Power went out in the middle of the night.
Power out again, for a long time. I see work crew working on the road clearing fallen trees over power lines. Don't know when power will be back up.

 

Is this why we are having too much rain here ?

 

That's news to me. Do you have any definitive proof global temperatures are on the rise?

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.

Ask any environmental scientist. LOL Its not about is it getting warmer or colder in your area. The global warming is on a global scale so each year our global average tempature increases. According to USF its reaching the point of no return. But I know you don't have to be a scientist to see the climate change everywhere over the past 40 years. Just ask anyone over 40.

 

Quite right max.

In the UK, our summers will get warmer, but our winters will get colder. This is due to the continous supply of warm air from the Gulf streamis being forced northwards. So we are starting to get weather they have had on the continent for centuries.

 

Ask any environmental scientist. LOL Its not about is it getting warmer or colder in your area. The global warming is on a global scale so each year our global average tempature increases. According to USF its reaching the point of no return. But I know you don't have to be a scientist to see the climate change everywhere over the past 40 years. Just ask anyone over 40.

Point of no return is a bit of a hyperbole. We got ourselves into this mess, we can get ourselves out of it. There are lots of activities that lead to global cooling. Particulates for example, there was an article a while back that speculated that the reason global warming was not as big an issue as a lot of people predicted is the particulates we are dumping into the atmosphere. Google global dimming.

The big thing I think a lot of people miss is the weather is a dynamic system. It is going to shift, always, to many variables. Humans have just become one more (or lots more) variables. People don't like change, especially when it can cause food shortages and other issues. As usual, we will adapt. It is what humans do, it is why we occupy every continent on this planet, even if it is token numbers.

One good super-volcano eruption anywhere on the planet will show us how badly things can really get screwed up. Even a couple of medium ones can make a huge difference. We don't worry about it, because there isn't much we can do about it, but it is conceivable 100's of millions (or even billions) could die from food shortages.

It is a cold point of view, but I liked Heinlein's assessment. Bad times for the individual are good times for the race.

 

I didn't get hit very hard here in Boston. There was quite a bit of wind and rain, but nothing too damaging. I saw sheets of plywood blown around and a lot of small branches broken off trees, but it wasn't anywhere near as bad as they made it out to be (in Boston, anyway). I'm getting rain, wind, thunder, and lightning now, so I'm enjoying it

Hope everyone's staying safe!

 

@ Max, we didn't have cable news,the hundred year storms may have been common.

We didn't 24/7 cable news,that we have had for forty years that may be the

difference.

 

See here it used to rain in the summer everyday. Now it rains 2 weeks out of the summer otherwise drought. Winters used to get down to 0f-5f in winter and we could make sheets of ICE in Jan. Now were lucky if we get below 45f. Last year we didn't even have 1 freeze. I notice the weather patterns completely screwed but it might be because I live in a more weather variable area.

@Bill I agree change is normal, but were seeing 1000 years worth of change in 15 years. Thats not slow enough for our environment to catch up. 1 degree f raise in our seas will kill ALL out coral reefs in the world. After that the fisheries collapse. Then your gonna see massive starvation and famine. Their even predicting the extinction of the Bluefin Tuna within 10-20 years. Most of the BF scientist say we've already damaged the population beyond no return without human interference.

 

The global warming is on a global scale so each year our global average tempature increases.

And global warming/cooling has been cyclic. You only know the facts since the time of the current records.

Does anyone really know the ength of the last ICE age? What about the annual increase/decrease in temperature on a global prospective, since the formation of the earth?

The humans are a mere spec on the pimple of a knat's ass as far as their involvement with the earth.

My whole lifetime could be in a warming cycle, and it's still less than an atto-second in the lifespance of the earth.

 

We can very accurately estimate temperatures over may thousands of years ago by analysing ice from Antartica.

There is no doubt that global temperatures are increasing far faster than at anytime for thousands upon thousands of years. Wether we are the cause is still yet to be confirmed/put down for certain.

 

We can very accurately estimate temperatures over may thousands of years ago by analysing ice from Antartica.

Sure we can estimate. The earth is reported to be 4.5 - 4.6 billion years old, a minor error of about 100 million years or so. Human's counting and recording things is not very long in the overall picture.

Granted as measurement techniques improve, so will the estimation, but I don't expect that in this lifetime.

So with such a large error, the "temperature change" estimates is to be taken with a very large grain of salt.

