question about FLOW of electricity....

Thread Starter

corporal_Canada

Joined Oct 17, 2024
138
Larger cable sizes will help to reduce losses but it won't solve the bank unbalance problem. 10 batteries ? all in parallel @12vdc is horrible engineering design and IMO foolish from the standpoint of cost and long term reliability.
This is from a person that wants you to have success in this project instead of making a money pit.

I used 4/0 and 3/0 AWG cable interconnects for my now decommissioned 12VDC system. It helped but I got the very expensive cable for free in a dumpster dive.
View attachment 336724

View attachment 336721
View attachment 336723
https://www.batterycablesusa.com/0000-gauge-battery-cable-black-4-0-awg
nice setup but it is very ulikely that i will find anything dumpster diving in a 3rd world country.. yes me from great white north.. however i now reside in the Philippines my gauge #4 cable was purchased online and i stripped the tips and proffesionally crimped the ring terminals on myself, sadly due to my skin colour i cannot get honest pricing in any store so 99% of my prchases are done via the Asian version of amazon.. so lazada,shoppee,tiktok shop or temu... i could get thicker, ive seen 1/0 gauge if that tells you anything... personally id like to keep my solar power setup at 12v for simplicity... and also no need to replace everything.. ie.. mppt, watt meter, inverter well id like to eventually replace the inverter for something beefier like 3000 watts and output puresine as opposed to modified sine wave... in the future months id like to have enough solar panels to give enough juice to pump my AC 24/7
and there lies the rub... AC lets say is 700 watts average hourly... so means i need 700x24... i need 16,800 watts total and yes i used my calculator :)

i suppose having 1 of those windmill (wind generator) thingies isnt out of a question.. however, im not certain that i can connect said windmill thing pwm to the same batteries that the solar pwm(mppt) is connected to, im quite new to this renewable energy thing tbh.

and about your comment that all batteries wont be even... well doesnt connecting them in parallel force the batteries to even out among each other ????, i forgot the term
 
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nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
16,346
...
and about your comment that all batteries wont be even... well doesnt connecting them in parallel force the batteries to even out among each other ????, i forgot the term
No, it doesn't because a LA battery is not a perfect black-box (some chemisteries other than Lead-Acid are close) for energy. It's electrochemistry and Lead-Acid redox is not linear like a simple electronic circuit theory component.
They would be parallel at the battery terminals, not internally.

1732675109671.png
https://www.epa.gov/sites/default/f...ad-acid-battery-for-stop-start-technology.pdf
Modeling and Validation of 12V Lead-Acid Battery for StopStart Technolog

As you can see in the above link, it takes complex models to make good predictions and all of the data says parallel connections makes things worse.
 
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Thread Starter

corporal_Canada

Joined Oct 17, 2024
138
No, it doesn't because a LA battery is not a perfect black-box (some chemisteries other than Lead-Acid are close) for energy. It's electrochemistry and Lead-Acid redox is not linear like a simple electronic circuit theory component.
They would be parallel at the battery terminals, not internally.

View attachment 336765
https://www.epa.gov/sites/default/f...ad-acid-battery-for-stop-start-technology.pdf
Modeling and Validation of 12V Lead-Acid Battery for StopStart Technolog

As you can see in the above link, it takes complex models to make good predictions and all of the data says parallel connections makes things worse.
well you saw my total, i eed 16,800 watts..(just for AC) so regardless i will need more than 1 lifepo4 battery i dont think there is 1 battery that has 12v 1400 amps... and now IF a 1400 amp lifepo4 existed i would feel extremely afraid to use it....it would need to be a big multiple battery bank that china does sell via alibaba during daylight hours i will need to collect enough wattage to run my AC until the next sunrise and small additional things, furthermore those big lifepo4 battery banks on alibaba has a built i inverter and im certain it wont be puresine..... and i wont know its peak wattage.. i know im dumb.. heck im downright Polish in heritage (Gombyn, Poland so no im not being racist or clever) but those Polish roots raised me to do an engine swap in my dead 91 toyota tercel by myself so im .. sorry i mean i know im sorta dumb but i uderstand DC power sufficiently to know how to do certain things .... kk im droning on ....
 

