Whyyyyy????!?!?!?!??

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Jimmeh30, Oct 20, 2012.

  1. Jimmeh30

    Thread Starter New Member

    Mar 4, 2011
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    SO... this REALLY annoy's me ( like a noisy noise annoys an oyster)


    It "should" be really easy to "normalise" (normalize???? That annoys me too :) ) the audio from your set top box, between ads and the program you're watching because there is information in the transmition ( you see it sometimes in the top of the screen, it looks a little like a binary count, but not really) yet no one has come out with a device that can "normalize" the volume of the ads, let alone mute them.

    BUT, the kicker is, even tho I've searched long and hard to find an mp3 player that can "normalize" songs in a PLAYLIST, it has proven to be a wasted enterprise. Some will convert them and normalize them on the way, some won't, but given that we live in the age we do, with many and varied sources for our music collections, how is it that NO ONE has come up with a player that can normalize ANY input given?

    I realise (YES, I live in Aus and refuse to spell in American English, much as I refuse to pronounce it sodder, when in fact it is soul-der), that this is more of a programming question than it is an electronics question.

    But still... it ****'s me to tears

    Anyone got any ideas, perhaps we could start a company and knock these things out.
    I can't be the only one who gets the ****'s with turning the volume up and down when all my flatmates are asleep while I'd rather stay up listening to tunes and knocking up experiments in the lounge room ?


    OR, am I? :eek:
     
  2. nsaspook

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    Aug 27, 2009
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  3. Jimmeh30

    Thread Starter New Member

    Mar 4, 2011
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    Orright, just had another search and found a proggy that'll normalize mp3's/mp4's.

    Don't know what I was searching for last time, but clearly it was not the best criteria.

    However, the argument still stands for TV/CD/DVD/(insert relevant RCA input here).

    Surely, someone could knock out a normalizer for a range of inputs between the amp and the raft of input devices? Maybe a DSP chip? that's all a bit beyond me.

    Chuck in a couple of analog switches, probably with limit settings via remote control, bugger off the inputs on your amp and plug in, like a mixer only intelligent, such that for Eg: if you switch between channels on free to air tv, it samples and normalizes the sound before sending it on to the amp.

    meh... chuck in idea's if ya want, I haven't (in case you've not realised) thought, this through beyond the initial.

    But, it should exist already, and I fail to see why it doesn't
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2012
  4. Jimmeh30

    Thread Starter New Member

    Mar 4, 2011
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    nsaspook.. Yeah I've seen metadata and know what it is loosely, but, here in Brisbane, Qld, Aus, when ya throw from channel "7mate" to say channel "gem" the variance in volume is bordering on astronomical.

    I admit, my first question was ill conceived and am now looking at several programs I can pay for to fix my MP3 problem, but in reality, what I'd like to see is a device that could take all inputs and preamp them to a set level before the amplifier's output, preferably with a "mix function" such that you could listen to tunes while playing for eg, you're xbox/PS/computer/whatever else you want to...

    The chips are out there, yet this device doesn't exist!
    If I only knew how to program them ;P~
     
  5. Jimmeh30

    Thread Starter New Member

    Mar 4, 2011
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    1234567890
     
  6. nsaspook

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  7. Kermit2

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    Feb 5, 2010
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    They exist, but not as cheap affordable black boxes you can plug into your stereo and accepts any input.

    They are dedicated, purpose built devices called expander/limiters, often referred to somewhat simply as a compressor. They are found in pro Audio applications(radio/TV). The TV station can control the audio and good practice obligates them to do so, but doesn't 'require' it, excepting the modulation percentage limits.

    Commercials are INTENTIONALLY recorded and produced very 'HOT'. The audio is gain compressed and sound levels deviate very little from 100% modulation. Which is why it sounds so loud. They know you are going to take a bathroom break or get a snack and want to be sure you can hear the commercial when you move farther from the stereo/TV.

    Come up with a 'cheap' unit to do this and then get rich on the sales. :)
     
  8. maxpower097

    Well-Known Member

    Feb 20, 2009
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    I used to make DVD's and Cable TV shows. The reason the sound normalization sux is everyone sends in their own commercials at different levels. It would take a lot of time to normalize them all. Especially on lower end cable channels. As for hardware or software doing it the best I've seen at normalization is in WinMediaClassic with CCCP. Its quite amazing how well it works. Its like with the d/l movies gun shots sound real but when they talk sounds like a whisper. Started using WMC and turned on Normalization and everything sounds great gun shots sound proper to talking or a car engine.
     
