to make it cost effective to manufacture it's very likely that fancy new technology will sit on the shelf for a while.

 

That entity is called profit. R&D is paid for by cash from existing products in old line companies. If you have billions in sunk costs to manufacture X types of batteries (or any product) and the blue haired guy from R&D invents a new battery that requires you to spend billions more to make it cost effective to manufacture it's very likely that fancy new technology will sit on the shelf for a while.

Agreed, all the investors that could invest won't, all those who have connecting Technologies huddle together like "Muskox" protecting their babies.

kv

 

We need to learn how to make batteries out of coal. It would be nice to electrically control the oxidation of coal at a molecular level.

 

We need to learn how to make batteries out of coal. It would be nice to electrically control the oxidation of coal at a molecular level.

That would be great, then we could stop using gas.

 

I enjoyed this program as well, I happened to run across it by chance. It explains very well, the problems with Lithium and what has been done to overcome these. I work in the business of large format redox flow batteries and this was only mentioned in the last few minutes of the show. Kind of wish they has spent a little more time on that aspect.

Doug

 

I found it eye-opening just how explosive the lithium batteries can be. I had no idea. It's a little surprising they found their way into consumer products.

 

I found it eye-opening just how explosive the lithium batteries can be. I had no idea. It's a little surprising they found their way into consumer products.

I decided to look into this again, the guy who invented it say's plastic extortion process needed is all he needs. He also says that it packs twice the energy density of those chemistries.

“Because it’s a polymer, it can be scaled into high volume,” he told us. “It can fit into battery manufacturing very easily.”

Zimmerman also says his polymer material would eliminate the overheating and explosion problems notably seen in some lithium-ion batteries, while offering twice the energy density of those chemistries.

The technology is attracting interest from venture capitalists, automakers, energy companies, and even other battery manufacturers. Renault-Nissan-Mitsubishi announced it is investing in Ionic Materials earlier this year, as did Hyundai Cradle, Hyundai Motors’ venture capital arm. Similarly, French-based energy giant Total has invested in the technology. And battery manufacturer A123 Systems is teaming with Ionic on batteries for plug-in vehicles.

kv

 

I decided to look into this again, the guy who invented it say's plastic extortion process needed is all he needs. He also says that it packs twice the energy density of those chemistries.



kv

You probably saw this, but it's a useful and brief overview of things.
https://www.theverge.com/2018/8/13/...-lithium-ion-solid-state-electrolyte-analysis

 

You probably saw this, but it's a useful and brief overview of things.
https://www.theverge.com/2018/8/13/...-lithium-ion-solid-state-electrolyte-analysis

I didn't, Thank you.

kv