Line array directional sound

Thread Starter

Tryui

Joined Sep 20, 2021
125
good evening gentlemen here I am with regard to the projectors I solved thanks to you but I will explain in another post. Now I have had this problem for a long time, in lratica I want to create a directional speaker, at first I chose ultrasound as acouspade but those products cost too much, so some friends recommended line arrays to direct the sound. unfortunately they made me understand that they are difficult to drive and you need a higher level electronics but ik internet I discovered that directivity is a physical matter because being close to each other the speakers create a cylindrical wave and not a circular one. unfortunately I don't know how to do it, can you help me?
 

djsfantasi

Joined Apr 11, 2010
8,442
I’m watching this thread, as I have an interest in whatever solution you come up with. As of now, I have been in consultation with Holosonics to use their speakers. I’ve budgeted for 10-12 of their product.
 

Thread Starter

Tryui

Joined Sep 20, 2021
125
I’m watching this thread, as I have an interest in whatever solution you come up with. As of now, I have been in consultation with Holosonics to use their speakers. I’ve budgeted for 10-12 of their product.
but holsonics makes ultrasonic speakers, and they cost too much, those are the best, I was talking about these line arrays instead, which are midrange speakers
 

Thread Starter

Tryui

Joined Sep 20, 2021
125
I this time, I want to finish quickly and therefore I want to know if they are directional and if so, recommend a good product
 

Thread Starter

Tryui

Joined Sep 20, 2021
125
The last I recall reading about, was maybe 6 years ago or more in Elektor magazine. It was a basic implementation.
yes yes it is a technology of many years ago but the huygens-fresnel effect is fisicon so I believe that contrary to what they say it is not about electronics but physics. So you tell me they're directive?
 

atferrari

Joined Jan 6, 2004
4,647
yes yes it is a technology of many years ago but the huygens-fresnel effect is fisicon so I believe that contrary to what they say it is not about electronics but physics. So you tell me they're directive?
It was an array of transducers(¿?) you could aim to somebody in a group. All that I recall.
 

Thread Starter

Tryui

Joined Sep 20, 2021
125
It was an array of transducers(¿?) you could aim to somebody in a group. All that I recall.
no no you are getting confused, what you are talking about is ultrasound technology (holosonics). Instead I am talking about line arrays which are simple midrange speakers placed one above the other to form a line, in this way they are able to form a cylindrical sound wave. Anyway you find everything on the internet, or I just want to know if they can direct the sound well, like holosonics, and which are the best models to buy
 

Thread Starter

Tryui

Joined Sep 20, 2021
125
what i want to know is if buying one, can i have directivity? on another forum they told me that the issue of electronics is very complicated because all the frequencies of the spectrum must be in phase, but on the internet I read that electronics have nothing to do with it, but the fresnel effect is a matter of physical effect, what do you think?
 

LowQCab

Joined Nov 6, 2012
2,309
Line-Array Speakers can work very well,
BUT, they are not "absolute".
There is no way to "eliminate" the sounds going in all directions,
although they will be "reduced" quite a bit.

Go buy a good set of Headphones, it will save You a lot of trouble.

Well designed Horn-Loudspeakers can be made extremely directional,
but they get very big with lower-Frequencies, ( below ~1khz ).

Frequencies below ~100hz can NOT be made directional,
( unless they are the size of a small office building ).
.
.
.
 

Thread Starter

Tryui

Joined Sep 20, 2021
125
Line-Array Speakers can work very well,
BUT, they are not "absolute".
There is no way to "eliminate" the sounds going in all directions,
although they will be "reduced" quite a bit.

Go buy a good set of Headphones, it will save You a lot of trouble.

Well designed Horn-Loudspeakers can be made extremely directional,
but they get very big with lower-Frequencies, ( below ~1khz ).

Frequencies below ~100hz can NOT be made directional,
( unless they are the size of a small office building ).
.
.
.
wow thank you so much for your reply, mom can i jsare headphones due to the civid as hi explained in my previous "projector" thread. however I don't care that we are absolute, for that there are ultrasounds, but I'll buy those later, I am now interested in line arrays, moreover is it possible to increase their directivity mechanically or electronically? another question, you talked about horn speakers and you tell me that they are very directional, I need them for speech and not for music, with frequencies above 5000 Hz. At this point you tell me which of the two are better, at horn or line array, for a budget of up to 300 euros, and for a distance from the target of less than 2 meters
 

LowQCab

Joined Nov 6, 2012
2,309
Speech goes down to at least ~200hz.
With nothing below 5khz, speech would be very difficult, or impossible to understand.

For "close-in" usage, You will need around ~12 to ~20, ~3" Full-Range-Drivers in a CURVED CABINET
The Cabinet should be at least as tall as the distance from your Head to the Cabinet,
and preferably twice as tall as the distance from your Head to the Cabinet.
More Drivers is always better.
When the Cabinets are installed, and positioned,
each Driver should be exactly the same distance to your Ears, ( or as close as possible ).

What is the distance-range that the Speakers will be from the listener ?
Does the distance from the speakers, to the listener, ever change ?
Will the listener be seated, or standing / walking-around ?
Will there be multiple listeners ?, or just one listener ?
Does the Room have Sound deadening materials on the walls ?, please give an exact description.
What types of noises are in the room ?
What is the size of the room ?
Why does the sound need to be so directional ?
Can You hang the Cabinet from the Ceiling ?
Is the Sound in Stereo ?
What type of equipment is producing the sound ?
How much Power is available to drive the Speakers ?
Does the listener have hearing problems ?

