Wayne Dalton 3042

Discussion in 'General Electronics Chat' started by tracecom, Jun 1, 2010.

  1. tracecom

    Thread Starter AAC Fanatic!

    Apr 16, 2010
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    Attached is a photo of a Wayne Dalton garage door opener switch for wall mounting. Tech Support at Wayne Dalton claims they never heard of it. The photo shows three views: (1) a rear view of the assembly on the left, (2) a front view of the PCB in the center, and (3) a front view of the assembly on the right.

    Does anyone have a schematic or circuit description?

    Thanks.
     
  2. Markd77

    Senior Member

    Sep 7, 2009
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    Still no idea what it does but a bit of photoshop trickery might help someone.
    There is a diode lead unconnected in my photo but you can see the trace that it should be on.

    [​IMG]
     
  3. tracecom

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    Cool Photoshop trick! I'll use that on future PCB layouts.

    Now, if someone only knew the whereabouts of technical information.
     
  4. retched

    AAC Fanatic!

    Dec 5, 2009
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    You say the manufacturer has never heard of this?
    I would get a plane ticket to China and wave the wall switch around until someone recognizes it. Then they can show you which building it is duped in.
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2010
  5. tracecom

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    It was just one customer support rep that said she had never heard of it. As a matter of fact, it was another Dalton rep (whose name I don't know) that sent the switches to me a year ago. Now, at least two of the three switches have gone bad and Dalton claims that they only have another (less featured) version available now.

    Each wall switch has only two wires going in/out and therefore all power and signalling must be over that pair. These particular switches (when they worked) provided four functions: (1) open/close the door; (2) turn the light on/off, (3) disable/enable the entire opener, and (4) provide an LED status indication. The currently available switches provide only functions (1) and (2).

    I thought that someone here might be able to supply some technical information and maybe I could repair these. I suspect that one or more of the diodes have gone bad (since there are only diodes and resistors in the circuit) and maybe they could be replaced with something more robust, or have some protection added in some way.

    Thus far, even Google has failed to come up with any help. I can't even find a general description of how the signalling protocol between the wall switch and the door opener. It has to be relatively simple because the currently available wall switches have only two (really cheap) switches - one for door, and one (with a series resistor) for the light.
     
  6. retched

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    It would most definitely be a diode. I would start by swapping them.

    The 2 wire (if dc) may use different resistance signals to produce different results.

    I have used thermostats and actuators that relied on the same methods.

    It may be the voltage regulator in the "send" device that is gone bad. If the proper reference is not sent, the received, augmented signal will be ignored.
     
  7. BMorse

    Senior Member

    Sep 26, 2009
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    I would think those switches would fail before any of the passive components, considering it was probably just some low voltage analog switch (using resistors ladders and diodes, to get 4 functions out of 2 switches.) those switches however can usually fail after some use..... have you check to see if the switches are still making contact when the buttons are pressed??

    B. Morse
     
  8. BillB3857

    Senior Member

    Feb 28, 2009
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    I have seen circuits where an AC source operates multiple devices simply by rectifying to either a positive load, negative load or AC coupled load. Three functions on one pair at a control box. Pretty cool concept.
     
  9. tracecom

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    Apr 16, 2010
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    The screw terminals on the opener control board where the wall switches connect are marked "PB" (push button, I guess) and "COM". In addition, there is a marking that says 30vac. So, you may be right.

    At any rate, I am going to try to examine the PCB in the wall switch and attempt to draw a schematic. If I can post a schematic, someone here can probably tell me how it works.
     
  10. tracecom

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    See corrected information in a later post.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2010
  11. BillB3857

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    After a little closer look at the original pictures you posted, it looks like the Open / Close switch simply shorts the two terminals. That would be an AC short across the AC coming in. I haven't had time to do a full schematic but it does look like the "Light" switch has some kind of diode/resistor network in series with its contacts. Drawing a full schematic looks like a weekend odd job.

    On edit: What kind of problem are you having with the door? If it won't open/close, put a temporary jumper across the two terminals. If it then activates, your switch is bad.
     
  12. tracecom

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    Thanks for your input.

    Actually, I have three of these openers on three separate doors. Two of them have worked okay for a couple of years, but the third one has always been erratic. It finally began refusing to operate (intermittent) and then stopped altogether. At that point, it would flash the light in a random pattern. Since this is a weekend/vacation home, I just pulled the power plug on door number three and let it go.

    When I got around to seeing about it, I decided to swap the wall switches in an effort to isolate the problem to either the wall switch/wiring or the opener itself. In the process, I hooked up one of the wall switches backward and it quit working. At that point, I got flustered and am not sure what (stupid) move I made next. :eek:

    I finally remembered that I had another set of wall switches of a different electrical design (less featured). When I installed those (correctly), the doors began working again. So now, I have these three "deluxe" wall switches that I would like to repair and reinstall in order to have the additional features of (1) being able to disable the openers (with the on/off switch at the top) while I am gone and (2) having the LED status indicators.

    I have removed all the diodes from all three of the PCB's. D1 (at the top right in the photo) is a 5.1v zener and the others are 1N4148 signal diodes. The resistor for the LED is 47 ohms and all the other resistors are 2.61k. As it turns out, I have the necessary zeners and 1N4148's to repair all three boards, but due to the problems that I have had with these wall switches, I'm not sure it's worth the effort unless I can make them less failure-prone in the process. So, for the moment, I'm going to go cut the grass. :D

    All that being said, I still would like to understand the signalling protocol between the switches and the openers.
     
  13. retched

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    Dec 5, 2009
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    I believe it is the same as the resistor network used in keypads.

    Assigning a different resistor value to each key, the controller can figure what key was pressed by the resistance change on the input line.

    You were saying this was intermittent. If this does operate the way I am thinking it does, I believe it is the power unit causing the problem.

    To use this the way I am seeing it used, and seeing that they used 1% resistors for accuracy, an accurate reference voltage is important.

    If the reference voltage regulator is fluctuating or unsteady, when the receiver sees the changes, It will perceive them as button presses. This is most likely why the light was turning on and off randomly. The reference voltage IC was lowering voltage and the receiver was seeing that a button was pressed, which in turn would cause a voltage drop from the resistors. So in reading a lower voltage, it saw "LIGHT SWITCH BUTTON WAS PRESSED"

    That would turn on and off the light.

    If the voltage regulator is going bad, it could have fried the diodes too.

    I would see if you are getting a steady voltage on your incoming signal line.
     
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