I like your idea with the plastic bucket. but they would take up to much room on my sled when dragging it out on the ice. i'm trying to keep everything compact. i thought about wrapping the batteries in something to insulate them... or incorporate them into the foam itself, hoping the residual heat from them operating would keep them warm enough. i need to get in the garage and start frankensteining stuff and see where i go. They dont let me do to much here at work. Yarrr

 

More about batteries - found this helpful .pdf file:
http://www.racom.net/Downloads/NiMH_NiCd Battery_Comparison.pdf

I found it quite interesting that NiMH batteries don't hold up as well as NiCD batteries at low temps.

OK, if buckets won't work for you, perhaps you can find some kind of semi-rigid plastic sheet that you could roll into a cone shape to keep the hole open, and cram insulation in the top. Just a thought.

 

i guess i wont know how i'm going to do it all until i get out there and see how things go. I'm trying to get out this week/weekend and get everything together. Thats a good find on the batery list. I havent had much time this morning to reasearch ideas on this... been looking at my lures i want to buy. That and harassing my boss about how much better of a fisherman i am.

 

LOL!

Another idea - an inverted plastic traffic cone. The ones I'm thinking of are very flexible, and the surface is pretty slick when they're new. A bit of auto wax would make them even slicker. You can fold them down pretty flat on your sled. You could cut off the top if you wanted to so that the now-bottom was open, or maybe put something heavy in it to keep it held down on the ice.

 

I've had a problem here with those getting so cold they break right apart. Think liquid nitrogen. Last winter there was one frozen to the ground and i grabbed the lip with one hand to pick it up and it broke right in two. Then i dropped it and it broke to pieces. Apparently it didnt like -20. I could still go with that though. If it break it breaks. You in the mil to?

 

You in the mil to?

I've been out a number of years. Miss it though.

Well, if a traffic cone is inverted, and down in the water, it'll tend to conduct heat up from the warmer water below. The inverted bottom could freeze though, as it'll be resting on the surface of the ice - or elevated if the hole is small.

Maybe if you had a decent layer of insulation over it, and around the perimeter, it would keep it warm enough so it would stay flexible, and keep the hole from icing over without any additional heat. It's worth a try or two, and it's cheap.

What do traffic cones cost, like 5 bucks? You can get them in a couple of sizes at Big Orange and Big Blue hardware stores.

 

The shop has one or 40. I'm sure i could just take the junk ones out. Plus, being orange, it would help others see them easier.

 

Here is something you can try. Put a tea lamp inside a cardboard box turned upside down. The cardboard box must be big enough to cover the tea lamp and the stick. And also so high that the tea lamp do not set fire to the cardboard. It is amazing how much energy some tea lamps create. It should keep the temperature inside the cardboard somewhat above freezing point. Remember to allow some air to pas in and out the box

 

Wrap the inside of the box with foil.

Making a foil tent, over the candle and hole, then place a box over the entire setup.

That should keep the box from setting on fire, and the air between the foil and the box is good insulation, use onlt 1 air hole, as 2 will induce too much of a draft and a slight breeze could extiguish the flame.

That is a good idea.

Candles have much higher energy density than an equivalent size/weight battery.

 

Hmm - a small kerosene lamp (like a railroad lantern) with the wick turned down low would be much more resistant to getting blown out than a tea light candle.

 

Hmm - a small kerosene lamp (like a railroad lantern) with the wick turned down low would be much more resistant to getting blown out than a tea light candle.

The tae lamp will be well protected inside a cardboard box turned upside down. And the price and weight will be more easy to handle

 

So it is the overnight hours we are working with, right? There's a lot more energy involved due to both time and temperature. I like the candle power idea. I used to have a backpacking candle lamp that burned for 8+ hours. The candle was about 1.25 in by 3.5 inches. Maybe one of those Y2K Emergency candles you still have lying around the house.
Maybe cutting the paint bucket down to 6 - 8 inches so that the bucket is slightly submerged and some small holes in top couple inches of the bucket for feeding the candle(s).

 

Tea light candles generally burn for less than an hour.

The old heat tabs in C-rations would burn for maybe 20 minutes.

I don't know how much lamp oil costs nowadays, but I'm sure they're not giving it away.

You can buy a large bottle of 91% isopropyl alcohol at Wally World for around $2, but 9% of it is water. Don't know how that would work with a wick, but suspect not very well.

Gasoline is out of the question; too hazardous.

 

I suspect the lantern oil will be far to thick at those temps, but only a test (or research) will let you know.

Emergency 8hr candles are pretty good.

Here is a 1.5" x 2", 12 Hour candle, made in the USA for .30 cents.
http://www.dollardays.com/i532648-wholesale-mainstays-orange-grove-scented-12-hr-votive-candle.html

If you are sleeping more than 12hours, WAKE UP!

Also, the candle will also heat up in this box, which will lead to higher wax temperature, and faster burning.

It sitting on the ice may negate some of this, but only a test will tell.

And at 30cents, It aint expensive to test.

 

Gasoline is out of the question; too hazardous.

Hah! Reminds me of some of my favorite Wisconsin stories.

Most common last words in Wisconsin: "Hold my beer and watch this!"

 

You need to get 6 or 10 sheets of 4'x8' particle board. Assemble them into a box with an open bottom. May require some 2x4 bracing, drywall screws, etc. A human sized door is a frequent add on.

Drill hole in ice.

Put box over hole

Install a propane heater inside box, being sure to leave a vent so you do not suffocate from CO poisoning, or lack of oxygen.

Then both hole and fisherman are ice free!

Otherwise, The foam + automotive light bulb + SLA 12V battery would keep the hole toasty warm, and the light may attract fish. You'll need to keep the batteries on a piece of wood so they don't freeze down, as they'll need to be hauled home and charged each day.

 

Install a propane heater inside box

In cold weather you will not even be able to ignite a propane heater. The gas will stay liquid

 

I still like the idea of a passive plug, as opposed to any active (electrical) system. The chief disadvantage of a plug is the risk of the plug freezing into the hole. All the talk of candles got me thinking: How about a wax plug? I picture a big fat candle -as fat as the hole - with a slight taper opposite the normal taper direction. Like a rubber stopper you use in the lab, just big.

It wouldn't sink, you could even light a wick on the top of it. I don't think the ice could trap it, since there is zero adhesion of water to wax. You could melt a weight (sand?) into it to give it just the right buoyancy to plug a hole without sinking.

 

Wayneh,
That was the idea with the paint bucket, but our OP objected to the amount of space it would take on their sled. A wax plug would very likely work well, but it would be rather heavy as well as bulky. That's why I hit on the traffic cone idea, as they can be flattened pretty easily.

I was thinking some more about insulation cap; it should extend outwards from the perimeter of the hole just as far as the ice is thick in order to keep the size of the hole from changing. So, if the ice is 4" thick, the insulation disk would need to be about 8" larger in diameter than the hole.

 

Yes, I was definitely following up on the "plug" concept. I must be missing something: What's the diameter of the hole? I was thinking auger-sized, maybe 6" max. Just how big CAN the solution be? I was picturing a plug no larger than the size of a stack of ~100 CD's.

When you say cap, does that include something that displaces the water in the hole? Because I think water in the hole will freeze from contact with the surrounding ice, which might be 10 below. Convection won't be enough(?) for the water in the hole to refresh from the warmer sink below.