We may be guessing for some time to come - http://www.ecnmag.com/News/2010/03/Toyota-black-box-data/

 

There was a story on the AM radio about a private firm being able to duplicate the problem with a specific kind of short between cables, with no error codes being recorded.

This next to a story about a man who has already served several years for manslaughter because his Corolla surged and killed a family. He has maintained it ran away from him (exactly as described) the entire time he was in prison. The state is seriously reviewing his case with the implication that he will be released in light of new evidence.

Sounds like the court battles are going to start heating up. In the case of the manslaughter case Toyota could be paying two plaintiffs big bucks for the same event, and if they can prove Toyota knew about the sudden acceleration problem at the time I expect HUGE punitive damages.

 

if they can prove Toyota knew about the sudden acceleration problem at the time

One other source I have seen indicates that Toyota USA has exactly one portable computer that can read out their black box codes. Toyota is hardly likely to let such data get published.

 

One other source I have seen indicates that Toyota USA has exactly one portable computer that can read out their black box codes. Toyota is hardly likely to let such data get published.

this is true. there are now 120 on order for april. toyota says they simply havent had time to roll out more black box readers to the state- while all the other car companies have had free and open access to their black boxes for almost a decade now. its a little hard to argue that toyota has been covering this up massively... theyre a japanese company anyway, its not surprising to me.

 

Describe how that pot work,besides 0-5 volt. What about pot wiper on carbon resistor changing valves,intermittantly, go beyond. Go into that curcuit like you do the 555 and do some educated guesses for thought.

 

The fault Toyota has made and is still making. Is a extremely clumsy cover up operation. instead of being more open. Toyota has laid a smoke screen over it, and presented half-truths. Toyota has caught it self in a fishing net. The more they wriggle, the more will the fish net tighten its grip. This is a classic situation.
By the way here is some links with some explanations about the drive by wire system. It might be better alternatives out on the net
http://www.picoauto.com/applications/electronic-throttle-control.html
http://www.europeantransmissions.com/Bulletin/DTC.BMW/EML-BMW.pdf

 

We have no enlightenment from the man whose Prius ran away yesterday in San Diego. His explanation - "the accelerator just didn't seem to do anything" - still leaves doubt as to the nature of the problem.

What will be interesting is that Toyota did not have that model Prius on the recall list.

 

Some question is being raised as to whether that incident might have been a stunt. The man had the presence of mind to use his cell phone, call 911, and talk with the troopers, but not to turn off the engine or shift into neutral (both actions have been recommended by Toyota).

I am sure there will be more to follow.

John

 

Looking through "news" articles, it is interesting to see that Toyota has not budged from its position that the problem is purely mechanical. Some of the accounts of acceleration problems strongly suggest that the driver was not in contact with the gas pedal when it happened.

 

Some question is being raised as to whether that incident might have been a stunt. The man had the presence of mind to use his cell phone, call 911, and talk with the troopers, but not to turn off the engine or shift into neutral (both actions have been recommended by Toyota).
I am sure there will be more to follow.
John

This story has also reached Europa. In the discussion a person said that on a Toyota Prius. Both the transmission system and the motor start/stop system are electronic controlled. So you can not put the gearbox in "N" then the accelerator is operated, or the car is rolling. And the same will apply to the stop button as prius has a engine start and stop button. Is this true?

 

This story has also reached Europa. In the discussion a person said that on a Toyota Prius. Both the transmission system and the motor start/stop system are electronic controlled. So you can not put the gearbox in "N" then the accelerator is operated, or the car is rolling. And the same will apply to the stop button as prius has a engine start and stop button. Is this true?

According to an American news report, "After the car decelerated to about 50 mph, Sikes turned off the engine and coasted to a halt."

Maybe the interlock is speed-limited? Maybe there are differences between European and American Prius's?

The incident is being investigated, and the full story is yet to be known. Suspicion, however, runs high.

John

 

The engine start/stop button only works when the car is in park. It can only be shifted into park at 0mph. There is a way to kill the engine that most owners do not know of:

You have to hold the engine off button for 4 - 10 seconds and it will kill the engine.

So like many computers, a press of the power button does nothing until you have gone to shut down, unless you hold it for a few seconds.

 

In the AP news today is a story of a new Toyota Prius where the accelerator jumped and stuck when the motorist went to pass someone.
This sounds like the tooth mesh problem originally thought to be the main cause of un-intended acceleration. The Dealer, however said his Prius was not part of the recall. Not only are these Toyota owners likely to be killed, but they are a hazard to all other motorists on the highway. The Blue book has recently lowered the re-sale value of Toyota cars.
If you have a Toyota, parking it in the garage might save your life.

Jay Leno said the other night, that it is impossible to travel 60 mph on California highways without quickly running into someone, so was this all a publicity stunt?

Regards, DPW [ Everything has limitations...and I hate limitations.]

 

Not only are these Toyota owners likely to be killed, but they . The Blue book has recently lowered the re-sale value of Toyota cars.
If you have a Toyota, parking it in the garage might save your life.
Regards, DPW [ Everything has limitations...and I hate limitations.]

I think the problem is more complex than saying all Toyota cars are a hazard to all other motorists on the highway, and that they should be parked in the garage.

 

the problem can be as complex as it wants to be though, the solution is so easy that it is absolutely criminal that toyota still hasnt done anything about it. they dont want to implement an accelerator-kill failsafe that activates when you press the brake because it would be an admission of guilt- and japanese companies never do anything wrong to begin with. i am not exaggerating about this.

this guy in san diego just had to put it in neutral. thats it. he was scared to because "he thought the car might flip over" and he also didnt try killing the ignition i believe for the same reason.

 

One critical bit of information that has not been clearly established yet is the nature of the problem. If it's a problem with the drive by wire ECU firmware, all Toyotas are simply too dangerous to drive.

If the problem is purely mechanical, something as simple as a cord tied to the gas pedal so you can yank it back to the idle position might be an effective kludge.

I have a Honda. I would be interested to know how fail safe their drive by wire firmware is.

 

Quote Duane P Wetick "If you have a Toyota, parking it in the garage might save your life."

Pushing it into your garage might save the rear wall of your garage!

Maybe Toyota has come up with a Perpetual Motion invention and is using the public to test it?

 

Added info:

During and after the incident, Sikes said he was using heavy pressure on his brake pedal at high speeds.

But the investigation of the vehicle, carried out jointly by safety officials from the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration and Toyota engineers, didn't find signs the brakes had been applied at full force at high speeds over a sustained period of time, the three people familiar with the investigation said.

The brakes were discolored and showed wear, but the pattern of friction suggested the driver had intermittently applied moderate pressure on the brakes, these people said, adding the investigation didn't find indicators of the heavy pressure described by Sikes.

It is beginning to sound more and more like the finger a lady found in her chili.

John

 

It is beginning to sound more and more like the finger a lady found in her chili.

If some agency purchases the Prius in question and drives it for testing purposes, that should tell us something. That is trying to prove a negative, though, so it may be quite difficult to make a firm determination of the lack or presence of the problem. A few thousand miles on a car having exhibited the failure should demonstrate a repeat of the runaway again, though.

 

The Prius was in fact driven extensively during the investigation, and the problem could not be duplicated. Absence of proof is not proof of absence, so I discounted that finding and did not include it in my post.

However, I think wear and heat patterns can be demonstrated as positive evidence, and the ones in this case were not considered consistent with the owner's claim. Obviously, a jury will likely decide this matter. In some cases, like the chili case, the complainant makes a deal and fesses up. Product liability in the US based on the American rule for attorney fees works in surprising ways, sometimes good and sometimes bad.

John