so your saying that my idea is not practical and can not be implemented ?

What I'm saying is that your idea doesn't make sense in the idea of applying a short circuit as that means it is no longer a short.... I'm also saying that converting electrical energy to mechanical energy is already done with fairly high efficiencies by electric motors, so your solution will probably be a variant of them ...

 

but i dont want heat i want fire

You may be vying for an award for the goofiest thing posted here this year.

Fire is the self-sustaining rapid release of energy by the chemical process of oxidation, usually using ambient oxygen to oxidize the fuel. Most useful fires require a source of ignition to start the process, after which the energy released is enough to sustain the process.

If you observed fire, think about what your fuel was - the electrical conductors in your wall outlet. Not exactly a sustainable fuel source.

What you saw was mostly an electrical arc, ionized air molecules giving up their energy in the visible spectrum.

Bottom line - you need to understand the first law of thermodynamics. You cannot expect to get more energy out of your wall than you pay for. An electric arc is not some new discovery that will allow the first law to be violated.

 

mmm ok .. well thanks for your time .. but can you tell me now that you know what im trying to do .. how can i make this circuit if i just want to try ?!

 

mmm ok .. well thanks for your time .. but can you tell me now that you know what im trying to do .. how can i make this circuit if i just want to try ?!

If you want to try to make your idea as an experiment, you can connect a battery to a wheel... just plug the two terminals directly to the wheel and observe what happens....

I think you really need to go back to physics.... or start.... that's probably a more accurate imperative....

 

so if i connect a battery directly to a wheel the wheel will move.. but will i have this "short" coming out ?!
cause what i want is to make the spark coming out the "short" chamber to work as power like the power coming out the combustion chamber

 

so if i connect a battery directly to a wheel the wheel will move.. but will i have this "short" coming out ?!
cause what i want is to make the spark coming out the "short" chamber to work as power like the power coming out the combustion chamber

This "short" you are referring to is probably meant to refer to an arc.

If this is the case, you could use it to build a sterling engine from it, but you must understand that it is very inefficient.... you would be better off using an electric motor...

 

...but you must understand that it is very inefficient....

It is inefficient and unsafe. Imagine having a battery blow apart in your face and spraying acid or whatever all over the place.

 

so if i connect a battery directly to a wheel the wheel will move.. but will i have this "short" coming out ?!
cause what i want is to make the spark coming out the "short" chamber to work as power like the power coming out the combustion chamber

What in the world are you smoking, I want some.

 

It is inefficient and unsafe. Imagine having a battery blow apart in your face and spraying acid or whatever all over the place.

Perhaps you could explain why you've mentioned a battery as I did not mention one in regards to creating a spark... Creating a spark gap inside a sterling engine piston should be relatively safe...

 

the other day i'v witnessed an electrical short coming out the socket and there was this small explosion so i was wondering if i can make a circuit can make purposely make spark in a cylinder to cause wheel motion .. that is the idea im thinking about .. so how can i make this happen

mmmmm isnt that the Internal combustion engine!

 

mmmmm isnt that the Internal combustion engine!

I thought so too...

OP said no in post #12...

 

Post #12?

Hey, don't drag me into this, I'm just an innocent bystander

 

Post #12?

Hey, don't drag me into this, I'm just an innocent bystander

Was that the reasoning behind the name?

 

.. but can you tell me now that you know what im trying to do .. how can i make this circuit if i just want to try ?!

I think I understand you. You witnessed an impressive electric arc and a big power release caused by a short and you're thinking of ways to harness that power.

What we're trying to tell you is that the sparking itself is not a useful form of stored energy - like electricity or heat or chemistry - that you can harness. It was a manifestation of a large release of energy that was once useful, but now is lost as heated wires, heated air, light and so on. It's hard to get the energy back out of those.

If you want to make a spark chamber so you can watch a more-or-less continuous spark, that's a project folks here can help you with. If you want to power a motor and turn a wheel, that's a different project but also one you could find help for here. But "turning a wheel with a spark" just doesn't make sense.

 

Was that the reasoning behind the name?

I was inspector #32 at 4 jobs in a row, so I decided to use a variation of my QC number.

 

Perhaps you could explain why you've mentioned a battery as I did not mention one in regards to creating a spark... Creating a spark gap inside a sterling engine piston should be relatively safe...

Sorry. I was referring to the OP mentioning using a battery in their setup. I did not mean anything against your idea of a sterling engine.

 

Sorry. I was referring to the OP mentioning using a battery in their setup. I did not mean anything against your idea of a sterling engine.

Ah.... that makes sense...

 

I think I understand you. You witnessed an impressive electric arc and a big power release caused by a short and you're thinking of ways to harness that power.

What we're trying to tell you is that the sparking itself is not a useful form of stored energy - like electricity or heat or chemistry - that you can harness. It was a manifestation of a large release of energy that was once useful, but now is lost as heated wires, heated air, light and so on. It's hard to get the energy back out of those.

If you want to make a spark chamber so you can watch a more-or-less continuous spark, that's a project folks here can help you with. If you want to power a motor and turn a wheel, that's a different project but also one you could find help for here. But "turning a wheel with a spark" just doesn't make sense.

heyy everybody i just checked back though i lost hope that anybody would post again .. well THANK YALLLL FOR HELP .. i understand what everybody said but what is not making sense in my head is that your saying that "arc" can not be harnessed but isn't thunders are a form of arc ?! and in thunders there is energy that can be harnessed .. plus using "huge" spark like this coming from "arc" in a chamber would could pressure wouldn't it?
so what im thinking is my idea may not be practical but theoretically it is acceptable.. isn't it ?
so in a spark chamber just like fuel engine i'll use raw chambers not just a single chamber

thanks again people

 

i understand what everybody said but what is not making sense in my head is that your saying that "arc" can not be harnessed but isn't thunders are a form of arc ?! and in thunders there is energy that can be harnessed .. plus using "huge" spark like this coming from "arc" in a chamber would could pressure wouldn't it?

I though thunder was a sound wave. However, Lightening is a form of electrical energy caused by a massive static electrical charge caused by unbalanced charge in the atmosphere. Thunder is a by-product of this event.

Nobody has harnessed lightening due its unpredictability. But you knew that. Plus, it has lethal levels of current and voltage.

Note: "Don't try this at home!"

I think people are trying to tell you is that the "short circuit" is generally considered an error/bad event that a technician/scientist/engineer tries to avoid. A short is lost energy due to a unwanted event. There is more energy to be harness in controlled conditions.

Definition of short circuit, from http://www.thefreedictionary.com/short+circuit

"(Electronics) a faulty or accidental connection between two points of different potential in an electric circuit, bypassing the load and establishing a path of low resistance through which an excessive current can flow. It can cause damage to the components if the circuit is not protected by a fuse"

 

... my idea may not be practical but theoretically it is acceptable.. isn't it ?

It is theoretically possible that the energy released by a spark could be re-captured. A scientist would do this by placing the spark chamber inside a calorimeter, an instrument which can accurately determine the amount of energy released by some event.

What this experiment would show (as predicted by the learnings from hundreds of years of studying the laws of thermodynamics) is that all of the electrical energy bought from the power company, entering the calorimeter and the spark chamber, would show up as a slight temperature rise of the calorimeter. The instrument is calibrated to convert this ∆T to energy.

The energy all shows up as heat, because the sound, light and anything else produced by the spark cannot leave the calorimeter and is ultimately converted to molecular motion. Heat.

Capturing PRACTICAL energy, like electricity from the light or mechanical motion from the sound, would be difficult and give a very low recovery efficiency, but in theory you could get some. Most would still end up as heat, the lowest common denominator of handling energy.