  9. Jimmeh30

    Thread Starter New Member

    Mar 4, 2011
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    yeah, I did a short stint at Channel 7 studios for work exp back in 1994, learnt all about how they "compress" audio, taught me a whole lot more than I learnt working for the DJ (he called himself a "sound engineer" *cough*) that I was working for at the time did. You nailed it though...

    These days, you can buy a microchip DSP uC for 12 bux, complete with dolby code sets and mp3 decoders and a whole bunch of bells and whistles.
    can't say that I've looked far enough into it to see if they're capable of compression or decompression (lol, decompression, like the lever on the dirty old 2 stroke) but either way, the chips that are available out there are cheap, and perform all the functions that the "high end" components perform.

    maybe this isn't the forum for it, but I can't see why a unit couldn't be mass produced for around the 120 USD mark that would perform exactly as well as the "high end" units and solve all of our volume issues, worldwide, across all platforms.

    You could even supply it with a universal or "learning" remote control, such that it controlled all the BS you plug into it \0/

    how grand life would be!
     
  10. Jimmeh30

    Thread Starter New Member

    Mar 4, 2011
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    indeed maxpower!

    I know what you're saying, and in my current state of inubriation I'm not going to reply with "You USED to be the problem and ppl like you are still not paid enough to fix it!" lol

    I still don't believe you tho, given that all the ads are the same volume, yet FAR louder than the program as opposed to all the ads being up and down all over the shop, yet still louder than the program.

    I'm gonna look at winmedia again tho since you say it'll do it, cause maybe I missed a setting last time I was running it. Hate to say tho, I'm not a fan of microshaft, and certainly wouldn't buy any Ford car with "sync" in it :)
     
  11. strantor

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    Oct 3, 2010
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    I remember about 15 years ago after my parents split up, I went to go see my dad. He, having never had any spare time and now having nothing but spare time, was showing off his new kilobucks TV & surround sound "theater room" (living room). I specifically remember him going on about this thing (probably compressor, not sure) that would even out the volume of things. I remember the specific example was in movies, especially action type movies, where people might be whispering one second and then a building explodes the next second. Most people would crank up the volume to hear the whispering and then be caught off guard by the explosion (now played at max volume for the whispering) and wake the neighbor's babies. This device he had, automatically increased the volume in quiet scenes and reduced it in loud scenes. I assume it would do the same for obnoxiously loud commercials.
     
  12. maxpower097

    Well-Known Member

    Feb 20, 2009
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    On nationanal commercials yes, local commercials no. Also seems to get worse the higher channel number you go.So you must remember the good old beta days.We'd shoot a commercial in HD render it in HD, then have to have it converted to a Beta tape for it to play. Damn TV stations still couldn't take VHS or DVD
    About WMC download the CCCP codec pack. Just type in CCCP on google. Install it and you'll have win media classic. First option is sound normalization.
     
  13. loosewire

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    Apr 25, 2008
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    Become a D.J. and enjoy the ups and down of music,while you are getting paid.

    The louder the better,look at all the leverers you get to play with,plus the

    excitement of the crowd,spinning the platter...you say what's the matter.
     
  14. Audioguru

    New Member

    Dec 20, 2007
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    I think the "sound engineers" for my local FM radio and TV stations don't work there anymore. Just before they were fired a few years ago they probably cranked up the gain and audio compression to maximum and it has stayed like that ever since.

    Announcers who read the news wear a lavalier microphone on their chest that picks up the very loud vowel sounds then the compressor cuts back the level which kills all high frequency consonant sounds in speech, like an underwater throat microphone sounds like. I want to hear what the announcers' voices really sound like and hear what they say.

    If there is a pause in sounds then you can hear the background noise increase as the compressor ramps the gain up to maximum then the first couple of sounds blast through before the very slow compressor can turn down the level.

    Then sometimes the opposite happens. Some microphones have a VOX circuit that turns down the gain when the mic is fairly quiet but turns up the gain when somebody talks. But it reacts too slowly so the first part of a word is missing.

    Music with a bass beat has the higher frequency sounds and vocals modulated by the beat.
     
  15. THE_RB

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    Feb 11, 2008
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    That's just a dynamic compressor, used in pro audio like recording studios (and radio DJs) and commonly available. You can make one from a couple of opamps. Basically it's a gain control that turns up the gain on quiet stuff so everything is equally loud.

    Good commercial ones (like the one I used to have in my home recording studio) have "ducking" which also turns the gain DOWN on the loud stuff, and if dialed in too hard the ducking makes things "quack" by removing the plosives on the start of words.

    Anyway it's not that hard to do, they've been doing it since the age of tube amps. :)
     
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