nsaspook

Joined Aug 27, 2009
16,346
well you saw my total, i eed 16,800 watts..(just for AC) so regardless i will need more than 1 lifepo4 battery i dont think there is 1 battery that has 12v 1400 amps... and now IF a 1400 amp lifepo4 existed i would feel extremely afraid to use it....it would need to be a big multiple battery bank that china does sell via alibaba during daylight hours i will need to collect enough wattage to run my AC until the next sunrise and small additional things, furthermore those big lifepo4 battery banks on alibaba has a built i inverter and im certain it wont be puresine..... and i wont know its peak wattage.. i know im dumb.. heck im downright Polish in heritage (Gombyn, Poland so no im not being racist or clever) but those Polish roots raised me to do an engine swap in my dead 91 toyota tercel by myself so im .. sorry i mean i know im sorta dumb but i uderstand DC power sufficiently to know how to do certain things .... kk im droning on ....
Now you are starting to sound strange (so many misconceptions) by fixating at 12vdc for high power. This IMO means you are not serious about actual solutions.

Big lifepo4 batteries all have active BMS systems to equalize cells and protect the battery. You can safely make large Ah banks with series parallel connections.

https://szelite.en.made-in-china.co...0ah-Solar-Batteries-12V-1200ah-Batteries.html
https://cdn.enfsolar.com/z/pp/9edne0hs516/51.2V-1200AH-Datasheet.pdf
 
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sparky 1

Joined Nov 3, 2018
1,218
The answer is simple. We don't make the decisions regarding planned obsolescence of battery products.
A rechargeable battery will recharge so many times. Eventually the flow slows and you buy new batteries.
AC Sinewave current flows back and forth with resonance, it should discourage harmonics, Smart grid
means continuing to make smart decisions. The grid will continue to flow if it is maintained.
 
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Thread Starter

corporal_Canada

Joined Oct 17, 2024
138
Now you are starting to sound strange (so many misconceptions) by fixating at 12vdc for high power. This IMO means you are not serious about actual solutions.

Big lifepo4 batteries all have active BMS systems to equalize cells and protect the battery. You can safely make large Ah banks with series parallel connections.

https://szelite.en.made-in-china.co...0ah-Solar-Batteries-12V-1200ah-Batteries.html
https://cdn.enfsolar.com/z/pp/9edne0hs516/51.2V-1200AH-Datasheet.pdf
my apologies if i sound "strange" i still dont have answer as to what gets damaged if i remain on 12V... however my thinking is that if the inverter promises 3000 watts peak.. then it should deliver 3000 watts when i need it to... same applies if i buy a Buick from India.. its marketed at lets say 200 lbs of torque... then i expect said buick to give me that 200 lbs of torque going up a steep incline..... im sorry if my mentality differs from yours but im doing what i can with what little i know about all this DC stuff

PS, yes i said INDIA.. no need to get upset, its no secret that with capitalism, you want cheaper production.. and india is as cheap as it gets lolol.. heck the dodge caravan and the camaro were mass produced in Quebec until you guys got fed up wqith the constant strikes and moved to Ontario....
hmm maybe thats whty the camaro big hood was such an iconic car in Quebec during the 80's, cheap to get and locally produced....
 
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Thread Starter

corporal_Canada

Joined Oct 17, 2024
138
i have seen a 12v 500ah battery... it looks big enough.. but wouldnt the real thing weigh 300 lbs ??? it claims to only weigh 45kg.... that is just shy of 100 pounds.... sorry for my suspicion.. but im new to capitalism and scams.... .. no im not saying Canada all has a clean white shirt.. but typically.. you actually receive what the photo and description shows.... ... so 12x500 that is a sweet 6000 watts.... .... not too bad...i look forward to your cryptic output

price 6,680 php.. converted to USD that is 113.81
 

Thread Starter

corporal_Canada

Joined Oct 17, 2024
138
The answer is simple. We don't make the decisions regarding planned obsolescence of battery products.
A rechargeable battery will recharge so many times. Eventually the flow slows and you buy new batteries.
AC Sinewave current flows back and forth with resonance, it should discourage harmonics, Smart grid
means continuing to make smart decisions. The grid will continue to flow if it is maintained.
thank you.. some of that made sense to me... however doesnt lifepo4 batteries expire alot faster than SLA ? i believe 1000 charges and either the lifepo4 goes flat or just doesnt hold capacity anymore
 

