Sea Level rising?

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by wmodavis, Feb 14, 2012.

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  1. joeyd999

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    Jun 6, 2011
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    What has this to do with sea levels??? Bit of non sequitur if you ask me...
     
  2. Brownout

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    Jan 10, 2012
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    Well, the Arial Sea is an amazing story about how man changes his environment. I don't see it as a nonsequiter at all. Some of the things you've mentioned are not man's fault. What needs to be examined are the multitude of changes in conditions that have been otherwise stable over 10's of 1000's of years, and now are rapidly changing. Also, the coorelation of those changes with the rise of the main catalyst; the industrial revolution and burning of fossile fuels. That has changes so much.
     
  3. R!f@@

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    Apr 2, 2009
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    :D
    Come and see.

    Everything here is a like a billiard.

    Push us and away we go. So far that's how it's been going on
     
  4. Brownout

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    But he said "flat as a billard ball", which is anything but flat. Did he mean "billard board?"
     
  5. joeyd999

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    Please, enumerate these 'changes in conditions that have been otherwise stable'. And, extend your time frame back a bit...1000 years is but a brief moment in earth's history.
     
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  6. Brownout

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    Rising CO2 levels, rising sea levels, rising global temperature, bleacing reefs, more frequent and severe storms, more coastal flooding, more extreeme weather, tropical disease in non-tropical climates.... That's a partial list. And I said 10's of 1000's of years.
     
  7. justtrying

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    Mar 9, 2011
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    it is direct evidence of our impact on nature. The sea was on its way towards slowly drying up, but look at how we managed to help it along. Now I want you to prove to me that enormous water consumption, gas emissions, waste water, drugs, plastics and toxic waste that is leaching into oceans (via soil) is not doing anything... i.e I am asking you to present evidence to the contrary i.e that we have no/minimal impact on our environment.

    extreme conditions (to add to what has been said already): Asia - dust clouds are becoming more and more severe due to severe soil degradation, when there is no land to grow food on and no water to drink, what are we going to eat? ipods?
     
  8. Brownout

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    The same thing is happening to the Salton Sea in southern California. And, paradoxically, it is also happening in Lake Mead, one on the largest man-made lakes in the world. There isn't enough water to keep the levels up due to diversion on the Colorado River. The lake has dropped 100's of feet and is rapidly drying up.
     
  9. justtrying

    Senior Member

    Mar 9, 2011
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    Yes, I expect some drastic effects to come out of latest projects in China - large dams and river diversions have proven to be devastating to water supplies. Most common problem - people refuse to learn from the past. Developing countries want to drive cars. Why? I would argue that it is not the most efficient mode of transportation. And first world countries abuse their knowledge for the sake of profit - Canada selling asbestos to India for example... I could go on, but it is fairly pointless.

    p.s. I liked Carlin's take on it as well - of course planet is too big to care about us, we are like bacteria. But I like the ocean, it is soothing and makes me feel calm and happy even when it is angry. So as temporary guests on this planet, we have no right to spread are BS all over it and disrupt the environment for others as well.
     
  10. Wendy

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    Mar 24, 2008
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    Now and then you hear about plans to desalinate ocean water and use it for whatever. I suspect this will be a long term solution for what is coming. The aquifers are drying up do to overuse, water is going to become flat out scarce. The states with access to the ocean will use it, and those with access to rivers will use that. Those with neither will sue to get access.

    There used to be range wars over water rights. I believe there will be again.

    One of the things argued against using ocean water is the local salinity levels will change. Again, I suspect this is going to happen either way, we just need to wait and see how to handle it.
     
  11. t06afre

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    May 11, 2009
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    Funny but in the in the area I live in. The land was compressed by several prehistoric glaciers the last 3 Km thick. But still today the land is kind of popping back to shape. The land uplift is about 5mm pr year. So we are not so exposed to rising sea levels yet
     
  12. ErnieM

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    Apr 24, 2011
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    Ya'all do know that the Salton Sea was created by man in 1905, right? A canal overran it's banks and that's where the water wound up.
     
  13. Brownout

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    I guess nature had absolutely nothing to do with it::rolleyes:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salton_Sea
     
  14. joeyd999

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    Jun 6, 2011
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    1000's and 10's of 1000's of years is still but seconds relative to the age of the earth.

