# (RE: New UAS regulations) Overeach - thy name is government...(drones)

#### Hypatia's Protege

Joined Mar 1, 2015
3,226
Seems the DOT are taking their our toys rather seriously!
http://www.faa.gov/uas/media/RIN_2120-AJ60_Clean_Signed.pdf

The new operator requirements are particularly 'amusing'!

Curious that (second only to possession/use of firearms) private transportation devices (and, hence, autonomous mobility) so frighten our elected officials keepers

Best regards
HP

PS @Aleph(0) -- I can but hope this thread's title meets with your approval...?

#### Aleph(0)

Joined Mar 14, 2015
597
PS @Aleph(0) -- I can but hope this thread's title meets with your approval...?
HP I say title is good but content is a little lame Cuz you're not noticing part 107 applies just to commercial uas operation! HP it's an easy mistake you made cuz they hide non hobby stipulator pretty well But I am telling you accurate truth! You know my livelihood keeps me like totally wed to FAA so just trust me! Now I'm saying ur right about government confusing servant and master!

#### Hypatia's Protege

Joined Mar 1, 2015
3,226
HP I say title is good but content is a little lame
And I would say your powers of clairvoyance leave much to be desired -- Indeed you missed my point entirely! Commercial or pleasure said 'conveyances' are TOYS! -- I wonder who'll be the first UAS 'aviator' to be 'pinched' for intoxicated operation? --- IIRC the federal limit = .04% (i.e. 1/25 of 1%) said low concentration being a rather high bar

All the best
HP

#### jpanhalt

Joined Jan 18, 2008
11,088
HP I say title is good but content is a little lame Cuz you're not noticing part 107 applies just to commercial uas operation! HP it's an easy mistake you made cuz they hide non hobby stipulator pretty well But I am telling you accurate truth! You know my livelihood keeps me like totally wed to FAA so just trust me! Now I'm saying ur right about government confusing servant and master!
I think the concern is that originally the FAA wanted its rules to apply to all operators of anything that flew and was controlled from the ground. That would, of course, include control-line flying, but not free flight! And, it would include the burgeoning hobby of indoor RC flying. There was a lot of political lobbying by the hobbyist group(s), but that group's pockets are not very deep. The US Senate passed an amendment to a reauthorization bill to exempt recreational pilots, but I believe it has been tied up in joint conference committee. Eventually, the FAA stepped back from that original position.

However, there is deep suspicion that the current Final Rule is just the camel's nose under the tent, so to speak. The FAA has said that its sole intent is to ensure "safety." Are there any other activities in which professional participants are known to be more dangerous than recreational participants? How does one make a link between getting paid and being unsafe?

It seems more likely that the FAA has made that distinction at this time, because it was the easier path to take given the number of hobbyists versus commercial users. Also, addressing only commercial users now makes it easier to enact increased user fees to fund the enforcement bureaucracy. I suspect that once the dust settles on this initial Rule, the FAA will continue to publicize incidents and the public will see that irresponsible recreational users account for most of them. At that time, recreational users will be enrolled in the program.

The major problem I have with the FAA rules is their scope of coverage. Not a single member of our modeling club has objected to the need to regulate FPV (first-person view) without a safety pilot in visual contact at all time. In other words, if you put a camera on your airplane and just take pictures of the local filed for fun, it is no more unsafe than flying without a camera. However, if one is flying solely by use of the camera (visualize a military drone), there are obviously greater risks. The problem is that the FAA has lumped FPV without a safety pilot with all other types of RC flying.

Regards, John

#### Hypatia's Protege

Joined Mar 1, 2015
3,226
However, there is deep suspicion that the current Final Rule is just the camel's nose under the tent, so to speak. The FAA has said that its sole intent is to ensure "safety." Are there any other activities in which professional participants are known to be more dangerous than recreational participants? How does one make a link between getting paid and being unsafe?
My guess (hope) is that this matter will eventually 'shake out' in a fashion similar to amateur radio regulation (given a return to less radical central government, that is). Dubious claims of 'public protection' being but the reliable (even if rather predictable) 'foot in the door' anywhere the easily dominated, absolutely gullible, myopic (I daresay even 'kalnienk-minded') 'general public' are concerned

Regulators 'follow the money' and long experience has taught them that 'private individuals' will readily (if begrudgingly) pay - so long as they needn't 'jump through' too many 'hoops' -- Consider, for instance, (again, with reference to communications) the 'Type Acceptance' exemption and greatly eased/streamlined 'RF exposure evaluation' requirements applicable to Amateur Radio -- Granted! The ARRL is significantly more 'formidable' than model aircraft advocacy groups -- even so, I feel my illustration 'holds' -- especially in light of the veritable 'goldmine' in fees 'wrestable' from the burgeoning interest in the latter...

Best regards
HP

Last edited:

#### JohnInTX

Joined Jun 26, 2012
4,694
@Hypatia's Protege
Thanks for the report.
The thread title was modified by a moderator. It wasn't me so I don't know what the original title was. Hopefully, it meets with your approval.

#### Hypatia's Protege

Joined Mar 1, 2015
3,226
The thread title was modified by a moderator.

I don't know what the original title was.
The modification consists merely of addition of the string "(drones)" to the right of the original title...

Hopefully, it meets with your approval.
Indeed it does! -- Inasmuch as 'drones' is likely more familiar than 'UAS', the modification likely increased the thread's readership!

Many sincere thanks!
HP

#12

#### BR-549

Joined Sep 22, 2013
4,928

#### nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
10,426
Good but what about the nearly 700,000 recreational drone owners in the U.S. database and millions in registration fees? Do you think that data will just vanish?
Asked whether the FAA intends to refund the more than $3m in registration fees it has presumably collected, the agency's spokesperson declined to comment. https://www.cadc.uscourts.gov/inter...20585258125004FBC13/$file/15-1495-1675918.pdf
Model aircraft owners who do not register face civil or criminal monetary penalties and up to three years’ imprisonment
Typical government reinforcement of arbitrary rules. Guns and Prisons. The FAA should face civil or criminal monetary penalties for unconstitutional actions.

Last edited:

#### #12

Joined Nov 30, 2010
18,223
I was sure I saw the "toy" exception recently, but I couldn't find it quickly. Thanks to BR-549

#### Aleph(0)

Joined Mar 14, 2015
597
That's a huge step in right direction but I'm saying as one professionally and privately involved in general aviation in US and Canada that is time for US to give non-commercial aviation over to states! Federal regulation of private transportation it just Feds keeping hand on strings! So I don't have as big a problem with Fed Govt regulation of commercial service cuz that's govt vs business all the same as railroad traffic. So big business and Govt are opposite sides of wooden nickle which need to moderate each other!

So anyhow it's good to know at least the toys are just toys again!

Also in case anybody thinks I'm saying double standard abt US and Canada it's just that Canadian system is basically single state with provinces territories and districts as just administrative divisions which are not semi-soverign like US states so like _state's rights_ is just not applicable here