 

JoeJester is right. Global average temperature might have changed 5 degrees over 100 million years and that is a very long time on a human scale.

The problem is we are going to witness a 2C degrees rise in 200 years (starting 130 years ago). The vast majority of those living today will have to face the consequences.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=WuY7GnmabfA

Hurricane Sandy is just one of those consequences.

 

Could it be overpopulation and mother nature is culling the human herd?

 

More like mother nature doesn't like what we are burning to make fuel.

Interestingly, the increase of temperatures matches the start of the industrial revolution.

If we can change what we use to produce energy, then I think we have a much more manageable problem. I believe we should be switching to nuclear asap, and then investing more into hydrogen powered vehicles. Sure it might take more energy to create the hydrogen atm, but using clean energy to do this isn't quite as bad as using dirty energy.

Sparky

P.S. Sorry for the confusion Joe. I thought you were saying we couldn't estimate temperatures in the distant past. But just because they are estimates, doesn't make them far from the truth - when you read your thermometer you are making an estimate, because of a variety of reasons. Still an accurate estimate though.

 

Interestingly, the increase of temperatures matches the start of the industrial revolution.

Got a reference for that? Or should we just point that the industrial nations are in the northern hemisphere and the artic polar regions are melting. There was no change in the slant angle of the earth or anything else that could have caused that event.

The accuracy of distant past readings can be suspect because there is really nothing to test the veracity of the statement. It is however, a consensus amoung the scientists using scientific discovery protocals.

The 100 million years that is the "estimate error" far exceeds humans recorded temperatures and also exceeds the "thousands and thousands of years" of estimated temperatures.

Has volcanic erruptions been completely eliminated from the sources of energy that create "global warming"?

Humans have not experienced the full cyclic nature of this earth as we haven't existed long enough. We haven't existed the error in the earth's age yet. Our recordings is much less than our entire existance lifespan.

If we can change what we use to produce energy, then I think we have a much more manageable problem. I believe we should be switching to nuclear asap, and then investing more into hydrogen powered vehicles. Sure it might take more energy to create the hydrogen atm, but using clean energy to do this isn't quite as bad as using dirty energy.

What does a more manageable problem look like? A 1C increase in temperature? Like everything else in this world, it takes cash to R&D, manufacturer, and hope the public will purchase your product.

I will agree to switching to Nuclear, but, there are alot of NIMBYs out there. Not In My Backyard ... who will muster the political resistance against any effort. If they don't want nuclear power plants in their back yard, you can damm well believe they don't want people driving around in nuclear vehicles (low yield bombs).

I know the French use nuclear generation for over 90% of their energy needs. Some countries won't jump on the nuclear energy option quickly. The US being one of them.

Last year here in TX we had over 100 days of heat exceeding 100 degrees. This year is wasn't nearly that much. In the scheme of warming/cooling, it appears we are cooler, and by extention, that should decrease the global prospective minutely.

 

The 100 million years that is the "estimate error" far exceeds humans recorded temperatures and also exceeds the "thousands and thousands of years" of estimated temperatures.

?
100 million on 4.5 billion is a error of 2.22~%
A error of 2.22~% on 400.000(Vostok)|720.000(EPICA) is 9.333,~|16.000

 

I'll dig my geography books out - we used many references and drew our own conclusions from data such as population increase, temps, dates, etc.

You are right, there are various natural things which could increase the temperature, the Milankovitch cycle is a good example. However, we currently have no models or cycles which explain such a vast increase in temps over such a short time.

I'll have a dig and find my books, I hope I haven't thrown them!

 

The evidence is there for folks who care to look, and not dismiss it out of hand. There is this impression this planet is too vast for humans to make a difference. When our population was well under a billion I would agree, but we haven't been there for a long while.

 

The Copenhagen Diagnosis 2009 is the latest report on global trends.

Some pretty impressive graphs and some dire conclusions.

No need to dig out the books Sparky. I can review the material referenced in the above report from 2009.

Will it change my mind? Who knows.

Are the dire conclusions the correct? Who knows.

If the population is too large and growing, thereby increasing the carbon emissions ... should we start killing people over the age of 30 to reduce the carbon emissions? Being almost 60, that doesn't appeal to me at all, but that certainly is a radical measure to decrease carbon emissions the amounts recommended by the report.

 

That's news to me. Do you have any definitive proof global temperatures are on the rise?

Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.

So Ernie, still not convinced that the intensity of Hurricane Sandy had anything to do with global warming?

How are you coping?