Discussion in 'Physics' started by zulkarnain, May 17, 2008.
who can explain why radio frequency could burn salt water
How do you mean "burn" salt water?
It is no secret that RF and microwaves can heat water and there is an associated super-heating phenomenon, but I'd don't understand the notion of "burning" (which to me implies charring etc) with regards to salt water.
I remember this from last year, but not too many details. He means burn, like an actual flame. I'll remember to look later, see if I can dig something up.
Simple Google search... West Palm Beach, Florida... No wonder I remembered it, not too far away from here. Anyway, you have to put more energy in, then you could hope to generate from the heat. Neat trick, but not sure what it would be good for, but perhaps I just don't understand all the details.
Thanks Harvey, I would be interested in look anything you can dig out.
Like I said above I'm familiar with the underpinning so of microwave (or RF) super-heating, but "burning" is not something I have come across in the traditional sense of the word.
I was under the impression that the microwaves were used to resonate the H20 enough to break them apart, but its still just plain old energy wasting hydrolysis..
I'm unclear on the role of the salt here though.. Is it necessary for auto-combustion? Or necessary to actually have any decent probability of fully severing the water? I can imagine how it assists the process, but is an electrolyte as important under induced RF conditions as it is under DC or AC?
There are quite a few posts on YouTube concerning "Burning Saltwater", and "Saltwater as fuel". Apparently, there is an inventor named John Kanzious (spelling may not be correct) who was working on a couple of inventions at the time when he discovered that he could disassociate H and O from Saltwater using a Radiofrequency generator. One project he was working on was using RF power to desalinate sea water, and another project was using RF power as a means to treat cancerous cells in the body. During his experimentation, he had discovered that he could ignite the gases given off from saltwater while in an RF field. Well, the News Media latched on to that story and turned it into a bunch of ridiculous hype, saying things like "can you imagine burning saltwater in your car instead of gasoline?"! Even Kanzious made a comment during one of the videos where he said, "Imagine a flame like that inside the engine of your car!". Well, of course everyone got all excited over the possibility of "burning saltwater" in your car instead of gasoline. This story took off like skyrockets and now there are tens or maybe even hundreds of YouTube videos claiming that saltwater is a fuel that can replace gasoline. A lot of the hype is propagated by the "Free Energy" quacks who don't understand physics or chemistry. Anyhow, that's where this concept of "burning saltwater" originated.
If you want to get a laugh (or maybe get sick to your stomach) search on key words "Saltwater as fuel" on YouTube. Anyone with even an elementary background in Physics or Chemistry will roll their eyes while watching those videos because of the ludicrous claims that are made. (I sure did!!!)
This sort of thing always happens when something (in this instance water) that doesn't appear to be ignitable subsequently is, and then there is mass-hysteria about it being the solution to the West's oil-dependence. I've read it a million times. Then free-energy goons get in on it telling us we get something for nothing - the energy required to generate the RF will massively out strip that that can be released from the water.
I will have a look at the videos on youtube for my amusement.
Im pretty sure this website could help.. http://auto.howstuffworks.com/salt-water-fuel.htm
From page two of the article:"While the RFG produces a hydrogen flame that burns stably, the amount of energy it puts out is less than the amount of energy needed to power the RFG. In this sense, any energy that comes out of the salt-water flame cannot be considered a source of power. It's just a manifestation of the energy being put into it, only in a lesser amount. This makes it unlikely that the RFG could produce a real, viable source of fuel."
Thats completely true.. but in the 1800's who would imagine that petroleum was really helpful.. who knows if burning salt water would be efficent someday, same as H cars and other variations.
It is possible to get good amounts of energy from any material the problem lays in how feasible or complex is the method needed to produce it. In the future certainly trash and biological waste could be a good source of energy I hope it would be environmentally friendly.
We're never going to make the process more efficient in the future, as the strength of the bonds of the atoms in H2O is well known. On an energy basis, this process is a loser: it takes more energy to break the atomic bonds in water than is produced by burning the resulting hydrogen. On a monetary basis, the process might be feasible if you don't mind using large quantities of cheap energy to produce relatively small quantities of hydrogen. As an example, nuclear-powered submarines use power from their reactors to dissociate seawater to get oxygen for the crew to breathe.
There is a lot of things we don't know and scientists can't explain them.
The people who coin the term "free energy" know what they are talking about. They are scientists.
Yes energy can't be created nor distroyed; however, if you can invent a machine that runs on water you will no longer pay for gas; therefore, you get energy for free."FREE ENERGY".
Let me know where I'm wrong.
Laws of Thermodynamics.
Read them, learn them, try to live without them, you'll starve to death.
There are a lot of things we do know, this is one of them.
People who advocate free energy aren't scientists, their scam artists. Real scientists give clear concise instructions that are easily repeated. So far, all we have are true believers and no scientists.
Water is not a fuel, is the ash from burning hydrogen and oxygen.
If we made hydrogen from solar energy it is free, but that is from the sunlight, the hydrogen is a transport mechanism.