Once again I've been complaining to Sonos about the amateurish design of Sonos's products and software. But I'd like to ask a question, why is there almost never any option to cycle the power on MPU based devices? We are told over and over in 2023 that we must pull cables out to effect a power cycling but this is dumb, for dummies who can't design.

Why not a simple push button that interrupts a system (NMI?) that causes a simple electrical circuit (relay etc?) to cut the raw AC power, wait X seconds then reconnect it again?

This is surely trivial and safer and could also be used programmatically too, that is a device could choose to cycle its own power sometimes, perhaps after certain kinds of updates and so on. Shouldn't such a concept be like taken for granted when designing home appliances that contain an MCU? Why are we even discussing this, it seems like so obvious.

Do any products do this, because Sonos certainly don't.

 

That would cost an extra nickel of profit, so that root cause of it missing, is not an hardware engineering problem for what should be a rare event.

 

It's much less of a problem when you have switched mains sockets.

 

How to fix Sonos - Sonos not working?

Glad I have just a traditional wired sound system to a dependable hardwired networked receiver.
https://forum.allaboutcircuits.com/threads/ht-old-home-theater-rebuild.183659/post-1709673

The old Sonos version looks pretty solid inside.

Both over and under-engineered.

 

In the case of Sonos many of their problem resolution guides end up with a "reboot" at some stage.

Error 1101.

by unplugging it from power, waiting ten seconds, then plugging it back in.

by unplugging them from power, waiting ten seconds, and reconnecting them to power.

The disconnect from the AC, delay ten seconds and reconnect to AC is EXACTLY the kind of operation MCUs and modern electronics are rather good at, shame manufacturer's don't care.

 

It's much less of a problem when you have switched mains sockets.

So you spend a few bucks for a switched socket, so the manufacturer could save a few nickels.

I have my larger electronics (TVs, audio systems, Blu Ray players, etc.) on WiFi plugs (one per set of devices), and only turn them on (with Alexa) when I'm using them, since it bugs me to have them otherwise staring at me with the pilot light on, indicating they are part of the main's vampire crowd.
Of course, the WiFi plugs take a small amount of power instead, so I don't know how much I'm really saving (if any), but it still eliminates the annoyance factor.

 

In the case of Sonos many of their problem resolution guides end up with a "reboot" at some stage.

Error 1101.




The disconnect from the AC, delay ten seconds and reconnect to AC is EXACTLY the kind of operation MCUs and modern electronics are rather good at, shame manufacturer's don't care.

The general problem with easy networked remote total AC power cycling is the DDOS threat. A power switch is always a nice touch.

 

So you spend a few bucks for a switched socket, so the manufacturer could save a few nickels.

Actually, unswitched sockets are so rare here that they cost more than switched sockets.

 

The general problem with easy networked remote total AC power cycling is the DOS threat. A power switch is always a nice touch.
View attachment 291262View attachment 291263

Indeed, far more devices should have a connector like that one above with the red switch, you'd think we were asking to land man on Mars, all we want is a f*****g switch, Sonos and all the rest, are you listening? do you even give a *%@*

 

My take is that any product that needs to have the main power reset by plug pulling often enough for that to be an inconvenience is a prime candidate for some variety of recycling. So thanks for the warning about "Sonos " brand products. Some organizations do produce nothing worth owning.

 

My take is that any product that needs to have the main power reset by plug pulling often enough for that to be an inconvenience is a prime candidate for some variety of recycling. So thanks for the warning about "Sonos " brand products. Some organizations do produce nothing worth owning.

That accounts for most PC Windows based computers.

https://community.microcenter.com/discussion/2910/how-to-power-cycle-your-computer

How to Power Cycle your computer

1. Turn off your computer
2. Unplug the power cable to the computer from the back
3. Hold the power button of your computer while it is unplugged for 30 seconds and then release
4. Plug the power cable back into the computer
5. Power on the computer
6. Check for any changes

 

That accounts for most PC Windows based computers.

https://community.microcenter.com/discussion/2910/how-to-power-cycle-your-computer

How to Power Cycle your computer

1. Turn off your computer
2. Unplug the power cable to the computer from the back
3. Hold the power button of your computer while it is unplugged for 30 seconds and then release
4. Plug the power cable back into the computer
5. Power on the computer
6. Check for any changes

Any Windows PC I've ever built or used has a solid mechanical switch situated right on the PSU where the power cable gets plugged in, just switching that off and on will do the trick - surely?

 

Any Windows PC I've ever built or used has a solid mechanical switch situated right on the PSU where the power cable gets plugged in, just switching that off and on will do the trick - surely?

Most but not all have a PS switch.

Lot's of server class machines don't have a AC power switch.
https://docs.oracle.com/cd/E56388_01/html/E56396/gldvf.html
Remove Power
To completely remove power from the server, disconnect the AC power cables from the back of the server.

This might be necessary to perform a cold reset, or to place it in a non-powered state for cold servicing.

 

MOST of us do not have a windows server at home.

 

MOST of us do not have a windows server at home.

I'm in that group, I have servers at home but no Windows servers at home.

The surplus server machines on the market now are well suited to technical/engineering computing because of 24/7 design, redundancy, error correction and compute horsepower. I'll never go back to using PC style hardware designed for office or gaming.

A total Power cycling requirement is IMO more about poor software design on good hardware. I've had old hardware like this running windows that crashed all the time but running Linux the 24/7 uptime is measured in decades with shutdowns and reboots all being scheduled.
https://www.networkcomputing.com/networking/review-hp-proliant-dl140

up 4606 days, 06:36:56 | since Sun Jul 20 08:28:48 2008

 

I run a couple Windows computers and can't recall the last time one crashed (perhaps back when I was running Windows 95 or 98).
Does it even still do the "Blue Screen of Death"?

 

Windows is much better now, it's less likely to crash (Blue, Black, Red screens of death) but it now just runs like molasses (was not responsive) until a reboot.