Sorry, fixed.

 

I think the recent storm disaster in the northeast US should make us pause to think of what is generating our power in the future.

While power plants are subject to damage from natural disaster they can bounce back fairly quickly.

I have heard no mention of how the wind farms along the coast did in the storm.

Of course as we learned in Japan, nuclear is prone to disaster too.

 

Apples and oranges though, while we will always need power plants, it was infrastructure, not the power plants, that shut the east coast down. We need to modernize our power grid.

What you are referring to is building codes, which in a way is the problem with the infrastructure, it is old and obsolete, but vital.

 

Solar cell with world's highest conversion efficiency of 37.7% sets new record with triple-junction compound solar cell

 

Seems there have been several stories this week in Physorg.com about improvements in solar energy collection.

This article talks about fundamental changes in how it is done.
http://www.physorg.com/news199962208.html

These talk about some possible improvements.
http://www.physorg.com/news199962208.html
http://www.physorg.com/news199470067.html
http://www.physorg.com/news199441610.html

And yet more possible energy sources.
http://www.physorg.com/news200074032.html

It would be nice if some of this stuff worked out.

These are from 2010. Is there any progress being made?

 

These are from 2010. Is there any progress being made?

Sure, there's lots of progress in basic R&D and proof of concept cells but I don't see anything that will beat the basic photovoltaic technology anytime soon. The price for current panels is under $1 per watt and under $5 per watt installed residential. The installed price has shifted from bulk panel costs to permits, labor, interconnects, inverters and control devices. So while efficiency is great it won't affect the cost of generating power much at the residential level.

 

Agreed. And although it's nice to see attempt to increase efficiency of the cells, most people don't realise that's largely irrelevant.

Photovoltaics are already "efficient" enough that if you covered your entire house roof you would have a large energy surplus and could sell the surplus back to society to help run industry etc.

The one and only part of "efficiency" that matters is dollars invested per watt (or per life-watt hours). What we need is for the solar panels (OK, and installation) to be CHEAPER not more efficient.

 

Agreed. And although it's nice to see attempt to increase efficiency of the cells, most people don't realise that's largely irrelevant.

Photovoltaics are already "efficient" enough that if you covered your entire house roof you would have a large energy surplus and could sell the surplus back to society to help run industry etc.

The one and only part of "efficiency" that matters is dollars invested per watt (or per life-watt hours). What we need is for the solar panels (OK, and installation) to be CHEAPER not more efficient.

Actually, unless people need to work "off the grid", most people today simply sell to the power company. Maintenance of a large battery bank can be expensive.

I wish I had the option to place panels on my roof but I live in a townhouse complex where it would not be allowed.

Perhaps someone will invent shingles that are actually solar panels.

 

I wonder how stable the grid would be with large amounts of residential solar with little or no local storage.
Grid-tie systems assume the grid is a infinite sink for power and that's a good assumption to make as long as solar/RE is only a few percentage of the overall power but what happens when you make it a larger percentage?
The German power grid is facing this today with increased instability.
http://uk.reuters.com/article/2012/11/27/germany-energy-grid-idUKL5E8MR6QU20121127

The priority in RE research should be in energy storage because this will allow us to decentralize the grid and improve stability with current systems.
http://engineering.illinois.edu/new...ne-establish-batteries-and-energy-storage-hub

 

Interesting stuff, thanks.

The general theory has been that residential solar occurs during the day in business hours when commercial use and aircon use is highest. So ideally the residential surplus would go to support local commercial use.

I agree some improvements in energy storage are very long overdue.

 

I have listened to several PBS articles making the same points. One was the so called cheap Chinese junk is exactly what is needed for solar power to get off the ground. The guest host also made the same point about storage (on the Diane Reem show).

Thing is, both need work, if efficiencies go up while costs go down you don't need as many, and could actually afford a small array on the roof instead of the whole roof.

 

The general theory has been that residential solar occurs during the day in business hours when commercial use and aircon use is highest. So ideally the residential surplus would go to support local commercial use.

As long as supply and demand is fairly steady state this works but high supply means high risk. The current grid hardware, control systems were designed for mainly one way current flow and lots of thermal/mechanical inertia to store energy. The lack of inertia in solar power without a online backup base-load generator of equal power causes the grid control system to ramp up or down power at rates faster than the large systems were designed for. When this happens we see large swings in voltage and frequency like in Hawaii. The theory is that networked battery local storage can emulate thermal/mechanical inertia and smooth out the spikes but it's just too expensive and in-efficient now.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-hawaii-solar-20121118,0,595680.story

The Lees called one of the solar contractors racing around Hawaii these days, and put in their order. Eleven months later, in October — after endless consultations, emails and a $3,000 study required by Maui Electric Co. — they were still waiting for a permit.
"Instead of it being like they want to help you get your solar system in," Lawrence Lee said, "it's more like they don't want you to."

 

This is advance discovery and in my thinking this technology is too cheap as compare to the other technologies and provides more result as compare to other.

 

Thing is, both need work, if efficiencies go up while costs go down you don't need as many, and could actually afford a small array on the roof instead of the whole roof.

To my mind, it is not so much about efficiency of solar cells/photovoltaics. Its more about space usage, additional infrastructure etc. For example, we shall not let solar energy compete with food production as it is already the case with biofuel.

The change to alternative energies is without alternative, but I believe that a meaningful transition can only be successful if done wisely.

 

Here at this latitude 42 deg. N US, we have about 19% sun over a full solar year. Solar panels can provide enough energy to power a laptop or a coffeepot for part of the day (with government subsidies)...but for the heavy lifting (everything else) we use diesel generators.

Cheers, DPW [Everything has limitations...and I hate limitations.]

 

We don't get enough Sun in Utah Year round. We are a desert but, just isn't worth it.

 

good point!

 

Here in Australia there is windfarms allover the place & the Govt (taxpayer) is funding a big percentage of home roof top solar systems. The Big crunch with this stuff its realy feel good stuf for the Enviromentalists. It doesnt any where near suport the Base load, which here in Australia is already straining. Now we are threatend by higher power prices. My theory is its gone pear shaped since they were all privatised which involves gross payments to CEOs & investors & lack of upgrading the infrastructure which used to happen.

Here in Massachusetts a massive Wind Farm planned to be based in the shallow waters off Cape Cod was cancelled as the Late Senator...Ted Kennedy had great issue with it as he stated that lowering our consumption of Fossil Fuels as well as lowering Greeen House Emmisions must take a back seat to the much more important issue of his Families Summer Compound having a pristine veiw of the shoreline and open seawaters.

I mean...what good is saving the planet if one cannot have an unfettered veiw?

In NO WAY is this a Political Statement. I HATE all Political Parties and Supporters of such equally.

Split Infinity

 

What are the benefits of solar development and how does it affect? Basically, people as of now, are searching for some kind of solution to continue aiming less power usage. Therefore, there are many information that we are going to learn from solar development. It is about how this system can be installed and where can it placed. However, there are some matter that bother in my mind, why people keeps seeking this alternative energy source?

 

Several huge reasons. I remember seeing Trane selling a simple solar array with their air conditioners. This made a lot of sense at the time, it would not run the unit, but it would offset the costs at a time when the need was the greatest.

Ever been through rolling blackout? I have, several times. That alone makes me a fan, though I was there before it happened.

Fact is, our energy grid is vulnerable to shortages, it behooves us to look for alternates.