If You will give exact details of what problem You are trying to solve, I can give more exact answers.
.
.
.
 

Thread Starter

Tryui

Joined Sep 20, 2021
125
Speech goes down to at least ~200hz.
With nothing below 5khz, speech would be very difficult, or impossible to understand.

For "close-in" usage, You will need around ~12 to ~20, ~3" Full-Range-Drivers in a CURVED CABINET
The Cabinet should be at least as tall as the distance from your Head to the Cabinet,
and preferably twice as tall as the distance from your Head to the Cabinet.
More Drivers is always better.
When the Cabinets are installed, and positioned,
each Driver should be exactly the same distance to your Ears, ( or as close as possible ).

What is the distance-range that the Speakers will be from the listener ?
Does the distance from the speakers, to the listener, ever change ?
Will the listener be seated, or standing / walking-around ?
Will there be multiple listeners ?, or just one listener ?
Does the Room have Sound deadening materials on the walls ?, please give an exact description.
What types of noises are in the room ?
What is the size of the room ?
Why does the sound need to be so directional ?
Can You hang the Cabinet from the Ceiling ?
Is the Sound in Stereo ?
What type of equipment is producing the sound ?
How much Power is available to drive the Speakers ?
Does the listener have hearing problems ?

If You will give exact details of what problem You are trying to solve, I can give more exact answers.
.
.
.
then the distance varies between 2 and 1 meter but slightly, the room is a normal room with noise (cars passing outside), so run around 30-40 db. the listener is always one. the room has no sound absorbers and the listener is always standing, the listener has no hearing problems and the speaker I do not hang from the ceiling, for the power I do not know, but I want it to be portable, I hope I have clarified
 

Thread Starter

Tryui

Joined Sep 20, 2021
125
Speech goes down to at least ~200hz.
With nothing below 5khz, speech would be very difficult, or impossible to understand.

For "close-in" usage, You will need around ~12 to ~20, ~3" Full-Range-Drivers in a CURVED CABINET
The Cabinet should be at least as tall as the distance from your Head to the Cabinet,
and preferably twice as tall as the distance from your Head to the Cabinet.
More Drivers is always better.
When the Cabinets are installed, and positioned,
each Driver should be exactly the same distance to your Ears, ( or as close as possible ).

What is the distance-range that the Speakers will be from the listener ?
Does the distance from the speakers, to the listener, ever change ?
Will the listener be seated, or standing / walking-around ?
Will there be multiple listeners ?, or just one listener ?
Does the Room have Sound deadening materials on the walls ?, please give an exact description.
What types of noises are in the room ?
What is the size of the room ?
Why does the sound need to be so directional ?
Can You hang the Cabinet from the Ceiling ?
Is the Sound in Stereo ?
What type of equipment is producing the sound ?
How much Power is available to drive the Speakers ?
Does the listener have hearing problems ?

If You will give exact details of what problem You are trying to solve, I can give more exact answers.
.
.
.
as far as the cabinet dimensions are concerned, I would not want them to be too excessive (less than 1 meter) because I would like it to be portable, for the quantity of drivers there is no problem, and moreover I can even get closer than a meter to the cabinet,
 

Thread Starter

Tryui

Joined Sep 20, 2021
125
Speech goes down to at least ~200hz.
With nothing below 5khz, speech would be very difficult, or impossible to understand.

For "close-in" usage, You will need around ~12 to ~20, ~3" Full-Range-Drivers in a CURVED CABINET
The Cabinet should be at least as tall as the distance from your Head to the Cabinet,
and preferably twice as tall as the distance from your Head to the Cabinet.
More Drivers is always better.
When the Cabinets are installed, and positioned,
each Driver should be exactly the same distance to your Ears, ( or as close as possible ).

What is the distance-range that the Speakers will be from the listener ?
Does the distance from the speakers, to the listener, ever change ?
Will the listener be seated, or standing / walking-around ?
Will there be multiple listeners ?, or just one listener ?
Does the Room have Sound deadening materials on the walls ?, please give an exact description.
What types of noises are in the room ?
What is the size of the room ?
Why does the sound need to be so directional ?
Can You hang the Cabinet from the Ceiling ?
Is the Sound in Stereo ?
What type of equipment is producing the sound ?
How much Power is available to drive the Speakers ?
Does the listener have hearing problems ?

If You will give exact details of what problem You are trying to solve, I can give more exact answers.
.
.
.
also when you said the word "curved", I think I understand your goal, and I think we will manage to have very directional speakers
 

LowQCab

Joined Nov 6, 2012
2,309
What You want is not possible in a "portable" format.

The first thing to do is a complete room treatment,
lots of heavy, thick, sound absorbing materials everywhere,
especially in all 8 corners of the room.
This, while being VERY important, is certainly not going to be portable.

"Less than 1-Meter" tall is less than half the size necessary,
floor to ceiling height will be necessary if the listener is more
than 2-Meters away from the speakers.

Is this for a commercial / promotional display ?
You still haven't explained the basic problem you are trying to solve.
.
.
.
 

MisterBill2

Joined Jan 23, 2018
12,678
The alternative to a curved enclosure is an array of phase shifters, and that gets very complex very quickly.
Also, just because you want something does not mean that it is possible, especially for a reasonable cost. The truth is that not everything that can be imagined can be obtained. Except in the Kingdom of Utopia. Which we can not enter, nor even observe.
 
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