Thread Starter

corporal_Canada

Joined Oct 17, 2024
138
Now you are starting to sound strange (so many misconceptions) by fixating at 12vdc for high power. This IMO means you are not serious about actual solutions.

Big lifepo4 batteries all have active BMS systems to equalize cells and protect the battery. You can safely make large Ah banks with series parallel connections.

https://szelite.en.made-in-china.co...0ah-Solar-Batteries-12V-1200ah-Batteries.html
https://cdn.enfsolar.com/z/pp/9edne0hs516/51.2V-1200AH-Datasheet.pdf
im sorry, "paralel connections" ? i was under the impression that you are against paralel
please say it as simply as possible because i do collect ALL valuable advice, what should i do to live completely OFF the city grid ? i want to run my AC which is rated at 700 watts and quite possibly a crypto miner that pulls in the neighourhood of 3000 watts an hour.. and run said pc for 24 hours
and of course my own gaming laptop which pulls roughly 250 watts an hour...... maybe a petite fridge ?( it is rated at 55watts but i did plug in a wattmeter to peak at its pull and i saw 300 watts for 1 minte, maybe that was the evaporator, condensor doing its thing).. boil water to make coffee.. sorry but after doing the math.. it turns out that this island pays 0.25 per kw of electricity.. thats higher than the states.....
yeah.. i wanna unplug everything and go completely OFF grid...
 

Thread Starter

corporal_Canada

Joined Oct 17, 2024
138
well, seems youve all lost interest in my thread so i will abandon this thread, i want to say thank you all for your help to this point, i will simply say adieux (goodbye in French)
 

Thread Starter

corporal_Canada

Joined Oct 17, 2024
138
small update, Canada Post is still on strike and the boat stopped 200 km away from Asia.. so no awesome laptop yet.. but been usig the cyberpower PFC puresine since and the mini pc is doing great... no shocks or buzzes whenever i touch the metal frame of said pc.. im a happy dude
 

BobTPH

Joined Jun 5, 2013
11,557
From google:
"Adieu" is the singular form of the word meaning "goodbye" while "adieux" is the plural form, essentially meaning "farewells" when used in a sentence; so, if you are saying goodbye to one person, you would say "adieu," but if you are saying goodbye to multiple people, you would say "adieux".
 

Thread Starter

corporal_Canada

Joined Oct 17, 2024
138
I thought it was “Au revoir”. Or, "Adieu".
CORRECT... however adieu is more like a permanent or long term goodbye in French or in Quebec only.. as for if there is an X or not, my father took me out of elementary school for 6 months for a trip through Asia and i cant help but feel that i missed out on alot
as for your choice in languages.. French because you would still be part of UK had it ot been for assistance from France (im assuming you are from US).. and Spanish welll lets just say the big wall that the orange guy built aint doing sh!t :)
 

MrAl

Joined Jun 17, 2014
13,720
CORRECT... however adieu is more like a permanent or long term goodbye in French or in Quebec only.. as for if there is an X or not, my father took me out of elementary school for 6 months for a trip through Asia and i cant help but feel that i missed out on alot
as for your choice in languages.. French because you would still be part of UK had it ot been for assistance from France (im assuming you are from US).. and Spanish welll lets just say the big wall that the orange guy built aint doing sh!t :)
Yeah I forgot a lot since then anyway ha ha.
But it's funny you should say that about the thing that was 'built'. If it was not doing anything, then why did the next guy "open" everything. There would be no need to if the built thing did nothing.
 
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