    CO2 has been *much* higher in the past than it is today -- long before humans existed. Sea levels have risen and fallen. Temperatures were both hotter and colder. Reefs have grown and been destroyed, coasts have flooded, weather has changed, *continents have moved*.

    Things change. That is what they do. Life adapts. The earth goes on.

    What a depressing existence you must have, waking up each morning with the knowledge that you, personally, are quintessentially evil. That each breath you take, each morsel of food you eat, each time you turn on a light bulb, drive in a car, or type on your computer somehow irreparably damages the earth.

    I *know* that things are better here on earth today than they were 100 or 1000 years ago. Once, life was brutish and short. Today, you have so much freedom -- freedom from struggling for mere existence -- that you have the time to sit here and pine away at how horrible human beings are, including yourself, rather than toiling in some field simply for a bite of food today and being constantly at the mercy of the elements.

    Perhaps you can find comfort in this: humans will not inhabit this planet for long (relatively speaking). It is a fact that, at some point, an extinction level event will occur. Perhaps a meteor strike or some other cataclysm. It has happened many times before, and will happen again. Then mother earth will be free of us evil humans, and will, indifferently, carry on without us. And all will be fine again.

    I will enjoy my life to the fullest until then, happily consuming what I want when I want it. And leaving the earth a better place in the mean time.
     
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  15. shortbus

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    Sep 30, 2009
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    Joeyd999, you are so right! The so called experts don't or won't believe geological evidence. We are just now coming out of the latest 'ice age'. And the Earth cycles and recycles its self over and over. With all of the knowledge of the Earths past some people think that recent memory is all that counts.
     
  16. wmodavis

    Thread Starter Distinguished Member

    Oct 23, 2010
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    Right on joeyd!
     
  17. MrChips

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    That is one huge contradictory statement.
     
  18. Wendy

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    Mar 24, 2008
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    Sometimes I think we're due for an asteroid strike, or Yellowstone going off. Natural events, both of them, but I don't think I'll make it through.

    Then there was the argument I read in a SciFi novel, Greg Bear I believe. We are Earth's gonads, about to spread life far and wide in the universe. Problem with adolescence is there will be pimples.

    I have not brought up root causes. I have opinions, but that goes right to politics. Been there, done that, he closed the thread last time, and now its my job.

    The real point (to me) is denial of real measurements. They are there, they are not going to change due to reinterpretation. Trying to pretend they don't exist is the worst kind of antiscience. Claiming people have a scam going because they see it as a clear and present danger to their people is not going to change the facts, though it could help get large numbers of people killed if it became a popular view. Like many times before in history, people will have to migrate or die to adapt.

    Lead, follow, or get out of the way.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2012
  19. R!f@@

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    Bill...don't worry about asteroid or yellowstone or whatever. These things will not happen. Any one here won't see the end. We will die sooner than we know it.
     
  20. steveb

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    Jul 3, 2008
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    All educated people know this. You say it like all of the concerned people of the world are oblivious to this fact. You are blinding yourself to the fundamental point that many people (certainly not you though) are worried about. Most of us don't want to stick our head in the sand and assume everything will be fine for posterity.

    Yes, the earth will be fine in the long run. The earth will go on. Life will go on. Man will likely one day be extinct unless he finds a way to colonize other planets, and even then extinction is inevitable eventually.

    This is not the issue we are discussing. The problem is that man's technology has progressed to the point where he has a significant impact on the the earth that he has evolved in and has adapted to. As time goes on this impact will only get more significant. There is a very real risk that humans may tip the balance and create conditions on earth that are not to his advantage. There can be huge economic, social and quality of life impacts. We may hasten our own extinction, or trigger another dark age for our species.

    The bottom line is that we don't really know just how sensitive our impact might be. However, it is clear that we can affect the world on a global scale. Only time will tell exactly what the effects will be, but it makes sense to be prudent and cautious when you enter an unknown territory. If we are not cautious and forward thinking, we will only know there is a problem when it is too late. If that happens, what opinion will posterity hold for their forefathers that had your attitude?
     
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